338

Here is more my personal idea of what I want in a $4000 rifle. With a nice scope this would be about $4000.00. It looks to be a bargain.

Does this qualify as a best quality rifle?

This is in reguard to the thread in the Medium Bore Section of the forum about a "Best quality rifle for under $4000.00. I got it in the wrong section I guess.

There can be no doubt of the quality and value with two names like Burgess and Milliron for makers. However, I am not so sure I like the aesthetics of the cheekpiece.

I think that cheekpiece looks fantastic. Sleek, original, and very well integrated.

I could do without the black forearm tip, though. Everybody has one.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
. . . I am not so sure I like the aesthetics of the cheekpiece.

I agree. It's too much like the old, blocky G&H style. Too much of a good thing is not a good thing.

The cheekpiece is classic Milliron. Styles change, but it is well done.

It looks like a fantastic rifle. My only criticism would be the soldered on Sid Bell bear head.

Roger, you are right, that is the only problem i see with this rifle. It is definitely best quality. But I'd have to contact Thos. Burgess for a new floorplate and send it to you to put my monogram and some niceties on it.

Red

The metal work is worth the price of admission. I might even put up with the "art work", but would probably ask Tom if he wouldn't replace the floorplate in that bottom metal assembly.

Chuck

Friends-

First of all, this is one beautiful rifle. So, my comments are like me telling Leonardo Da Vinci how to touch up the Mona Lisa.

However, there are a couple of things I do not like. First, what's with the Redfield scope bases on a $4K rifle; to me that looks cheap? Second, what's with that grip cap with a white looking circle in the middle; the first thought that pops into my head is "Ruger"?

O.K. so I feel like I have committed sacrilege but, these are my comments.

quote:

Originally posted by HP Shooter:
I think that cheekpiece looks fantastic. Sleek, original, and very well integrated.

I could do without the black forearm tip, though. Everybody has one.

Yeah, I like that cheekpiece! Nice rifle-I could force myself to live with the black forend tip!

You bet that's a best-quality rifle! And there's no question that it's also a superb bargain.

Earl Milliron is a gifted and extremely honest man. I've known him for many years, and I've visited him at his home many times. He was "discovered" by Jack O'Connor in the mid-1960s when O'Connor spotted a rifle he'd stocked that was for sale at Portland's 'Norm Thompson' store. Peter Alport was the owner of the store, a good friend of JOC's, and he arranged a meeting between the two. The rest is history, and through the years Earl stocked nine rifles for JOC, and I think all of them featured Tom Burgess metalwork. I've read many of the letters JOC sent to Milliron, and they make for a fascinating journey.

I've owned three rifles stocked by Milliron with Burgess metal, and have seen quite a few others. The quality is uniformly excellent, and fit and finish is as good as today's very best.

Milliron was an extremely meticulous and practical man. He saw himself as a stocker of HUNTING rifles, not safe-queens, and he appointed and finished his stocks accordingly. He almost always used a semi-recessed checkering pattern, either point or fleur-de-lis (mostly point), and two stock patterns: Either a Biesen type 'Classic' pattern, or his favorite, racier 'chinstrap cheekpiece' pattern which he adapted from the late stockmaker, Russ Leonard. The rifle pictured features this stock, and for lighting-fast handling, superb control, and natural pointing, this stock is very tough to beat.

Milliron shot every rifle prior to shipping, and there were no unknowns. They had to shoot or he wasn't happy and would do whatever it took to correct the situation. One time he stocked a rifle in 6mm Rem. with Burgess metalwork and John Warren engraving for Prince Abordezzah Phalavi, of Iran (good ol' days!), and this rifle started out as a reluctant shooter. But after some shooting, tweaking, and load development it turned into an all-star. That's the way Milliron work with every rifle he ever stocked, and the average client was every bit as important to him as his celebrity client. Earl has alwasy been a most humble man, and he never sought out publicity.

Earl also finished his rifles to stand up to anything. He wasn't lost in the mists of jolly ol' London back in the 1930s applying anemic oil finishes that wouldn't keep out the rain. Milliron was an Oregon mule deer and elk hunter, and he knew what sort of weather a stock had to endure at times. So developed and epoxy stock finish that was unbelieveably tough and beautiful, filled the pores perfectly, and wouldn't shrink back with time. It was one of the most innovative and tough stock finishes of all time, looks like hand-rubbed oil, and it remains one of the very best.

I could go on at length, but Milliorn was no ordinary man, not by any stretch of the imagination, and he was one of the world's greatest stockmakers. His work can stand with the best of all time.........

AD

Gentlemen: I was asked about this rifle and without serial it's tough to narrow the search. The stock:
Begats. Bob Owen started the line. "Owen begat the Leonard, and Leonard begat The Milliron." Leonard was a tailgunner on a 29 -part of the flock making the fire run on Tokyo and other places in the vicinity. He was an ace by confirmed reports using the twin .50 . Probably times 3 if there could have been enough confirmation. You would not need "Shrink" credentials to think of him as obsessive/ compulsive where firearms were concerned. When he wasn't out on a run he was shooting trap to improve his lead and drop calculations. This was on Shemya base of the Aleutian chain. Not exactly Club Med for accomodations or weather. Shooting a rifle as you would a shotgun led to his modifications of the Owen style. He easily did better shooting no sights than most hunters could do with the best. When he transferred to the left coast from Spokane he met Earl Milliron. I have not the slightest doubt that he schooled Earl as he did me for that style stock and shooting with it. The both of us dragging our heels and kicking and screaming every inch of the way. Earl glued the wood which became the grip cap on and machined and shaped it as one piece, Same for the forend tip The original black forend tips were Franzite from Sports, Inc of Chicago. The material was much like what some instrument makers use for clarinet bodies. They featured a threaded brass screw molded into the semi shaped end. I turned a lot of these for Leonard to square the meet with the forend which was squared off to the threaded hole jig drilled into the forend. No dowells, pins or the like. Quality of the black material deteriorated about the time Ebony and rose wood became available and I made the same sort of attachment for him using a threaded brass stud. This forend is remindful of those tips.

What this looks like is one started by Leonard, or commissioned by him and stocked by Earl. That white spot in the grip cap is an anomoly. Because of the pasted on floor plate bears head I'm hoping that it wasn't the Poly choke compass someone added. This rifle really says that there was at least a second owner, That his sense of taste and decorum was far less than patrician. The head can be peeled off with a propane torch and if it was also pegged to the plate that can be plugged and hidden without much fuss. Leonard was a manufacturers rep to include Leupold at start. When his company switched to Redfield, well that would be a reason for Redfield bases. I'm sure that a stockman only semi inspired could make the grip cap look like it belonged to the rifle.
The magazine resembles those used by Mauser on what were intended to be 30-06 for the U.S. Trade. It does not seem to have my normal guard bow treatment, rather looks like how they did from Germany . I made several plates to order like this with the rounded corner flush fit to bow rear, but not necessarily in that time frame. It almost looks like a Mauser address logo on the left side wall. If that is so, then I would have cleaned up the action trying to keep as much Mauser as possible. Date? a lot like early '60 s. The O'Connor
article about 1965 (Outdoor Life Mag.)featuring the rifle he had Milliron do for him is quite similar. It could have been a buyers inspiration for duplication, albeit a little later.
For what it is worth that's my take on the rifle.

The pictures are not all that good to see the condition of the metalwork in particular. The stock does have great style however. In a picture editor the stock does seem to have some dents here and there. There is no picture of the grip cap either. I am concerned about whats on the bottom of it.

Put a McMillian on it and what's it worth then if Burgess did not sign it?

The more I look at that stock the more I like it. It's great art. That rifle alone is worth a ride to see it. That seller has other fine stuff as well. If it's where I think it is and you like it then it's not far to Kalispell to have Burgess do the floor plate and put some special mounts on it. Then it may be a five figure gun for half that. I would have to see it.

This Frank Wells beauty is more my style.

If it's where I think it is and you like it then it's not far to Kalispell to have Burgess do the floor plate and put some special mounts on it.

Savage99

I was born in the town the rifle seller is in. If you are going to drive from there to see Mr. Burgess in Kalispell you best pack a few sandwiches for the trip. Some No-doz might be in order if you are going to drive straight through also.

I personally like the styling and lines of this rifle even if some might think the cheekpiece is too blocky. The cheekpiece resembles one style of the pre-64 Winchester 70 "Supergrade" quite a bit. The mounts are also representative for a rifle in the era this one was evidently made. For that reason alone I could live with them with no problem.
I do agree with Scrollcutter that the bear head doesn't add a lot to it though.
If a person was to have system98 change the floorplate a drive to Scrollcutter's would definately be in order and that is not a real long drive.

systeme98, many thanks for your notes on the rifle. I found your entire post most informative and enjoyable.

I like the gun and with a few minor changes it would be outstanding.

If a person was to have system98 change the floorplate a drive to Scrollcutter's would definately be in order and that is not a real long drive.

about 28 minutes for me