I have been selling a few of my surplus guns in an attempt to move up in quality. The supergrade winchesters look very nice. I have also been thinking of a pre 64 model 70 in 30.06 or .270 I had seen one recently at Cabelas (over $900 I believe for .270) but other than that I dont see very many in the shops in central Michigan. Gunbroker had one which nobody bid on.
It seemed rather odd to me but perhaps the starting price was too high. In your opinion am I better off to keep looking at the shops and shows or is the internet a good place to find a fair deal on a pre 64?

http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=10416390

Mike - You should find a lot more 30-06 M70's for sale than 270's, because a lot more were made. Because of this, those in 30-06 should sell for less. As for buying on the internet, I do it but you need to educate yourself on the pre-64 M70 first. Then ask the seller a LOT of questions. Even then, auctions are tricky. I missed out on a 3-digit M70 by $15 due to inexperienced bidding.

The GunBroker link is interesting. The first (top) picture is of a different gun and not even a M70! I would say the 1951 270 described should have gone for $675 to $725.

Mike

I would stick to the gunshows where you can look and feel the guns. You can also meet the seller and get a better idea of his integrity.

As for prices, I think they vary around the country. I bought a pre war 06 last weekend at a local gunshow for $450. There were several pre 64s for under $650.

I just looked at the pictures and I wonder where that rifle lists for $1200? In New Zealand?

[ 07-24-2003, 07:35: Message edited by: Mickey1 ]

Thanks guys. I appreciate your input. I will check out a couple of the guns shows here in Michigan. I spoke with a buddy up north and he did say there are nearly always a couple going for around $600 at the upper penninsula shows. Mike

You don't say what you want a pre 64 Supergrade for? While they are superior in workmanship their value as collectors has kept the price very high in terms of a hunting rifle. Keep in mind that the safeties are difficult to use with a scope, most are not drilled and tapped for scopes, the drop at the comb is wrong also. M 70's from even the 60's came with steel butt plates also!

I don't have one for the above reasons. I have been offered them and one comes my way every few years and I turn it down. Now if I were of the mind to turn one into a custom rifle and get the safety changed, tapped etc. it would be a fantastic rifle. I couldn't do that to one however.

The advice above to go to shows and handle them is very good. I would not buy one mailorder as there are so many "made up" rifles. Just one hint of what I am getting at is that an old club memeber who worked at Winchester for many years offered me a super grade floorplate. And so it goes.

Beware.

Mike27: I have been trading and collecting pre-64 Model 70's for 38 years now! I love them! I have been Hunting with them for even longer! I heartily recommend them for both Hunting and collecting!
I have several pre-64 Winchesters Model 70's in calibers 30/06 and 270 Winchester - including Supergrades, Featherweights, Standard Rifles and a Gopher Special! The 270 caliber will be somewhat more expensive than the 30/06. 270's in collectors condition are somewhat rare as they all got used! Hunted with - and the resulting wear and tear and modifications make the 270 collector Rifle hard to find. I have a 270 standard weight Rifle that is new and unfired with the hang tags. I take it out and rub it now and then!
I also have a pre-64 Model 70 standard Rifle that has killed so much Big Game of all types that I retired it several years ago! I have never Hunted with or seen a safer more reliable firearm than the pre-64 Model 70's! I have used many, many of them and still use them to this day. For my main go to Big Game Rifle these days I had a custom 280 Remington calibered Rifle made on a pre-64 Model 70 action. The action was made the same month I was born (July 1947)! Not only is this Rifle safe, reliable and accurate - it is beautiful! Not only that it holds 6 rounds of 280 ammunition! The pre-64 Model 70 is truly the "Riflemans Rifle"!
I would suggest this - befriend a Model 70 collector who will advise you upon the originality of a particular Rifle! Gunsmiths often harbor an interest in and admiration of the old Model 70's! They have been a great source of info and insight in my long learning process regarding the Model 70!
Over the years the Model 70's in 270 and 30/06 I have shot have all been quite accurate!
I took your posting and inquiry to mean you were interested in the modern manufacture of Supergrade Model 70's OR a pre-64 Model 70! I would not recommend Hunting with a pre-64 Model 70 Supergrade - their inherent value would make that a poor decision in my opinion!
I have bought a few Rifles through the mail in the past and have had only iffy results - I much prefer to travel and look at Rifles in person!
Let me know if I can help you in any way with questions on a pre-64 Model 70 Hunting Rifle in 30/06 or 270!
Good luck!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Varmintguy,

Your post made my palms sweaty.

Mike I would strongly disagree with Savage 99 and whole heartdly agree with Varmint guy. I have all the featerweights with the exception of a 264. I hunt with my M70's and will work up a load for a 358FWT for Elk this fall in Colorado. Roger Rules book on the M70 will provide you with a wealth of good information. The title is The Rifelmans Rifle.

Varmintguy,

What have you found with the pre-'64 M70 rifles in .375 H&H?

thanks...jim dodd

VarmintGuy you are correct. I was talking about the current supergrade or a pre 64 standard.
I am looking for that one good solid rifle that will be my main "go to" gun for deer and antelope. I am trying to build a 4 or 5 big game gun battery that I will be happy with for the rest of my days. I currently have the following:

Remington 700 BDL in 350 Mag (1969 year) topped with Talley QD and Leupold M8 - 4X (I absolutely love the look and feel of this rifle)

Savage 110 .243 Standard package gun (my coyote gun but used it as my backup gun on a whitetail last year after tripping and falling with my rem 700 on a logging road)

Sig Shr 970 in .270 with Talley fixed mounts and Leupold VX 1 3x9 (this years antelope gun for the Thunder Basin National Grasslands)

1903 Springfield sporterized 30.06 (original barrel that looks bad on the outside but very accurate. I have been debating whether its worth it to rebarrel)

Savage 99 EG in 300 savage (for those times Im feeling nostalgic)

I like the looks of the mod 70 featherweight. Nice styling and great looking wood. The current supergrades look great also and are realistically in my price range. However I have read so many good things about the pre - 64s on this site that it sounds like they are practically a custom built rifle. Take care guys. Thanks. Mike

HunterJim: I have two of them but never shot either of mine and have shot a couple others but just a shot at a time! They are holding value real well and I see them occassionally at Gunshows.
Even though I am a large person (6'3" 260 pounds) I am very - not recoil shy - but sensitive to developing long lived flinches after using the big boomers! Both of my 375's are minty Guns and will stay that way I won't be shooting them! I had a 458 Supergrade (they were all Supergrades) and sold it for $750.00 as I recall years ago. That was before the general public knew how VERY rare they were! Now they are 5 times that for nice ones. I am without one now and probably won't be adding one to my collection any time soon!
I am originally from the Seattle are and the 375's were real popular there as lots of guys went to Alaska for Bears from there.

Mike27: Be sure and take a Varmint Rifle with you to the Thunder Basin! Great Varminting there! Yeah I have used the pre-64 Model 70 270 on Antelope and it worked great for me! I hope you can find one out Michigan way and it will work for Whitetails for you. I have taken Whitetails with mine anyway!
More later
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I saw a Model 70 standard in 30-06 for $375 on consignment at a local shop. It was in VERY nice condition. It hurt not having the cash on hand. The week after it was gone....

VarmintGuy,

I would really love to find a high condition Pre-64 M70 Supergrade in 30-06. It would have to be made after 1955 and include a jeweled bolt and a Monte Carlo stock.

Would you happen to have one for sale or know of one?

Thanks.

Tim

Shumba How about a very nice supergrade in 7MM mauser? Avery hard to find calibre.

Rich,

Funny you mentioned that. I have a line on one out here in California but have not found the time to make the 5 hour round trip drive to go see it.

Now, most of the 7mm Mausers were made prior to 1955. Does the Supergrade you mentioned have the Monte Carlo stock and jeweled bolt? If so, what is the price (you can send me a PM or email if you prefer).

Thanks.

Tim

SAvage 99 has pre war M-70' and pre 64 mod 70's confused...pre 64 Mod 70's have side swing forward 3 pos safties and they are drilled and tapped...Pre war guns are not.

$900 for a pre 64 or pre war Mod 70 Super Grade in 270 caliber is a darn good deal if the gun is in 90% or better shape....

A pre 64 action alone is worth $400 to $450...A hundred or so more for a Magnum.

I have a .308 M-70 Fwt. pre 64 for sale for $550 if that interrest you or anyone...Its a shooter that has been drilled and tapped for a side mount and plugged..the stock is short, glass bedded and is a shooter....In excellent condition it would fetch $850 minimum...it shoots 1" groups.

I recently acquired a Pre'64(1960) Model 70 Featherweight in 270.Not a collector grade rifle but in decent condition.Mine does not have a front site,nor any holes.Barrel is 22" so I know the site holes were not "cut off".I was told by the seller that this was a factory option.Now..why would someone want a rifle without a front site when it has a rear site? I could see the other way around, if you wanted to put a reciever site on it.Is this a rare occurance?Wish I'd kept the first Pre'64 I owned,..a 300 Win Mag,1963 only....

Mike- my advise would be: -get a pre-64.

Why: -the rifleman's rifle -they really are a good gun -a new one costs just as much, and is worth 1/2 as much once you walk out of the store...enough rambling.

E-Bay is full of vintage scopes and mounts. I am constantly amazed every time I look there.

Some prices: standard grade(standard calibres)
$450-$750
(magnum calibres) $550-$1000
The above depends upon condition, and calibre. In any calibre other than -06, or 270, expect to add at least 20%. Any extra holes place the rifle in the $500 territory IMHO. Even a piece of crap(as long as the action is good)is worth $400. Supergrades start much higher.

I was always going to buy a couple of M54's, but prices have gone up there too. Time passed me by.

Get to know the Winchester M70 well before you spend, and you will be happy for decades to come.