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military mauser pressure proof test?
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Hi
I recall that I have read somewhere that original millitary m98 actions had been tested at 57000 psi and their working pressure should be kept at max 50000 psi. a little look in reloading manuells shows that some magnum and the new line of short fat rounds have a working pressure of 63000 psi .It is far higher than the proof test on old mausers!!
where can i find information concerning commercial mauser 98 copies like FN ,Mark x Parker Hale and the other crf actions like dakota win m70 and mrc etc? are they also tested at 57000 psi? i am intersted in 376 styre and it has 63000 psi working pressure styre says they have tested their own rifles at 140000 psi.
regards
danny
 
Posts: 1127 | Location: Sweden | Registered: 19 June 2000Reply With Quote
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Proof testing doesn't tell you *anything* about how a gun with stand up under continuous use and whether (and how fast) it will develop locking lug setback.

Carcano
 
Posts: 2452 | Location: Old Europe | Registered: 23 June 2001Reply With Quote
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Hi carcano
As far as using of standard calibers like 3006 8x57 etc, it would be no problem ,but the new line of high intensity cartidges may cause problem in older actions. the proof test is for insurance and kind yard stick which an action can withstand a some amount of pressure before giving up. i can't see any other way to see if an action is suitable for conversion or not1
regards
danny
 
Posts: 1127 | Location: Sweden | Registered: 19 June 2000Reply With Quote
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Quote:

i can't see any other way to see if an action is suitable for conversion or not1




AB-SO-LU-TE-LY not.
Was that clear enough ?

Proofing shows whether there were material flaws in the metal. It does not prove anything with regard to the - very reasonable - question you have pondered.

The only answer to it comes from metallurgical testing, and from comparatively analysis of other actions. I do consider the classical case-hardened Mauser M 98 actions as not suitable for continuous use with anything that goes more than a bit beyond the 8x57 IS / .30-06 pressure levels. So do some others.
YMMV.

Carcano
 
Posts: 2452 | Location: Old Europe | Registered: 23 June 2001Reply With Quote
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There is some incongruity here. A rilfe that was proofed in say, 1930 was proofed at maybe 57,000 P.S.I. by the copper crusher method. This was later caller the Copper Units of pressure (C.U.P.) but the figures were the same. So a 30-06 that had once been considered to be safe at 48,000 P.S.I. or later 48,000 C.U.P. is now safe at 51.600 P.S.I. using the Piezo-Electric system of measurement? Some loads in the latest Lyman manual (#48) show loads as high as 58,100 P.S.I. using the P.E. system.
The H.P. White lab, for instance, has shown that those old 1916 Spanish Mausers are safe with current .308 Win./7.62 NATO ammo. Who'd have known? Yet, I have seen one that was customized by a well know company into a neat little 7x57 sporter let go using factory ammo. Go figure. I'm not sure I'd build up some hot caliber on a military Mauser, not because I fear the strength if the action, but rather I'd prefer to make it in one of the truly classic cartridges.
My Oberndorf is a .35 Whelen. My 1912 Steyr is a .308 Win and my FN is in 7x57. Still haven't decided what my next 1912 Steyr action will be, but I'm leaning towards a .358 Win.
Paul B.
 
Posts: 2814 | Location: Tucson AZ USA | Registered: 11 May 2001Reply With Quote
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Danny Pay,
I don't know the situation in Sweden, but if you can, get a $50 surplus '98 Mauser and try every thing you can think of to blow it up in an incremental work up.
Try to achieve some kind of metal fatigue.
If you are afraid to get close, use a trigger string.

Keep measuring the head space.
Keep looking for set back.
If you get any, plot quantity of set back vs number of overload rounds fired.

Bring a cleaning rod and a hammer, because the cases and bolts get struck.


picture of a case the was so stuck it ripped off the rim when I jumped on the bolt

When the process is done, you will have gained first hand knowledge about the strength of the action.

--
A society that teaches evolution as fact will breed a generation of atheists that will destroy the society. It is Darwinian.
 
Posts: 2249 | Registered: 27 February 2001Reply With Quote
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So a 30-06 that had once been considered to be safe at 48,000 P.S.I. or later 48,000 C.U.P. is now safe at 51.600 P.S.I. using the Piezo-Electric system of measurement?




Yes. Same pressure.

Quote:

The H.P. White lab, for instance, has shown that those old 1916 Spanish Mausers are safe with current .308 Win./7.62 NATO ammo.




No. They haven't shown so. Most definitely NOT.

Carcano
 
Posts: 2452 | Location: Old Europe | Registered: 23 June 2001Reply With Quote
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