I am looking for a lightweight, stable, well shaped synthetic stock for a blind magazine M98 mountain rifle project I have going. I have been making wood stocks for some time but recognize their limitations for harsh, extended backpack hunts and want one synthetic/light rifle to go to in those situations. I am thinking of purchasing the stock blank and inletting and finishing it myself. Cost is a consideration.

Can members please give me input about the various makers/products available?

The options I’ve looked at are:
Brown’s fiberglass and Kevlar blanks:
$335 fiberglass/graphite, 21 oz.
$450 fiberglass/Kevlar, 16 oz.

Borden rimrock:
$195 fiberglass, 26 oz.

Bell and Carlson:
$160 fiberglass, 28 oz(?)

Others????

All help and recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

Try Bansner's High tech stocks. I have used them and they are excellent stocks. Blanks run about $200.

Yes, I’ll give you three choices;

1. McMillan

2. McMillan

3. McMillan

Oh, and if none of those works out try McMillan.

Snow Cat, since your criteria is a lightweight 98, McMillan is out.

The lightest for the money would be the Bansner.

My favorite is the Borden Rimrock. It'll be a couple of ounces heavier than the Bansner but it's a truly wonderful stock made by good folks.

I bought two Rimrock blanks last year for M-70's, and one arrived 32 oz and the other (identical) weighed 36 ounces. Make sure you let them know you are looking for light weight, since they are built per order.

They are very nice stocks if the tight pistol grip suits you.

When I ordered I was told that they could not do a blind magazine, because the inletting is molded, not machined like a McMillan. However that may only apply to M-70's.

The Bansners are around 25-26 oz with pad/bedding/paint, and they will make a blind magazine on order.

Brad,

If he is going to buy a blank and do the inletting himself why is McMillan “out.â€

Rick, he wants a lightweight. My Bansner goes 25 oz's with pad, paint and swivel studs. A Mc will go 32-36 oz's. Mc's are great stocks, just not very light.

Freeminer, that's a bummer.

The last two Borden's I got were finished right at 31 oz's. That was with pad, studs and molded in finish. The molded in finish usually adds 2-3 oz's over the painted Rimrock.

I have a Hogue OverMolded stock that I'm pretty happy with.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad:
Rick, he wants a lightweight. My Bansner goes 25 oz's with pad, paint and swivel studs. A Mc will go 32-36 oz's. Mc's are great stocks, just not very light.

McMillan has ultra-light stocks that are in the 21 to 26 oz weight range. Check their web site.

Rick, last time I checked they didn't make one for a 98... could be wrong. Also, they use a 1/2" pad to get a low weight. Nice stock but I prefer a Rimrock.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad:
Rick, last time I checked they didn't make one for a 98... could be wrong. Also, they use a 1/2" pad to get a low weight. Nice stock but I prefer a Rimrock.

Brad,

Their blanks can be inletted to fit just about anything. McMillan’s policy (which is a smart one) is that because of the vast differences in FN/98 type rifles and bottom metal they only offer 95% inletted stocks for these models and do not offer “drop-ins.â€

My only point was that McMillan shouldn’t be tossed out of the mix just because of weight.

Thanks to all---

I am now really considering the Bansner. Weight is right, great reviews here and on other threads, same price (less than Mac) and they offer a 98 blind mag standard. I also like the fact that it looks like it has a more open grip than some others.

One more question, what is the lightest recoil pad? I am not very recoil sensitive---its only a 375 Whelen AI and I'm currently shooting it with a steel plate. If my scale is right, the Bansner should bring it in all up around 7# (no mag box or bottom metal, aluminum trigger guard).

Thanks again!

Buy a Rimrock...you will not be disappointed. If 5 oz of weight is of concern put in 10 more minutes on the treadmill.

Snowcat, the lightest "actual" recoil pad (as opposed to a truck tire) is the .80" Decelerator. It's what I have on my Bansner 30-06.

Yup, Freeminer got a Rimrock that was a tad heavy, so, it now resides on my P-64 Mod. 70 Alaskan in .375 H&H. The rifle, with Leupy QRWs and a Leupy 1.75x6 HD. is just about right, it goes a hair under ten lbs. all up and lighter .375s ain't fun!

I have tried about every sunthetic stock and right now, I like the Rimrocks for my magnums and the Bansners for standard rounds. For anything on an .'06 case, I would go with the Bansner as B.C. mountains are steep and I am getting to be a geezer.

Snowcat:
How are you getting around the magazine box in the blind magazine stock? Just using a spring and follower?

Interested in how your project turns out. I have a Bansner that goes 25oz too, all up with a "Terminator" pad (3/4" with the plate.) on a 98. Thinking the same stock in a blind mag with an aluminum box would shave 5 oz.

I tried talking my way into some titanium bottom metal for a lightweight 98 but no luck.

The only issue I have with the military actions is the amount of scope tube you need to bridge across the clip slot--and you end up with a heavier scope or some kind of nasty ring extension.

quote:

Originally posted by Rick 0311:
Yes, I’ll give you three choices;

1. McMillan

2. McMillan

3. McMillan

Oh, and if none of those works out try McMillan.

You bet.

Roland

What manly men we have here!

Is it just me, or are allot of people making a really huge deal over a very miniscule amount of weight? If the weight of a steel magazine box is too much for you perhaps some extra time in the gym would help out.

What are you going to do with the deer you shoot...eat it where it falls, raw, because the wood for a fire was too heavy to carry over to it?

Geez, guys...cowboy up!

Wait until you are psuhing 60 and then try hunting alone in the B.C. mountains with a .338 and multi-day pack that contains the emergency gear that you MUST have here. Then, we will see what you think about rifle weight.....believe me, by the third day of pushing through Buckbrush, Devil's Club and Swamp Spruce as thick as pussy hair, just to get close to where you HOPE the game might be, you will curse every extra ounce you carry!

Well, I'm 44 and in very good shape. BUT, I dislike any rifle for elk hunting the mountains over 8.5 lbs. Cowboy up? Forget it... a LOT cowboys are hardhead's, suffer needlessly for tradition and could stand to learn a new trick or two

The man said he wanted to build a "lightweight M98"... since those are HIS PARAMETERS I tried to answer accordingly rather than be a salesman for a favored brand. The Bansner will get him to his goal more cost effectively and easier than any other brand out there.

Course, I never understand threads that start off with, "I want to buy a 270" and end up at response number seven with an argument why the 338 WM will fit the guy's needs better...

Look Rick, weight is a big deal particularly if 50 is behind you, the future cloudy, and your backpack already is pre-loaded with permanent moving part damage resulting from mishaps or misdeeds over the course of a few decades of being hardheaded and shortsighted.

If you are like me, too stupid to pay for a guide, handholding, and ponyride, then every ounce counts.

Guys,

I’m 59 years old and have spent a fair amount of time on foot, so don’t think you’re the only ones that have ever had to carry a rifle over rough ground for long periods of time.

Like I said, if the weight of the mag box in your rifle will make or break your little jaunt into the country then perhaps you should consider less stressful activities for a hobby.

Rick, maybe you're just thick or maybe a former cowboy (or both) but when a guy wants a light rifle and ask's question's related to that end who are you to pile-drive your agenda?

I'll bet you've never backpacked in the Rocky Mountain's with a heavy pack AND A RIFLE...

PS Snowcat, good luck with the project... let us know how it turns out.

Later...

quote:

Originally posted by Brad:
Rick, maybe you're just thick or maybe a former cowboy (or both) but when a guy wants a light rifle and ask's question's related to that end who are you to pile-drive your agenda?

I'll bet you've never backpacked in the Rocky Mountain's with a heavy pack AND A RIFLE...

Brad,

Are you guys so vain, or insecure, that you truly believe that you are the only people that have ever set foot outside of a city, or carried anything heavier than a wallet and a cell phone?

I’ve lived in Montana and also in Utah...and also spent a bit of time in Alaska. I also humped up and down mountains in SE Asia for quite awhile carrying 80 pound loads day and night, so yes...I know what heavy loads feel like when you’re on foot.

If you guys want to save weight why not leave your computers at home? For people that spend so much time “living in the wilderness†you sure seem to log onto the internet an awful lot??????? Plugging into “currant†bushes, perhaps?

What is it about YOU that allows you to interject your agenda into another guys thread... and you talk about insecure, give me a break.

I'm done. You have the last word, it's apparently what you're good at...

brad,

Interject MY agenda?????

The originator of this thread asked about synthetic stocks. Then you Davy Crockett types introduced the topic of “heavy†mag boxes, and aluminum or titanium trigger guards to save weight.

Get over yourself...and do some more push ups.

Rick:
I'm the one talking about the aluminum boxes and titanium, not Brad. I am interested in what Snowcat is doing and how he is doing it--that interest originated with another thread.

If you have a beef with me just send me a PM.

Rick, if your remarks are directed at me, I would suggest that you spend much more time here than I do, but, if you want to be a jerk, suit yourself. I am not a poser and I do not exaggerate my past life in order to either boast or gather accolades. So, your comments simply say something about who you are and do not add to the discussion at all.

quote:

Originally posted by tomk:
Rick:
I'm the one talking about the aluminum boxes and titanium, not Brad. I am interested in what Snowcat is doing and how he is doing it--that interest originated with another thread.

If you have a beef with me just send me a PM.

tomk,

I don’t have a “beef†with anyone...I just found all this talk about the excessive weight of a steel mag box, paint versus molded in color, or the difference in weight between a ½“ recoil pad and a ¾†recoil pad pretty funny coming from a bunch of self proclaimed “bushmen†and hunters of dangerous game.

What’s the next piece of advice...don’t use 8x40 scope base screws because they are so much heavier than 6x48’s?

quote:

Originally posted by kutenay:
Rick, if your remarks are directed at me, I would suggest that you spend much more time here than I do, but, if you want to be a jerk, suit yourself. I am not a poser and I do not exaggerate my past life in order to either boast or gather accolades. So, your comments simply say something about who you are and do not add to the discussion at all.

kutenay,

You are so full of crap! You NEVER stop commenting/boasting on your past and present life.

Every post of yours that I have ever read always contains at least one reference to your self proclaimed “greatness†as a woodsman and hunter of dangerous game...and your years of living alone in the “wilds of BC“ where mere mortals such as the rest of us would quickly perish or kill ourselves out of fear.

To hear you talk you are the only man alive that has ever spent the night outside and farther than 100 feet from a paved road, a Holiday Inn and room service.

I have actually always thought that you were a pretty good guy, but, it seems that your life in the wilds of California has embittered you, too bad....

First off—thanks to all for the great advice (on stock choices), based on that I’ve decided to go with the Bansner (which I hadn’t considered before.)

I shouldn’t, I know, but here’s my response to those (10at6 and Rick) who suggest that I’m some kind of weak sister because I want to make a light mountain rifle.

My last several bulls have been taken on backpack hunts into the Bob Marshall Wilderness. I pack for at least a week although I have been fortunate enough to have killed them in less time than that. I have spent the majority of my working life working in the woods, much of it in the backcountry and would bet that I can (and have) hike with the most fit men out there. I killed this years’ bull 13 miles in after having covered more than 40 miles getting there. I have horses and get them when the game is down, not before.

My current elk rifle is a beautiful custom 330 Dakota with nice walnut, #4 Lilja, MRC etc. It shoots great but comes in at 10.5# all up. You simply begin to resent the extra 3-4 pounds in both carrying and handling after a week in the woods. Also I thrashed the wood on this latest hunt and decided to get something lighter/more durable put together for next year’s hunt.

I have a rifle I like but wanted to lighten it up (thus the thread). The bottom metal weighs exactly .5 #, why not get rid of it for a blind mag? Another synth stock and heavier recoil pad might add .5 – 1.5 additional pounds. Again, the point was to make a light handy gun, if I have the option, why not? I am clearly capable of carrying any gun into the wilderness and killing elk, I resent the implication that, because I choose to carry a gun that is lighter (or use Gore-tex, or a camp stove, or whatever), that I’m some kind of sniveling wimp. You don’t know me and you certainly haven’t hunted with me.


To the fellow who asked about a blind mag conversion—I’ve seen them done so know that they’re possible---Bansner’s actually sells a blind mag 98 stock. I plan to put a thin aluminum plate on the front of the mag box to keep it from getting dinged by the bullet tips during recoil. I may also make a cerro cast of a 98 box and see how close the stock box is. If it doesn’t feed well (I bet it will without modification) I may make the stock box smaller than specs by building it up with fiberglass cloth/resin and reinletting it to the cerro cast of a factory box, this should be perfect (in theory). I plan to use one of the aluminum (black) Remington triggerguards available from Brownells and pillar bed the front screw. Should come in around 7 pounds.

Thanks again to all for the constructive help.

This sounds like a very good plan to me, I also have a very beautiful Dakota in .338 with a gorgeous stock. I last used it on a backpack hunt for Elk in Gatho Cr. in northern B.C. and it got beat because this is very remote country where it was snowing/sleeting/raining at the beginning of Sept.

During the 5 days I was there, 8 separate Grizzlies came around as they "know" that hunter activity means gut piles and since attacks on humters are quite common in that area, a light, handy, powerful and reliable rifle is a really nice thing to have with you. Your project is EXACTLY what I would choose and I am doing something similar after Xmas.

Like you, I worked in the "weeds" for many years and I use Gore-Tex, backpacking stoves and so forth. I got tired of cooking over campfires in pounding rain about the time I realized that hunting is for fun, it is not some kind of longcock contest, those are best left to "Hollywood hunters".

Keep us informed on this as these are the rifles that interest serious mountain hunters most, IMHO.

Ditto that Kute. I'm not one to lay suffering on the altar of tradition... backcountry hunting is tough enough.

Thanks for that Snowcat. I imagine the folks at Bansner gave some thought to it, too.

I gave a Mex box to a friend who said he will try to duplicate one out of aluminum for me. I don't mind a blind mag as long as it has a 3 pos. safety.

Would appreciate knowing if she feeds well w/o modification.

Based on feel of the stock I would go with the Rimrock . Mcmillans feel like clubs in comparison.

Kutenay:
8 in 5 days sounds like a long hike or an infestation.

snowcat, I've seen a blind mag done on a 300 wby Mark X action and Brown Precision stock (Frank B's rifle if you remember Kutenay).

They used a Rem 700 BDL box that they 'massaged' to fit, and then fitted a flat piece of aluminum to sit in the floor and give them something to affix the follower spring.

the first go-around, they used too small an escutcheon, and it broke loose under recoil and they re-did it by hogging out a bunch of material around it, laying up fiberglass to form a pocket, and then bedding the escutcheon and pillar together.

You didn't mention caliber, but if it was me, and in a standard length cartridge, I'd just buy a cheap alloy mauser floorplate/mag assembly and cut the magazine box off, then permanently bed it into the mag well