Can't find any good forums to find reviews on bench vises, so I thought I would ask in the Gunsmithing section. Seems appropriate.

I would appreciate suggestions / feedback about good brands of bench vises to buy. It is tough finding vises made in the US that are affordably priced for the casual user. Also any suggestions about the size?
Thanks.

I never could figure out how in the heck Wilton can charge several hunderd dollars for a vise, and now I have 2 of them...

If this is your first vise, I'd suggest getting a chinese one 5 inches or bigger. Actually, I should say you should plan on getting a 7 inch vise, and go down to 5 inches if you absolutely have to. Cheap vises work just fine but they are usually weaker than good quality ones, but if you go up a size or two it will still be cheaper and now probably stronger too. Also, buying used is OK, and you can get replacement jaw pads, they are usually buggered on old vises anyway. Also, if you clean and oil them they work a lot better, no matter who made it.

Hope this helps.

Mark

Check out the Gunsmithing Vise sold by New England Custom Gun. Expensive but these will do it all:
http://www.newenglandcustomgun.com/

For general gunwork it is hard to beat the old versa-vise. The only problem is they are no longer made. You can buy US made copy from Brownells for a large chunk of change or check out the prices at Woodworker's Supply
The Parrot vise (import copy of the versa vise) around $50 and the Patternmaker's vise that NECG sells for $319 is $95 at W/Supply (missing the support arm NECG adds on the side).

I have two origional versa-vises that I would not part with and would like to buy a Parrot vise for my other bench. These vises are NOT to be used for beating Ujoints out of an old Chevy As they have cast iron jaws and aren't made for use with a 3# hammer, but they can't be beat for gunwork. I also have a big 5" chinese vise for use with my 3# Hammer......... Wish I had a $350 swivel base Wilton instead.
gunmaker

Garrett Wade tools (www.garrettwade.com) carries a "true" pattern makers vice patterned after the old Emmerts model (made in Asia, though). It ain't cheap either ($227.50) but these suckers are great for people doing stock work or anything else where you need to rotate your work piece around without the hassle of clamping and unclamping.

Rick

I have 2 Wiltons, two quck acting bench vices on the corners of my bench, a Versa vice (they are wonderful), a chinese $50 vice and Kimball Vice that Keesey Kimball developed for stockmakers. It is an absolute gem. I also have a Bisley Rifle Vice by A.G. Parker Birmingham (all cast into the wheel that tightens the jaws. One side of that vice has two concave surfaces padded with felt to hold a barrel and the opposite side has two parallel standard jaws. It can swivel in a most unique way.

Here is the kimball vice. It is all stainless and the pivot at the upright is split and acts like a ball swivel. The inner pad is on a post and swivels to fit the shape in it. When you loosen the inner nut with the lever you can move the whole arrangement further out or up and down, etc.

I bought a Chinese 5" vice from Sams club 3 years ago, for $37. It has withstood some heavy duty FAL building.

Versa Vice

The new green American copies [Multi Vice] at Brownell's are expensive.

The new red copies made in Asia are cheap.

I got an old American red original for free.





It has some features:

1) The swivel sinches up tight when the vice jaws are tightened with the handle.

2) It has a sideways hole for the swivel post. The swivel post is mounted to the bench, and the rest of the vice is free to be lifted up, when the jaws are loose.

I have a Brownells vice and the swivel feature is really great...except that until the jaws tighten down all the way the SOB swivels around all over the place while you are turning the handle.

I drilled and tapped the housing for a three-eighth's bolt that will hold the shaft for those times when you do not want the head swiveling around.

I bought mine from Sears...no swivel feature but it is a 6" model and built like a tank.....and it was around $100..

Thank you for the replies and suggestions. It is frustrating to know that I can't afford something as simple as a vise made in the USA. Guess the safe route is to buy something else made in China. Well I will at least mark my records to allocate the money saved into buying a US made gun!

If all the workers in the USA (including all of us) agreed to work for $5.00 a week maybe the cost of "made in the USA" products would be less...but then who here could afford to buy them?

It's funny how everyone screams about US jobs being outsourced to other countres while at the same time screaming that US made products cost too much.

How each person decides to spend their own money is no one else's business...but you can't have livable wages for US workers and produce a product that can compete in price with a foreign made product produced by workers in countries with a cost of living that is a tenth (or less) than what it is in the USA.

As with most things in life our views on such things tend to be influenced allot by whose ox is being gored.

Rick

Rick,

To me the problem is not that the labor is such a major percentage of an item, but rather all the associated government fees and taxes that raise the prices so much.

There's more to it than just the labor. Almost all the parts in a Wilton are forged from alloyed steel. Most of the parts in cheap imports whether from China or India are cast steel and in some non-critical places cast iron to keep the parts cheap. That's why they're so much weaker.

You can also check out: www.golmatic.de for his "bisley type" vices.



Erik D.

Tigger,

I agree with you on the quality part, but in addition to that it still costs more to make, otherwise we'd be over run with $9.99 made in USA vises, and they aren't there that I can see.

Not wanting to start an argument but it just irks me that so many economic things are blamed on the workers salaries rather than what costs the Gov't adds to doing business.

Point taken.

I served for eight years on the national board of the Screen Actors Guild...and I am also a member of the Directors Guild...I'm a "union" worker and have been for over thrity years.

I totally agree with you about the government induced cost of doing business in this country...but it also is a fact that the cost of labor is a prime reason companies ship jobs overseas.

I work in the movie business and Canada, Australia, and Eastern Europe have been killing us for years now because their labor costs are so much lower and their governments provide tax incentives and cash subsidies to producers who shoot there.

About the only difference in the movie business is the unique aspect where the cost of producing the product has absolutely no connection to the price charged for the product at theaters or when buying DVD's or video cassettes.

Despite the added cost I will always try my best to buy products made in the USA first.

Rick

I have been buying tools from ENCO that are imported, and they keep getting better.
The third world seems to be learning metalworking.

ErikD,
That is the Bisley Rifle vice that I mentioned. Mine attaches differently and is 50+ years old but otherwise the same critter.

Netwarren,

Look around at the junk stores and at old shop,s going out of business. I have bought 3 Wilton's in very good condition over the years. Two were bought for $10 each and one for $5. I recently bought a small Wilton machinist vise (2 1/2) for $10. Degreased and put new grease inside for a better vise than any of the imports. I'm always looking for a bargain.

Wilton makes several lines of vises other than their expensive "Tradesman" line. I bought a new 6" bench vise on e-Bay for about $85, and it is much better than any similarly priced import. You can get an idea how strong a bench vise is by the length of the handle. The handle in my Wilton is 2 1/2 times the length of the handle of my Chinese vise.

I broke a number of large cast iron vices trying to pinch barrels between oak, before I made a barrel vice.

For a bench vice, I now have a Columbian that I got from Boeing Surplus, with bench, for $50.

I have been at machinist auctions where Wiltons went for alot of money.

I did get a Kurt mill vice for $75 at auction [they usually go for $175 at auction], but then I got in trouble for laughing.

Thanks for the information Glen71 about other lines / categories of vises to look at.

To quote rick0311 "despite the added cost I will always try my best to buy products made in the USA first."

This is exactly what I am trying to do. But I would use a vise 1 to 2 times a week at best, so it did not seem economically sound to spend $200+

My dad was union, so I got to see a little about labor growing up. We both look a little harder for American made. But I also know that many things today are machined via a computer or robot machine even here in the US. So I don't believe that the entire argument can be labor based.

Never said it was "entirely" labor based. The cost of labor is but "one" of the factors involved in outsourcing of jobs...but for some companies it is a BIG one.

Depending on the intended use and the frequency used just about any vice that will hold the work piece will work just fine. My experience with tools over the last 40 or so years has convinced me that purchasing the best possible tool I can afford will always pay off in the long run when that tool is going to be useed on expensive things like firearms.

However, with the exception of removing and installing barrels I can't really think of many gun working tasks that require a bench vice that can withstand a ton of torque or repeated blows from heavy hammers.

On the reverse side...I have a small clamp on bench vice that I have used for years on smaller parts and I think I might have spent $10 bucks for it at a garage sale. I wouldn't try to hold a barreled action with it...but for holding triggers and sears and other small parts it works just as well as the more expensive ones.

When you start working on lots of guns you will normally find out real quick what you need and don't need in the way of tools and shop equipment.

Rick

.... like fram filters says... " You can pay me now or you pay me later."

rick, points taken. I also agree with your statement about getting the best tool when possible. I try to follow that on things I know will get used often and have not been let down yet.....except with a new Beretta O/U but that is a different story.

Back in the early 1960's a company...and I believe it was Fram...came out with an oil filter for cars that used a roll of toilet paper instead of a true filter element, in the old canister type oil filters that preceded the spin-on type. For obvious reasons the new gimmick didn't catch on and was soon off the market.

I was working on weekends at a gas station when they first came out and I asked my boss what why he didn't carry them. His short answer: "What is toilet paper made for?"

Rick

Thats funny, I buy wicks but thought I would steal Frams catch line.

I think that was one of the famous: "Sounded like a good idea at the time" inventions!

Another funny incident I had while working at that gas station was when a guy rolled in with his car literally scraping the ground when he came up the drive in. I believe it was a 1950 something Hudson, or something like that. Come to find out these things were built with some Rube-Goldberg electric suspension system that would drop the car almost to the ground if the fuse blew out. Can you imagine the thought process that some brilliant engineer had that came up with that one? I believe the guy got fired and went to work for Ford designing gas tanks or something!

Rick