I hope this hasn't been covered before; I couldn't find a thread specifically on it.

I have a two P-14 rifles, one a very fine BSA sporter and the other unmodified aside from the stock being cut down. Does anyone know if these can be made to feed RN bullets? I've found the Remington bulk 180gn RN quite accurate in both these and my SMLE, but the P-14 really doesn't like them unless they're fed singly.

Any advice would be appreciated.

A company named Dayton-Traister ??? made triggers and speed lock kits for the 1917 Enfield. They also made a gadget of some sort that was installed in the magazine to enable it to feed round nose bullets. I never saw one or heard of them being used. Maybe someone out there could take a photo of it. It may require modification for use in a P-14.

SR4759, I think you're referring to the Dayton-Traister "Tru-Feed" kit. I've heard of these, but like you, I have no information on how well they work.

Stuart

quote:

Originally posted by Stuart T:
SR4759, I think you're referring to the Dayton-Traister "Tru-Feed" kit. I've heard of these, but like you, I have no information on how well they work.

Stuart

It looks like they're available and inexpensive. Might be worth a try.

www.daytraco.com

The SMLE would feed round nose, soft point and hollow point bullets (Mark IV, V and VI) as well as the "normal" Mark VII. But in theory it required a DIFFERENT magazine casing to do so.

For the Mark VII a No4 magazine case with a No3 platform and a No4 auxiliary spring.

For the earlier Mark IV, V, VI a No 3 magazine case with a No2 platform and a No3 auxiliary spring.

This is because the rifle spanned the change from the heavier round nose 215 grain bullet to the final 174 grain spitzer bullet.

The Pattern '14 (and the No4) were designed in an era when only the 174 grain spitzer bullet was is use.

I know that BOTH P'14 and No4 WILL feed reliably the Norma semi-spitzer soft point. I suspect that the problem with the Remington bullet is that you are maybe seating it on the crimp groove?

I would advise checking the details of the Mark IV round and seating it to mimic that OAL. This will probably mean that you'll be seating your Remington bullet with the crimp groove further out of the case?

enfieldspares:

Thanks, mate- I'll be filing that short history of the .303 round for future reference. It also may have solved the problem.

As I needed an excuse to avoid doing real work, I went downstairs and checked the rounds I had on hand. As expected, they were seated to the cannelure.

I couldn't find the specs for the 215 gr. Mk IV round, but I did find a reference which stated the maximum OAL as 3.04". The P14 magazine will accomodate longer than this, so I loaded some dummy rounds to 3.045" and bingo- they all fed fine in both my P-14's, one of which is a rather nice BSA sporter that shoots into > 1.5" @ 100m. I then tried reducing the OAL to 3.035" and they still fed but they weren't entirely happy. It so happens they will feed - just - in my Nº4 Mk1 and Nº5. (I keep the brass for each gun separate, though, due to differences in chamber dimensions, and neck-size only.)

The only slight concern is that the bullets are seated only about .221" deep. I recall reading somewhere that bullets ought be seated to about one diameter so I'm a bit short of that. I won't know if this poses any problems until the rain, snow and slush are gone and I can get to the range but the Lee crimp die may help.

Stuart

This may help...or seat the bullet so that its BASE is level with the base of a normal Mk VII round. They were, as made, both fixed with a crimp groove at the same distance from their bases.

If you are worried about how deep it is seated...I would look at a 243 for comparison! The only "fly in the ointment" is that they won't shoot at longer ranges to the sight settings as the ballistic coefficient is terrible!

I suspect that you would solve your feeding problems in the No4 and No5 by trying to modify a surplus magazine to the same follower shape as I mentioned in my first post. Maybe a fellow Canadian might let you see a picture of such a magazine side by side with the later type?

The SMLE (again) had two different sight beds one on the early SMLE that was used with the heavy blunt bullet and the other on the later SMLE for the sharper lighter bullet.



Left to right: .577/450 Martini Henry, MKII .303, MKV Hollowpoint .303, MK7 .303, 8mm Mauser, 8x50R Austrian Mannlicher.

I found this too...about how NOT to do it!

303 Mk VI converted to "Soft Point"...and BANNED AS DANGEROUS!


If you scroll down this page there is a You Tube video of the P'14 and SMLE:

http://images.google.com/imgre...1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN

enfieldspares:

"...how NOT to do it" indeed! One wonders why the daft b*****s didn't realize the "quincequonces" (as Spike Milligan would have it) of firing a bullet open at both ends!

As to the poor BC of RN bullets, it's not a problem. There are spitzers for LR shooting. And the feeding of my SMLE's is just fine when the bullets are seated to the cannelure as normal.

The Nº4 and Nº5 were both "bubbas" when I got them so I've installed modern front sights which will be filed to suit. The BSA/P-14 is already sporterized and wears a 4x scope. The other P-14 is more or less "stock" except for cut-down wood and I think I can fiddle with different front sigh blades (or modify an existing one) to get it dead on at some suitable range with the fixed battle sight. The ladder sight will take care of the rest. But I really must acquire a factory-issue SMLE one of these days.

Interesting video from the UK NRA Historical Arms Centre. Those were the days (before New Labour!) when "men were men" - who disdained hearing protection! I nearly passed out when I saw P-14's for £7.00. Of course, a living wage was probably £7/week, bread 1/6... and central heating barely a dream for the average person.

Stuart

One small addendum: Upon close inspection I see that the edges of the feed ramp are sometimes nicking the exposed lead of the bullets, esp. when feeding from the RH side of the mag. This should be easy to rectify with some judicious work with the Dremel and/or wet-and-dry sandpaper.

Stuart