From the posts that I have read, most everyone says that an orginal mauser action is much better than most current factory actions that you can buy today. My question is what makes a mauser so much better than say a Model 700 or a pre 64 win action.

cc---

The short answer (the long one takes several books) is----- Because the M-98 was designed to be the best action that could be made. Money, time, skill, machines, tooling and processes took a back seat to pure, unadulturated function.

The M-98 was designed like the space shuttle, though that seems a bad example but it's not. Every part and every particle of the design was done for perfect function and reliability and usually had a back-up function as well.

The M-98 attained perfection in 1905 and remained the best action it could be until 1935. At that time, with Hitler making war plans, the gradual cheapening, in time, processes or money, began and continues to this day unless you buy a modern re-make of the classics.....Granite Mountain, Hartmann and Weiss comes to mind.

All the commercial actions made after WW-II in this country are mechanizms that have some of the features of the Mauser..... or are a totally different breed of dog made as cheaply as could be done at the time with a little left over for cosmetics. Every rifle action made after WW-II are cheapened and don't have the features of the M-98 in it's heyday.....even the M-98s like FN, Husqvarna, Mk-X and the fine BRNO M-21.

Mr Cowboy,

I guess if there were only one answer to your question it would have to be that the 1898 Mauser rifle is considered the Grand daddy of all current bolt action designs. It is this design that all others are compared to and judged by. Does this alone make it the better action? Some say yes, some say no.

Good luck,

Malm

JBelk

Just curious. What are these things that the FN, Brno 21 and the ZG-47 are missing compared to the original Oberdorf actions?

Cheers
/ JOHAN

Perfection was not achieved quickly or easily. The model 98 was the result of 30 years of costly trial and error. (I believe the model 70 took 30 days to develope and the model 700 took 30 minutes).

Johan,

The FN has dual extractor cuts (no C ring), and the only fault I can find on my 22f is the lack of a gas shield on the bolt shroud. I still lack a ZG-47, but I hope to find one someday.

[ 02-15-2003, 03:36: Message edited by: KurtC ]

JOHAN--

The FN first did away with the gas shield at the end of the ejector slot in the left lug and then the inner "C" ring. The M-21/22 and ZG 47s have a stamped metal magazine box which totally destroyed the "one unit" design of the original that effectively made the action and the bottom metal one unit when screwed together.

FN also did away with the mag box lenghtened in both directions and instead used old military boxes with the fronts replaced for longer cartridges.

All the changes were to make them less expensive to make.

Gentlemen

I guess the FN, Brno 21 and ZG-47 still is some of the best mauser style actions compared to other clones that are avilble on the market?

I bad thing with the old obendorf mausers is that they are case hardend and are quite soft.

What is the best mauser standard lenght clone in your opinion ?

/ JOHAN

[ 02-15-2003, 05:29: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

From a users perspective as opposed to our esteemed contingent of gunsmiths, I am particularly fond of the Mausers ease of disassembly for cleaning purposes. It is a wonderfull combination of reliability, simplicity, strength and function. As long as theyve been around, manufacturers are still to this day hard pressed to show any significant improvment on its design and many of them fall short IMO.

Johan,

I have one of the current Brno 98's in 9.3x62.
Brno Arms
They are most likely converted VZ-24's, but they are not being over-buffed during the process. Nice polishing with sharp edges, drilled and tapped, etc. Original bottom metal as well.

I have not seen the matte finish, plastic stock ones being imported into the US by EAA, but I suspect they are not as nice since Brno does not list them on their website.

For years I would buy allot of old junker guns just to take them appart, see how they work, clean, lube, re-assemble, get them working, and then try to blow them up.

When I got a 1903 Turkish Masuer made in 1933 [1898 like design] I was so shocked at the design and number of machining steps that I stayed up all night looking at the parts.

Now 3 years later, I have 25 Mausers, a lathe, and a milling machine for sporterizing Masuers. I still have not figured out what all the machining steps are for.

My opinion is that the Arisaka and Springfield 30-06 coppied the Mauser but where ever they deviated from the Mauser was a mistake. "The book was better."

If I take the stock off a Remington 700, it sure looks cheap to me.

JOHAN--

You're right. The M-21 is better than the Golden Age Orbendorfs *except* for the chintzy bottom metal. But they made up for that with foundation (as opposed to add-on) double set triggers and the elegant shotgun guard. Any aftermarket bottom metal is a natural replacement. They're full 30-06 length too.

The ZG-47 is one of the best made M-98s ever in the original "C" ring, large ring, large thread, clip guide configuration.

Some early Orbendorf commercials were heat-treated like the '09 Argentine, case hardened *only* on the inside. They're a "peach" of an action, soft and easy to work on the outside and hard on the inside........once they loosen they can wreck, though.

The FN?

I like FNs but it's like having a favorite cousin even though she's ugly. The FN's are slick, well finished and probably better heat-treated than any Mauser, but the cut SO many corners it's hard to brag on them. FN was the first to take shortcuts with safety. That's backwards than should be. Safety should *evolve* not *de*volve. What they made a world standard for H&H lenth M-98s to save a few bucks on bottom metal should be called a crime. It was. If you see an H&H Mauser that strings vertical groups, you can bet it's an FN.......... and ruined.

JBelk

I have to agree with you. It's a crime to trying to mill out material from a standard lengt mauser actio trying to bend in a 375 lenght cartridge!! The mauser police should strike hard on thoose persons

I have two mauser husky rifles were the action is made by FN. I think they are farily nice but there are some things needed tp fix on them. The ones sold by husqvarna had a mauser flag saftey and some of the really old ones had thumb cut out. Perhaps they are lacking some against the original, but just look at thoose awfull copies made by Zastava and other. I guess most of the military actions wouldn't qualify by this aspect etiher since they were made with function in mind rather than quality.

The ZG-47 will be very nice if you polish it, but I don't like that the trigger not mauser compatible and think the saftey is uggly and the trigger guard it a bit big.

Does anyone know if the argentine floorplate would fit this rifle? I saw a rifle made by Maurice Ottmar had a argentine floorplate and a winchester style saftey.

After this i'll think I just have to treat my self with another mauser, perhaps a ZG-47 or two

/ JOHAN

[ 02-15-2003, 18:24: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

Mr. Belk,
If I may, I would like to ask your opinion on a pet project I have in mind.
I want to use either a m24/47 or m48 Yugo action to build a custom rifle,
My plan;
caliber-8x57js
barrel- Shilen, 22", medium contour
stock- European style
sights- aperture on receiver and globe front.
Timney or similar trigger.
trigger guard and bottom metal, Williams or similar

Actually kind of like a Plezier style overall. I'm kinda' getting tired of scopes and "cookie cutter" rifles.

I guess my main question is are these actions fairly strong and true?