Friends-

I did a couple of searches on the board and could not find exactly what I was looking for.

Question is, when did USRA start manufacturing the Model 70 Classic?

Specifically, I am referring to the current day version of the "Pre 64" model 70 action (I know that they are not precisely the same).

Also, is there a time span of manufacture that you consider better than other time spans in determining the quality of the Model 70 Classics?

Thanks in advance.

They were coming out of the custom shop around 1984 possibly earlier. The custom shop ones have a G prefix in the serial number with 5 digit serial numbers and when you try to run the serial number they come back 1941. I owned one, a 338 Supergrade and saw a few more; most but not all were Supergrades.

The Classics went into production late '93ish - early'94ish. Super Grades were available with the classic action about '91. As far As I know the first custom shop action was used for one of the SCI DG series rifles by David Miller in '88 or '89.

I like the classics in the G70xxx to G90xxxrange. I have a few in this range and they all seem to be of uniform high quality. The few in the G60xxx range I've examined seem to be well made too. I have a .338 donor rifle in the G24xxx serial range and it's not nearly as well manufactured as the afformentioned range, but much better than the later guns. Though I would definitely consider any made below the G275xxx range as this is when USRAC did away with the firing pin stop screw.

I bought a classic sporter 300 RUM in 01 or 02, wouldn,t shoot for shit. Looked like it had a chip on the reamer when they chambered it. Sent it back to Winchester, they returned with a new barrel. Been a tack driver ever since, as long as I do my part. I can only shoot it 18 to 20 times off the bench before it starts getting uncomfortable.

As far as production grade rifles are concerned, the 1990 Winchester catalog shows the new Classic Super Grade. Then in 1992, they introduced the Classic Featherweight.

I believe there were Custom Shop Classics made before 1990, but I don't know if there were many made.

I only have one Custom Shop Classic, and it is a model made only from 1996 - 1998, yet it has a G10XXX serial number. A previous poster who said Custom Shop rifles all have the "G" prefix followed by a 5 digit number may well be correct. Actually, every Model 70 made since 1969 or so, has the "G" prefix.

This "G" prefix is a very common source of confusion. Quite simply, a "G" prefix serial number is a different serial number than a rifle without a prefix in its serial number, and you can't look up a "G" prefix number in the books and simply ignore the prefix, and try to make it fit.

I wasn't inferring that the G denoted custom shop. The G with a 5 digit number denotes custom shop. You run the Gxxxxx serial number and it comes back 1941. Fluke in the system I guess.

airgun1, Interesting, may I inquire as to where this information comes from? Perhaps the program which runs the serial number check, just ignores the "G" prefix.

I refer to published data, which now is available up to 1992. The "Blue Book" claims that the Classic serialization started in 1990 at G15000. Apparently lower numbers were reserved for Custom Shop pieces, which would correlate with your statement, as well as my example of one!

That 1941 date came from Winchester when they were still around. I have seen 3 and owned one that Winchester ID'd as 1941. They didn't have access to the custom shop data apparently. I bought my 338 Supergrade used in 1989 and the orignal paperwork said it was made in 1985, long before they were cataloged. I forget the serial but remember it was G and 5 digit. My friend owns a gun shop and he called me one day to check out the preWar 270 he just bought. It was an early CRF just like mine but was not a Supergrade. Winchester told us that they didn't have custom shop serializations.

I bought my first Supergrade "Classic" in the early 90'ties. It had a ridiculously oversized chamber (.300 Win Mag), the worst fowling barrel I have ever encountered and a crooked barrel channel. Other than that, it shot pretty well, although I later installed a custom barrel on it.

A couple of years later (maybe mid-90'ties) I bought a SS Classic with a synthetic stock. It had crooked threads and a floppy stock.

Finally (maybe late 90'ies) I bought a Featherweight Classic in .270 Win. That was a fussy rifle, and I sold it again after having had trouble getting it to shoot. Having sold it, I actually found a (factory) load it liked, and it shot pretty decently.

Just from my own, personal experience - which I admit is limited - I don't see what all the hoopla about "fantastic Winchester quality" is about. The ones I ran into were fairly decent production grade rifles, but they all had their issues. The M70 Classic action may be quite a decent action to build a custom rifle on, but don't expect it to be perfect out of the box. IMHO, your chance of getting a dimensionally sound action is just as large (or better?) if you pick up an MRC M1999 action - although probably a tad heavier than the M70.

- mike

I pulled a barrel from a 1990's vintage 30-06 CRF and tried to see if a pre 64 barrel would come close to lining up. I had a half dozen pre 64 70 barrels on hand that I had screwed on a few pre 64 actions just to see how they fit, lined up headspaced etc. Those barrels all screwed on the pre 64 actions like butter, by hand all the way to the lock up point; most would have needed a 1/16" to 1/8" bump to lock on, a few were like 3/8" to line up/lock up. Not one of those barrels went into that CRF action smoothly; most didn't go on halfway by hand. The few that made it to the lock up point were over rotated past the index mark by 1/4" or more. From this it appears that a post 64 CRF barrel can probably go on a pre 64 action with a little work possibly needed, i.e. deepening the chamber, shortening the stub a few thousandths, and possibly deepening the cone breech. The CRF's are close but definitely no cigar. There is no reason that they shouldn't be superior to the pre 64. There is CAD/CAM and better metalurgy available today, but believe me, they are inferior to the original by a mile. Hard to beat that hook cut rifling and lapped bore anyway!