I'm new to the forum so please forgive any mistakes to established ettiquete.For some time now I have wanted to build my own rifle complete with wildcat round,I guess it's the ultimate ego trip ,However no-one I consulted had enough knowledge to where I felt comfortable or had info that did not conflict. So I'm turning to you as I've read several forum's and seen some of your projects, so I know I'm in the right place.
I know in my head exactly what I want right from round out to finished product. But no-one has been able to tell me where to start, or if there is software out there to help me determine proper rate of twist,barrel length,how to form cases safely ,how far down can you safely reduce case opening size,how it's done correctly,etc...So as you see I need a lot of corrective assistance.
Thank-you for your patience,
Marcel.

First we need to have an Idea as to what it is that you want.
mc

Ditto what MC said. And it has probably been done, several different ways. FWIW, Dutch.

A very good place to start would be reading the 9th edition of "Cartridges of the World", and Ken Howell's book - "Designing & Forming Custom Cartridges".

Most likely, someone else has already designed what you are considering and the load data has already been developed. You might even get lucky and find reamers in ready supply.

The best place to start is by selecting the caliber, then the case type, and then consider velocities desired, and then the size of the action you wish to use. This will get you in the ball park. It seems like all the "new" cartridges have already been designed.

First off (as was noted in another forum thread) What bullet? Caliber? weight? style? intended targets? (paper? varmints? big game?) Range? (50yards? 1000? 2500?)

A lot of the other decisions will become MUCH easier after that is determined.

Marcel, the best way to understand the process is to teach yourself enough about the subject to know exactly what you want and how to get there. Sounds easier than it is.
One of the best ways is to do what you just did, ask questions where a lot of good information and experienced people hang out. This place is perfect, as are several other boards- huntamerica.com, 24hourcampfire.com, and many others.
Another way is to study books that are available. Wildcat Cartridges, Cartridges of the World, and several of the various reloading manuals are full of good information to help you learn this subject. My favorite is the Hornady reloading manuals, but several have good information, including good ballistics tables.
Keep in mind, it would be doubtful if you come up with a new wildcat that somebody hasn't already tried one way or another. Find one that fits your needs and give it a good workout.
If somebody hasn't already said so, Welcome to the world of gun nuts, you're now an official member. - Sheister

What caliber do you want to build?

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NRA Life member

Marcel,
First, you need a teacher, surly there is a good gunsmith around that can school you.

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

If you are looking for a first rate custom rifle in any chambering, give Ralf Martini a call at 250-417-2926-- that's in B.C.. He can answer any question dealing with firearms and cartridges/chamberings.

Welcome.

As Zero Drift said, start by narrowing down the caliber, basing this on your intended use / quarry.
You will find an amazing amount of knowledge and experience on these forums, I sure did.

Best,
Todd

I HOPE THIS IS THE RIGHT WAY TO START OR IF I SHOULD HAVE SET-UP A NEW POST , I'M SURE YOU'LL LET ME KNOW AND THANK YOU FOR BOTH YOUR RESPONSES AND MAKING ME FEEL WELCOME RIGHT .IT'S GOOD TO KNOW THAT I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE AS PASSIONATE ABOUT FIREARMS AND THE SHOOTING SPORTS AS I AM.
EVERYONE HAD SOME GREAT IDEAS AND A LOT I ALREADY HAVE WRITTEN DOWN BUT DIDN'T KNOW HOW FAR TO GO ON MY FIRST POST,BUT YOU ASKED FOR IT SO HERE IT COMES.
FIRST THE CALIBER IS CALLED THE 30-50 HAWKE (EGO TRIP ALL THE WAY )IT WILL BE A .50 CAL BMG CASE NECKED DOWN TO SEAT A 7.62 (.308)BULLET.IT'S MAIN USE OTHER THAN SCAREING RANGE OFFICERS WILL BE FOR HUNTING MOOSE,BEAR AND CARIBOU AS SOMEONE WITH A MINOR MOBILITY PROBLEM,I NEED TO BE LIKE MA BELL AND REACH OUT AND TOUCH SOMEONE.BASICIALLY IF I CAN SEE IT I CAN BE BLOODY CERTAIN I CAN HIT IT ,AND I HAVE THE MILITARY AND DCRA MEDALS PAN AM GAMES TO BACK IT UP.
I FIGURE A SINGLE SHOT CONFIGURATION ALONG THE LINES OF A RUGER #1,OR A BREECH LOAD HIGH WALL SIMILAR TO AN 1873 45-110.
ANYWAY THAT IS THE BASICS,VERY BASIC SO HAVE AT IT. UNFORTUNATELY THERE IS NOT A REALLY A GUNSMITH I CAN TURN TO SO YOU GUYS AND YOUR ASSISTANCE ARE MY GUIDES THROUGH THIS ENDEAVORED WHEN IT'S DONE I'LL PROBABLY BE ABLE TO HANG OUT A SHINGLE OF MY OWN.
THANKS AGAIN,
HAWKE

[This message has been edited by Hawkesridge (edited 12-05-2001).]

Oh.

Well, I suppose I might as well be the one.

First, would you please turn off your caps lock? It is hard to read, and considered the internet equivalent of SHOUTING.

In "cartridges of the world", Frank Barnes lists the 338/50 Talbot, which is the 50 BMG necked to 338. His words: "The cartridge is over bore capacity, and severe throat erosion occurred with only 250 rounds".

Quoting again, "The maximum load of AA8700 only occupied 77% of the the capacity."

I would suggest you might be barking up the wrong tree with this one. 300 RUM is plenty capacity for the 30 cal. However, the two rounds to play with would be the 338 Lapua and the 408 Chey-Tac.

Second, the Ruger #1 is not the platform you want to base a long range project on.

I would suggest Cartridges of the World as a first step, and I believe Ken Howell's case forming book as well. HTH, Dutch.

Hagn's single shot action is the Cadillac, if that's the direction you are headed, bye.

Here ya go, its a 338/50BMG though. Yeah, a .50 BMG Case necked down to .338 Caliber, using a 300gn. Sierra MK.
Holding about 148grs of Powder it�ll get 3400fps. Case is 65mm /
2.559" long and has a 30� shoulder -Angle. Not mine, but Michaels, a gentleman in Germany.

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Brent

[This message has been edited by Big50 (edited 12-06-2001).]

Just some thoughts of the top of my head...

For extreme long range shooting, don't heavier bullets have an advantage maintaining velocity?

Perhaps this is why the cartridge above is a .338", as opposed to a .308"?

With that much case capacity (and I suspect you would probably design the case shorter than the original 50BMG) wouldn't it be better utilized using a heavier bullet?

If it were me, and because being different is fun, I'd look at doing it in 9.3mm (.366) and using some of Geralds "GS" bullets.

I guess one way to go about it, is to determine what bullet weight you want to shoot. Figure out how fast you need to run that bullet, to achieve a decent trajectory out to however you plan on shooting. Then determine how much, and what kind, of powder will be needed to achieve your goal. Once you know the powder weight (or mass) needed, then search for a case design which is just slightly larger than that, and work with it.

Perhaps choosing the BMG case, simply because it's the largest available (I guess), is not the proper route to designing your new cartridge? Rather than "going big" and seeing what happens, you should determine your goals, then choose the case design which meets that challenge. In the end, you may end up with a more efficient wildcat.

Good Luck! Keep us informed...

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Brian
The 416 Taylor WebPage!

BIG 50,thanks for the reply,a picture really is worth a thousand words. I must admit that I was surprised when I saw how much the case had been cut down,almost makes the use of a BMG casing a waste if the same volume can be found in a more readily available configuration.

I know one person has naysayed the idea of a Ruger as a platform to build on but how about the other idea of the breech loading high wall a la "Quigley 1873 45-120 ".just a thought.

This thread reminds me of something called the Mach 5, which was 50 BMG necked down to either 338 or 375, and using bronze bullets I believe got 5000 fps out of it.

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Disclaimer: The above opinions are not the comments of an expert, they are the opinions of a nut.

There's a few 375/50BMG's running around this part of Australia, mainly because our gunlaws prohibit any anti-tank calibre weapons eg 50BMG, 50 Boyes etc....so people neck them down or up to do something different.

The one 375/50 I have seen uses a a necked down 50BMG and is built on a locally manufactured cusom bolt action (Jongmans.
No idea on MV and in fact don't know whether it was ever done, but when sighting in a 200 metres it would cause the earth on the rear side of a 6 foot mound to shake. He shot the 300gn Sierra SPBT and you would imagine 4000+fps would be in the achievable range.

Hawksridge....you need to take a look at what the 1000-yard benchrest shooters are using...bullets long for their caliber that maintain their velocity and buck the wind. Take a look at Dan Lilja's web-site ...he makes Lilja barrels...and on his site he talks about what is needed both equipment wise and skill wise to attempt shots at animals at extreme long range. You can find his site by going to www.benchrest.com and then clicking on "barrels" on the left...then go to Lilja barrels.

One other thought....a cliber that would be OK (from an energy viewpoint only) to take moose size animals at extreme range will have very strong recoil or else it will need to be very heavy...just remember the law of unintended consequences.

OK...one more thing. If you don't get around really well what happens if you wound an animal at long-range and need to follow it up?

Welcome Aboard!

I don't post alot here, There is alot of good people here.

Death Merchant

Hawkesridge,
Try http://www.longrangehunting.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi for some more info.

Later
Brent

Like I said, 408 Chey-tac.

FYI: http://www.edmarms.com/cheytac.htm

Dutch.