Lot of info about walnut going about and have seen a few times reference to thin shelled walnut, mostly of European origin. What exactly is thin shelled walnut compared to other walnut woods?? Recently did a fair amount of research regarding Mannlicher Shoenauer rifles and referred to this type of walnut and just curious. All input appreciated.

martin

I stole this off the net.

Bastogne Walnut

These very rare trees are strains crossed with European Black Walnut and the English Carpathian Strain Walnut trees. These trees grow a little faster than their Black and English Walnut counterparts, and the pores in the wood are so small they are hardly visible. This is a fantastic wood for tight checkering, as are any of the Southern Utah walnut strains, as they grow slowly due to our short growing season.



Black Walnut

These trees were planted by the first Mormon settlers in the late 1800's. The strains of Black Walnut we find here in Utah are neither Eastern or Claro Walnut.



Bubinga

This is Bubinga from Africa and is used mainly in the United States as musical instrument wood, because it is very rare to obtain it in large enough pieces for gun wood. It is to this day the gunwood of choice for many South African safari guides. It is a little bit denser than walnut. This wood is so 3-dimensional it doesn't even look like it has a flat surface. From different angles and light conditions it can turn many colors and it shimmers with gold. The workability of this wood is unmatched. It saws well, sands well, takes a glass finish, and is very stable.



Claro Black Walnut

Claro Black Walnut is native to California and a very beautiful black walnut. Some is soft and some is hard. Most stocks are glass bedded for extra strength. Claro has been in use for gun wood for over a hundred years.



About Juglans regia - English Walnut

This is the thin-shelled English Walnut, also called Italian, European, Circassian, French, Royal, Russian, and Turkish. It’s all the same wood, but color and grade vary by location of where it grows. This is the king of the gun woods and most sought after and most expensive in the gun world today.

Grading of this wood is all about the amount of streaking and marbling in the wood, and the colors of this wood can vary from very blond to very highly colorful pieces. There are many misconceptions about what part of the tree produces the best gun wood. Many people have the conception that root wood is the best, when in fact this is totally wrong. Root wood has no strength or durability, and is very difficult to become stable. Root wood is very pretty and has the typical zig-zaggy lines seen in much of your Turkish blanks. We, at Old Tree, will not, and refuse to, cut root wood, as it is not stable type gun wood. The roots are more porous from being underground the whole life of the tree. Now if this root wood is also steamed or kiln dried, then you’ve taken a bad piece of wood and made it worse. Yes, it’s pretty, but that’s all it is. The best gun wood is at ground level where the trunk flares, going clear up to the first forks.

Stability is the single most important issue in gun wood, along with correct layout. Correct layout means the gun wood is straight grained through the wrist area and flows straight into your receivers. There are many in this industry that are selling blanks with bad layout. Bad layout can be determined by looking at your wood going into your receiver. It should never be going in at an angle or going down your forend area on a rifle at an angle. This wood has to be straight. The wood can have color patterns and mineral streaking in these areas, but the grain of the wood itself has to be straight. If it is not, you have a problem piece of wood. Correct layout is guaranteed at Old Tree Gun Blanks.

Steaming and boiling remove the oils in the wood, therefore making it cure and dry in as short as 2 weeks after being cut. This is not a practice that should be done on gun wood. These practices were designed for structural wood, not gun stocks. Kilning, steaming, and boiling will leave traces of these practices. The wood will not want to take a high polish, and many times the internal fiber structures of the wood will be damaged. At Old Tree Gun Blanks, all of our wood is air dried and seasoned the way it should be.



English Walnut

This Northern California English is of the world-famous Franquette strain. Highly marbled, with mineral lines, each piece will be like opening a present. As beautiful as a Franquette blank will look, you will not uncover the full, true beauty of this wood until after it is shaped. This is the magic with Franquette. These blanks are very, very rare on this market.



English Walnut - Utah

Utah English Walnut is a Carpathian Strain planted by the first Mormom settlers because it grows well in cold weather. This is the same strain found in the former Soviet Union. These trees are planted by seed and are not from grafted trees such as those in California.



Japanese Black Walnut

These Black Walnut trees were planted by Chinese laborers in the mining camps in the late 1800’s. The nuts tend to be heart-shaped with a point. The wood is very colorful with lots of blues, purples and reds.

Wish I had a dollar for all the names people sell walnut variety's under !!.

ALL true WALNUT is of the genus Juglans of the family Juglandaceae.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walnut

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Walnut

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juglans_hindsii

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juglans_californica

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juglans_regia

Hickory and Pecan are also sub species of Walnut or family Juglandaceae.as are other regionally located

trees . Although many differ in desirable characteristics for stock blanks .

Now you've no doubt heard of Claro Walnut right it's a marketing name as is Persian Bastogne

Claro is hindsii . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claro_walnut

So what does this mean below ?. Many times the people selling it DON'T KNOW JACK !. Because Claro isn't Claro at all . It's simply a name someone came up with for a marketing ploy !.

Bastogne Walnut, the rarest of all walnut woods, is a natural cross between California English Walnut and California Claro. Bastogne trees grow very large and the wood is always denser than the two parent trees. Since the trees are not cultivated and only grow naturally, they are very rare. The color contrast is that of the brilliant colors of Claro and the dark streaks of English.

Purchase Walnut from Reputable sources and buy it based on what you like in it's color figure and grain

pattern .

For definitive proof in ANY WOOD SPECIES research this site and KNOW FOR CERTAIN !.

http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/

Thanks for the very informative information regarding not only thin shelled walnut , but walnut and it's many varieties.
I recently purchased MS Mod. 1952, yr. mfg.'53/Mannlicher stock, and the stock is excellent and as for color, would deem it closer to butterscotch with subdued darker tiger striping from butt to muzzle. Wood itself seems to be very dense and checkering diamonds sharp and well shaped. Again, appreciate the feedback.

martin

I always thought that thick/thin shelled walnut was determined by the thickness of the shell of the nut. English walnut for instance has a thin shell which can be cracked pretty easily with a nutcracker. Black walnut on the other hand has a thicker shell which you are not likely to crack with a nutcracker. You'll need a pretty good (heavy) hammer to get to the nuts in a black walnut shell. Never cracked a Bastogne nut however

I've heard of Morning Wood , but now I know what Mormon wood is too.

rich

Remember the harsher the conditions the wood grow sin the better the wood will be to use as a stock. For example English that comes from Cali from an irrigated orchard or one from Utah grown in harsh conditions Utah blank is the best choice.

Have seen it with my own eyes as well as the people that cut it, carve it and import it.

quote:

Originally posted by ramrod340:
I stole this off the net.

Bubinga

This is Bubinga from Africa and is used mainly in the United States as musical instrument wood, because it is very rare to obtain it in large enough pieces for gun wood. It is to this day the gunwood of choice for many South African safari guides. It is a little bit denser than walnut. This wood is so 3-dimensional it doesn't even look like it has a flat surface. From different angles and light conditions it can turn many colors and it shimmers with gold. The workability of this wood is unmatched. It saws well, sands well, takes a glass finish, and is very stable.

I have a rifle stocked in this I will post a picture later. to my eyes it is Beautiful but heavy.

yup - just looking at a walnut and figuring out what type it is - it's a tough nut to crack

quote:

Originally posted by butchloc:
yup - just looking at a walnut and figuring out what type it is - it's a tough nut to crack

If Obama decides to tax fun on the internet, he's coming after you with a backhoe!

What determines a " Sound Wood " of nearly any species is the Root Stock it grows from !.

What makes the figure and veining contained in a slab of " Gun Stock " blanks is the dirt it's grown in

I E minerals nutrients . Piss poor growing conditions never made a better wood , PERIOD !.

If the Worlds Best Gunsmith starts off with an inferior metal alloy , the gun ends up being inferior !.

Try an remember start with GOOD end up with GOOD , start with Great end up with the same .

Some of the Very best walnut stock comes from Northern CA. and Oregon Arizona stock is also desirable .

Conclusion
In conclusion, growth and yield comparisons
show that Northern California
Black and Arizona Black rootstocks performed
well, but Manregian did poorly in
both areas. Paradox hybrid was an outstanding
performer at KHFS but did
poorly at WSFS. The reverse was true of
Texas Black; it did poorly at KHFS but
perfortned well at WSFS.
On the basis of the results at KHFS,
Eureka seedlings appear to offer some potential
as a rootstock for future walnut
plantings. They performed nearly as well
as Northern California Black and have the
advantage of providing immunity to
blackline disease of walnuts. However,
the high chloride and boron levels associated
with Paradox hybrid and with another
English walnut cultivar (Manregian)
at WSFS raise a serious question as
t o t h e adaptability of the Eureka rootstock
to some of the soils on the west
side of the San Joaquin Valley.

Now for all ya Eastern an Mid westerner's Junglas nigra AKA Black Walnut , slip on down to

Technical Abstract . You might just find a lucrative hobby , employment or info that may or may not

interest you .

http://www.ars.usda.gov/resear...tm?seq_no_115=206029

quote:

Originally posted by Doc224/375:
What determines a " Sound Wood " of nearly any species is the Root Stock it grows from !.

What makes the figure and veining contained in a slab of " Gun Stock " blanks is the dirt it's grown in

I E minerals nutrients . Piss poor growing conditions never made a better wood , PERIOD !.

If the Worlds Best Gunsmith starts off with an inferior metal alloy , the gun ends up being inferior !.

Try an remember start with GOOD end up with GOOD , start with Great end up with the same .

Some of the Very best walnut stock comes from Northern CA. and Oregon Arizona stock is also desirable .

Conclusion
In conclusion, growth and yield comparisons
show that Northern California
Black and Arizona Black rootstocks performed
well, but Manregian did poorly in
both areas. Paradox hybrid was an outstanding
performer at KHFS but did
poorly at WSFS. The reverse was true of
Texas Black; it did poorly at KHFS but
perfortned well at WSFS.
On the basis of the results at KHFS,
Eureka seedlings appear to offer some potential
as a rootstock for future walnut
plantings. They performed nearly as well
as Northern California Black and have the
advantage of providing immunity to
blackline disease of walnuts. However,
the high chloride and boron levels associated
with Paradox hybrid and with another
English walnut cultivar (Manregian)
at WSFS raise a serious question as
t o t h e adaptability of the Eureka rootstock
to some of the soils on the west
side of the San Joaquin Valley.

Now for all ya Eastern an Mid westerner's Junglas nigra AKA Black Walnut , slip on down to

Technical Abstract . You might just find a lucrative hobby , employment or info that may or may not

interest you .

http://www.ars.usda.gov/resear...tm?seq_no_115=206029

Hmmmmm hate to shoot you down in flames but why is the best wood grown in Turkey in harsh conditions? If what you say was true then it could be grown as a "crop" in California but it would not have the figure and because it would have grown so fast it would not be as dense. Sorry but you are in the weeds on this one buddy. Do some more research.

When was the last time you grew a crop ?.

Trees don't grow over night or in a season or in 100 !.

The Best wood doesn't necessarily come from Turkey , it's how much they're charging you which makes

you think it does !!!!!!!!!!. LAND WATER TIME when will you see your wood profits and how much will

you be able to sell how much will degrade ?. GET REAL !!!.

I've seen good gunstock wood that came from several continents. But right now a lot of the best stuff you see did originate in Turkey. A lot of that may be due to our fellow forum member AFreeman of Luxus Walnut bringing in so much GREAT wood.

From what I've seen the best most stable GUNSTOCK wood comes from slow growth tree's that have a more dense grain pattern. Kinda like how original southern pine was slow grown and dense enough to use in flooring where'as the fast grown pine they grow as a crop in south GA now is pretty much good for nothing but christmas tree's, particle board and wood pulp.

But hey, I'm an amature but I can tell the difference in walnut in 2 seconds by taking a sharp chisel to it!....................DJ

I shall not dispute what someone has or has not seen .

Walnut could come from a variety of Country's and as other Black market items be sold under almost any

Country's trade umbrella . Iran has vast stretches of Walnut as does Azerbaijan on and on .

So point of origin is dubious unless one is actually cutting it . I learned that in Africa .

Wood came from neighboring country's although Ghana was the Sustainable exporter

Ivory Coast West Africa Cameroun Angola Congo on and on were sources of Ghana woods !!.

#1 As with most things in life Money talks and BS walks .

A totally unrelated scenario reminded me of that time back then .

Some years ago now a 60 Min. segment was following Walmart's clothing purchasers abroad .

Seems the Chinese were sewing in labels made in Bangladesh India Botswana even Italian Designer labels

all under the table because of trade quotas . Refer to #1 rule .

I'm history on this thread it's been fun ... Doc

quote:

Originally posted by djpaintles:
I've seen good gunstock wood that came from several continents. But right now a lot of the best stuff you see did originate in Turkey. A lot of that may be due to our fellow forum member AFreeman of Luxus Walnut bringing in so much GREAT wood.

From what I've seen the best most stable GUNSTOCK wood comes from slow growth tree's that have a more dense grain pattern. Kinda like how original southern pine was slow grown and dense enough to use in flooring where'as the fast grown pine they grow as a crop in south GA now is pretty much good for nothing but christmas tree's, particle board and wood pulp.

But hey, I'm an amature but I can tell the difference in walnut in 2 seconds by taking a sharp chisel to it!....................DJ

Adam and Clay are good friends of mine (got a chuckle when I told them about this thread) in fact will be having dinner with them tonight and tomorrow night. I have some of the sickest pieces that they have brought in. Have a few I am picking up tomorrow in fact that Clay got back from Turkey on Christmas Eve and has some really nice stuff right now.

I also have 8 Screwbean Mesquite which are hard to come by in fact Gordon Smiths website where some of the info above came from there is a pic of my Marlin stocked with it, Japanese Walnut, Utah Black that is feather from one end to the other (shot gun wood) Utah and Cali English that is gorgeous. Have a 115lb pc of Macassar and a smaller rifle blank that has stunning colors for a barreled action I got from Ken Howell the writer that Chuck Grace is going to finish it with Blackburn bottom metal and it will be very nice. Have to re-chamber it to 375 Dakota from 375 Howell but it will be a showpiece when finished.

Lot of people think they know about wood and it is kind of funny but it is my hobby because when I build one it is the best I can find period.