Can anyone tell us who made this rifle? I'm working on an article, had to do the photos and for fun thought I’d ask and see if anyone has ever seen one of these.

I don't have anything like a guess but after looking at it for a minute it looks like it has a really long length of pull (the distance from the butt to the trigger). Maybe it is just the way I'm looking at it. Does it look long to anyone else.

Looks like an Enfield safety, Mauser extractor, Remington bridge profile, Springfield barrel, and Hoffman Arms stock. Beats the hell out of me!

That cocking piece (and the floorplate) look like they came off of one of the German contract Newton rifles.
However, I don't recognize that safety.

It also looks like it is chambered for a cartridge that is somewhat on the smaller size.

It doesn't look valuable at all. I'll give you $50 for it, but you have to pay the shipping.

Garrett

I am also getting a very strong "Fred Adolph" vibe from the picture also, especially the drop at the heel of the stock.

I'd love to know what caliber that is.

Garrett

To further confuse the issue. If I told you the caliber the mystery would be over.

30 Newton?

This picture was taken about twenty years ago back in the B&W days.
Notice the roller on the trigger and the peep sight.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Brooks:
30 Newton?

Sorry, Nope! Also nothing to do with Fred Adolph, Hoffman or Newton.

So much for that WAG!
It is a different looking action Michael!

I cheated, its on page 39 of your excellent book. I knew I had seen the short action somewhere and where else should I look.

found it on page 39, too; a treat to see it in color

how does the peep attach to the bolt?

and, what is the treatment on the bolt/extractor called?

thanks.

Is the receiver a reweld?

One where two full length receivers were cut to unequal sizes, and a new Kurz or short receiver was created?

Nice craftsmanship.

The rarity of it makes me think I undervalued the rifle.

Would you take $100 and I'll pay the shipping?

Nice photography too.

Garrett

Looking in a book is not cheating, I use them all the time ;-).

The rifle is Niedner Model 1924, serial No. 3 rifle that belonged to A.O. Niedner. There were three or four of these rifles made, all for the Niedner Magnum cartridge a 30-Remington necked to .22. Later he changed this rifle to a 30-Remington necked to 6mm. Not sure if he was experimenting or what. I located one of the other rifles and was able to examine it although it’s in poor shape. This rifle was stocked by Thomas Shelhamer, the end cap unscrews and is replaced by the sight. I found two of these sights while visiting a friend in Colorado who had bought some of Niedner’s stuff before he died.
At the back of the bolt is a small pin that protrudes and acts as a cocking indicator. The sights have the same hole so there much have been a longer pin at one time for when using the sights. The scope is attached with a single Mann-Niedner base. A third rifle I have traced into Canada where it was given to a guide on a hunting trip., but is now lost to time.
The treatment is a burnishing found on many Niedner bolts. The thinking at the time was to retain some lubrication, later they engine turned them for the same reason.

Here is an unfinished action, made from solid bar stock.

Michael, you come up with the most amazing finds!! I blew my chance in 1954, when my grandfather, dad, and I went to Art Hubalek's in Brooklyn to pick up a 1932 Olds (8K miles on it) he inherited from cousin Art. Didn't know who he was, and let my father talk me out of buying a 32-40 engraved Hubalek Schuetzen for $175. "Hell, they don't make ammo for that anymore, I think".......aaargh!

quote:

Originally posted by xs headspace:
Michael, you come up with the most amazing finds!! I blew my chance in 1954, when my grandfather, dad, and I went to Art Hubalek's in Brooklyn to pick up a 1932 Olds (8K miles on it) he inherited from cousin Art. Didn't know who he was, and let my father talk me out of buying a 32-40 engraved Hubalek Schuetzen for $175. "Hell, they don't make ammo for that anymore, I think".......aaargh!

A Hubalek engraved Schuetzen would be a fine thing to have these days. I've passed over a bunch of guns over the years only to learn later what I was looking at. Remember hindsight is always 20-20 ;-).

Did I answer everyones questions about the 1924 Niedner rifle?
This is a good way for me to learn what folks want to know about rifle like this. Also it would be nice if one of the other rifles like this were to turn up.

Probably to much for this forum, but I'd really like to know how the rifle has spent the last 75 or so years. Also any unique features or workings of the action. Is the rifle a single shot or a repeater? You know Carl Bernosky won the national HP championships this year with a 6mm Hagar which is a .30 rem necked to 6mm. Maybe we should have called it the 6mm Niedner. Really is nothing new under the sun in this game.

Thanks for posting.

John

quote:

Originally posted by gasgunner:
Probably to much for this forum, but I'd really like to know how the rifle has spent the last 75 or so years. Also any unique features or workings of the action. Is the rifle a single shot or a repeater? You know Carl Bernosky won the national HP championships this year with a 6mm Hagar which is a .30 rem necked to 6mm. Maybe we should have called it the 6mm Niedner. Really is nothing new under the sun in this game.

Thanks for posting.

John

John,
The rifle is a repeater, and a slick little action I like the idea that you can replace the back with a peep sight. Also a unique trigger, I shot it a lot years ago but it's been retired for many years.


I have a picture of Niedner dated 1946 with the rifle across his lap. Shortly before Niedner died he sold and gave many of his prize rifles to a friend who worked for the Corps of Engineers circa 1951-52. His friend had taken a job in Kenai, Alaska building a place called Wildwood Army base. His friend spent about ten years in Alaska and sold everything here in the state. I got on the trail about 1970 and have not stopped looking for AON's rifles although I have gathered up all that were brought to Alaska. This rifle I found on a local gunshow table in the early 80's?? The Peep sights came from Colorado and the unfinished action from Dowagiac, MI.

Michael,

Thanks for sharing this jewel with us. 35 years ago, a friend in Arkansas showed me a pistol that was marked AO Niedner. He had gotten it from an old friend of his who had been in Alaska for years. I always wondered about the authenticity of the gun, but the information you just put forth makes me believe it probably was the real deal. Kirby is in his 70s now, but I will check and see if he still has it. He is quite a trader, but may well have kept this based on the gift aspect. I also realize I wasn't cheating, that's why we build reference libraries, so we can identify treasures like this.

quote:

Originally posted by Thaine:
Michael,

Thanks for sharing this jewel with us. 35 years ago, a friend in Arkansas showed me a pistol that was marked AO Niedner. He had gotten it from an old friend of his who had been in Alaska for years. I always wondered about the authenticity of the gun, but the information you just put forth makes me believe it probably was the real deal. Kirby is in his 70s now, but I will check and see if he still has it. He is quite a trader, but may well have kept this based on the gift aspect. I also realize I wasn't cheating, that's why we build reference libraries, so we can identify treasures like this.

Interesting story and my turn out to be something special. The man who was Niedner's friend left Alaska and relocated to Arkansas, the last address that I have was from Little Rock and I'm not sure where else he was. Please find out the name of the man your friend got the pistol from, if his initials were "BM" so much the better. Niedner did not do a lot of work on pistols, he did some but not a lot. He also owned several pistols, do you remember what pistol it was? When you get some more info I'll do my best to see what if anything we might learn from it. I have Mr. Niedner's scrap book, photo album and many note books so if he owned the pistol there might be good chance to document it.

You can email me at mjpetrov(AT)acsalaska.net