Due to some physical handicaps about the only rifle I can use is a semi. I have a bar carbine in 06 but it is a tad heavy. It seems the only semi's available to me are Remington 7400 or old winchester 100's. which would you use and why ? I can't afford a benellii or the new Browning short track, but it isn't much lighter than my BAR carbine anyway. Any suggestion and your experiences with semi's would be appreciated. (I like the Win 100 but have heard bad thing,s about them)

I've done some hog hunting here in TX with a M1A and 165 grain Hornady SST's. Thing about semi auto's is alot of states don't allow them for biggame hunting. Check your state fish & game laws before as well as other state laws if you travel.

I really need to. Butch

In my younger days I hunted with a Garand on occasion, just to be able to say I did. Even back then it got awfully heavy at times. Did manage to take a nice forked horn with it one year, though. BTW, a buddy of mine has a real nice 7400 in 280 for sale if you might be interested

I have used the 7400 in .243, .270, and in .30-06. You won't get a single complaint from me on that model. It's very user friendly.

quote:

Originally posted by dSmith.45:
Thing about semi auto's is alot of states don't allow them for biggame hunting.

Pennsylvania is the ONLY state that does not allow semi auto rifles for hunting. They are legal in all other states that do allow centerfire rifles for big game hunting. Also, the five round magazine limit is not universal. I know Kansas and Texas have no limit, and there are probably a few others.

I'd like to try it with an Bushmaster 308, just to piss off the purists.

Hard Luck, I have harvested a lot of Whitetail and quite a few (25 or so) mule deer with a BAR in .270 Winchester. Mine has always shot around 1" @100 yards, and I have shot game in the 200 yard range often, a few mulies at 250-275 yards. All that said, I would just go with the BAR you have, there isn't going to be a significant weight savings in another semi, unless you go HP's direction of Bushmaster in .308, which I think would be excellent, but also a budget impact.

Good Luck--D.

How far do you shoot? If 150 yds or less a well tuned SKS with the right bullets will kill deer just fine. Neither classic or classy but it works.

I've killed three deer with AR-15's, deadest deer I ever shot. One simply collapsed straight down when I shot her. BTW, West Virginia has no magazine limit either.

The Remington 742/7400 rifles are pretty good from what I've seen. I think the Winchester 100 had a few problems...

I have shot a lot of deer with autos and will only shoot a BAR. WIll not own another M100 and will not own the Rem stuff. I too have some pretty severe physical issues going on and I'm trying to figure otu what to do about it as well. Was brainstorming with my best hunting buddy about i just last night. My BAR is too heavy, but it is really not that much different than a 7400 or even the M100 for that matter. And it is very accurate. I may get a BAR Lightweight .243 and see how that works out-just an idea I am tossing around right now. I have other issues besides weight to work out, so who knows! I may go with a very light weight single shot in 6mm or something. IF an auto jammed on me, i could never get it clear is one thing I am worried about. THe main thing is for you to just keep thinking of ways to get out there and hunt!!! I say stick with your BAR and see if there is something you can do with it.

Paladin, have you seen the new .224" 75 grain Swift Scirocco? That looks like it will make the 223 Rem a viable deer cartridge where legal.

And the new uppers in 6.8 SPC or 6.5 Grendel will make the AR legal deer rifle anywhere else.

I have shot several deer with my FN-FAL
I installed a scope .
I get 3-4" groups at 200 ,not great but it works .
I know several guys that use SKS out to 100 yds for deer ,with not 1 lost ,but a few eye brows raised.

Not sure how far you plan on shooting .

Johnch

HP Shooter,

So far I've used the 63gr Sierra soft point on two deer and the 69gr Sierra Match King on one. No exit wounds in four shots with either bullet.

I really like the Sierra 77gr MK in my 20" flattop but I doubt that it's a good hunting bullet, I may have to try the Swift and see how accurate it is.

I have never had a need for a semi auto on big game. Hunting is about making a good shot and putting an amimal down fast. Rapid fire is not part of that picture, IMHO. I don't know what your challenge is but, wouldn't a single shot, like a Ruger, be usable? It would make you concentrate on a good shot. That is the key.

I have always found a semi auto to be counter productive in shotguns. i do think that applies to big game too. Take a second longer to place the shot well. With a semi, I am thinking about the second bird before I kill the first one. I tend to limit out faster with a double. I make my shots count and therefore kill more birds faster. I bet I would do just fine with a single shot, if I could find a good one.

I also out shoot my buddies with a percussion double. Agin it come down to making the shots count, not so much skill. Most of them are quite good shots.

I know a few who hunt with a SKS. Seems to work and is cheap. Think I'll pop a pig with mine and see how it works.

Ruger's Mini-30 is reliable and light, and is accurate enough for shorter ranges, and you can easily mount a scope. It's a lot cheaper than a Bushmaster or other AR based firearms. I don't like the Win 100 jamamatic, and I think the BAR and 7400 are too heavy.

quote:

Originally posted by Scota4570:
I have never had a need for a semi auto on big game. Hunting is about making a good shot and putting an amimal down fast. Rapid fire is not part of that picture, IMHO. I don't know what your challenge is but, wouldn't a single shot, like a Ruger, be usable? It would make you concentrate on a good shot. That is the key.

I have always found a semi auto to be counter productive in shotguns. i do think that applies to big game too. Take a second longer to place the shot well. With a semi, I am thinking about the second bird before I kill the first one. I tend to limit out faster with a double. I make my shots count and therefore kill more birds faster. I bet I would do just fine with a single shot, if I could find a good one.

I also out shoot my buddies with a percussion double. Agin it come down to making the shots count, not so much skill. Most of them are quite good shots.

I hear that same rapid fire BS every so often. As far as I am concerned, it holds no traction.

I can unload ten shots into a 2 MOA target with a bolt action rifle at 300 yards in 70 seconds. Does that mean that I start flinging lead the moment I get a deer in my sights? And if I (and lots of other HP shooters) can shoot a bolt rifle that fast, does that mean we shouldn't hunt with them?

Get real.

Thank you for the imput. It seems my Bar in o6 is ok.(3shot 3/4 groups @100 yds) According to my range finder, the deer jump the fence 251 yds from my stand. I don't spray and pray. Most all my deer have been killed with one shot but it's nice to have another handy if need it. I need a soft recoil rifle. I have arthritius , neck and spine injurys bad I can barely work a bolt,lever or pump. My issue with the Bar is weight and it is a lightweight model with wood stock, 20" bbl.

I started deer hunting with a BAR in .243. My father liked it so well that I gave it to him, the light recoil just the thing for an over 70ish hunter. It has, for the last 30 years shot under 1" at 100yrds., and even though the normal shot taken is about 40 yrds., a few have been taken at 150-200. I hand load Speer 105 gr. slugs, and on the 100+ deer it has been responsible for harvesting, none ever required a second shot, however, there have been several instances where more than one deer was taken at the same time, the limit in TN being 3 per day, no more than one antlered per day.

My favorite feral hog rifle is a model 742 in 06. No complaints from me and the quick follow up shots are handy when shooting multiple piggys.

quote:

I hear that same rapid fire BS every so often. As far as I am concerned, it holds no traction.

I am not saying "spray and pray" I was refering to the mindset of thinking ahead to the next shot and comprimizing the first shot. I do it. Maybe I am the one with the problem and others don't do that. Best of luck.

I've hunted with autos, and can find no fault in them unless the weather is bad (like well below zero, freezing rain, etc). The ability to have the gun reload itself with no movement on my part has been very helpful in some cases. If you miss the first shot or hit a branch and the deer is looking around - at you - trying to figure out what that sound was and where it came from, the motion of working a bolt will give you away. With an auto, you already have a new one in the chamber and don't have to move except the trigger finger.

The lightest deer capable auto I have used is a sporterized chinese SKS. If centerfire .22's are legal for you, look at one of the ultralight carbon fiber AR types. I believe Bushmaster has one right about 5 lbs empty. The new .224 Scirocco ought to be an excellent deer bullet, as they have thick jackets.

Hard Luck, after reading your posts on the subject I'm still wondering a few things. If you're shooting an -06 then I'm wondering what you personally would characterize as 'soft shooting'. If you want a noticeably lighter recoil it will take a significant change in what you're shooting when one factors in your complaint about weight. Next question: You alluded to deer in the 250 yard range, is this how far you shoot or watch? I'm puzzled too about your difficulty in handling the action types you mentioned because most of the autos I've fooled with are more difficult to function when loading than any of the bolts/levers/pumps I'm familiar with. Some blot guns are so easy to cycle it's silly, but perhaps you've not handled such a gun. By easy I mean little-finger easy. I have a Model 94 in 30-30 that likewise can be cycled with a single small digit.

I can think of a number of guns that might help you out a fair bit but am mostly shooting in the dark as your specific needs are unknown at this point.

Deer under 125 yards, get the Ruger .44 carbine, old style(used) or new style. If you're stretching out to maybe 175 or 200 yards, maybe the Mini-30 after it's been accurized. HP Shooter's suggestion has some merit in regards to one of the Black Gun clones in larger bores, but you would be shelling out bucks for one of those.

If you would consider a single shot you might enjoy the NEF in .243 Win. They have a light weight model as well, not sure about chambering though. Some of the old Ruger #3s were made in mild chamberings, or as an alternative you can have a #1 chambered in any number of very mild cartridges, do a little nip on the barrel and add a composite stock and forearm and get the weight to a reasonable level. The action on a #1 is one of the easiest on earth to function. A guess on my part but I don't think a #1 weighing closer to 6 pounds than 8-9 would be hard to put together, and in something like the 6.5X55 Swede would be a solid 300 yard shooter.

Good luck in any case.

From your comments it sounds as if you stand hunt mostly, is that correct?

I have a couple of Winchester 100s in 308 and have had nothing but good luck with them. Although neither will be mistaken for a benchrest gun, both a good enough for deer out to 200 yards or so. I have used them when culling deer on high fence ground and find that 5 rapid shots are handy for that sort of job and also when hunting in thick brush. I have the 100 carbine set up with an Aim-Point sight and the 100 rifle (cut down) set up with a 2-7x Nikon ProStaff.

Jeff

Yes, I do hunt from a stand. Most deer I shoot are at the 250 yrd mark, they jump the Iowa fence into a small bean field. the 06 Bar kicks me very little and with the hinged mag. can load and unload it without much difficulty. The weight is a factor in carying the rifle to the stand and back, about a mile. My friends have to help me getin into a stand and get my deer out,I have no strength. My hands are so bad I can't tie my shoes. I appreciate all the comment's on the Bar, I can pop milk jugs with all day long at 300 yds. and the guy talking about shooting in the brush knows his stuff. I have sometimes shot and missed but the deer doesn't move so you have another ready. In my younger days I saw it a lot, cycling and action would cause the deer to bolt. Sure appreciate all the kind help you have given me. Guess I will keep using the Bar, instead of buying the neighbors Win. 100 as I don't think it shoots as accurately as my rifle. My old 88 win. sits in a corner crying to go hunting but I just can't operate it very well.
On a side note, last year I shot a nice buck at 180 yds walking in the brush along the edge of a bean field, when he hit an opening I shot and the buck came tumbling down the hillside. Boy was I happy as I just had prostrate cancer surgery 8 days before the hunt !
I shot my first buck in 1956, on the run in heavy timber with a trapdoor Springfield 45-70 which grand paw loaned me., Those were the days when I could scramble up and down the Ozark hills, no stand hunting, just still hunting through the woods.
Thanks again for all your help, it is much appreciated.

It would be hard to do better than the BAR you already have for the hunting your describe. The Win 100's that I have owned and worked with have been reasonably accurate and reliable, but not to the degree of the BAR and are not appreciably lighter.

Your only possible choice in a lighter gun would be an AR-15 type rifle in the new 6.8mm.

I have a 3.9 pound Bushmaster Carbon-15 .223 that I have killed deer and hogs with, but it's not suitable for 250 yard shots. Maybe you could move your blind closer to the fence .