Turning down a hammer-forged barrel.

18 November 2016, 08:50

loud-n-boomer

I have a Winchester Model 70 Stainless in .375 H&H and the barrel is in my opinion, way too heavy. I am contemplating turning it to a lighter contour, but am wondering whether this will adversely affect accuracy due to altering of the stresses induced from the hammer-forging process. I am interested in real-world experience, though since this is AR I know that I will get a lot of arm-chair theory thrown in.

18 November 2016, 10:01

metal

Seen it done on a HB Sako 75 in 6mm PPC, lost a lot of metal. Shot tiny groups before and after. I assume they are profiled at the factory after hammering and stress relieving so taking more off shouldn't be an issue.
Regards,
Metal.

18 November 2016, 19:10

matt salm

Only thing I've read about CHF barrels is that when you remove metal the bore will actually constrict in size rather than opening up like a button rifled barrel. This would most likely only be an extremely small amount. I don't think you'll see any accuracy difference.

18 November 2016, 19:23

dpcd

I don't deal in arm-chair theory; I only report on things I have actually done. And I have done this, actually on a M70 375 barrel, from the 1980s; it shot fine. I didn't shoot it before machining on it. They machine them at the factory, after hammer forging too.
Don't get it too hot. The worst barrel I ever turned was not hammer forged,it was made from extruded bar, cut rifled; it turned into a small banana after turning, but it still shot great.

18 November 2016, 19:31

ramrod340

Were the non-tang Ruger 77 MKII hammer forged? I took a factory 338Wmag and had the barrel turned and shortened 2". Accuracy before and after were the same. Even when the new contour was far from smooth and even.

18 November 2016, 20:56

dpcd

Yes, and before that they used Wilson, buttoned, barrels, of varying quality.

18 November 2016, 23:05

Duane Wiebe (CG&R)

Be careful how far you go with this. Saw enough proof of light weight stainless barrels failing a extremely low temp while I lived in WI.

Kreiger makes SS barrels all heavier than CM conterparts

18 November 2016, 23:53

speerchucker30x378

I don't turn many barrels anymore. I no longer have bluing tanks to reblue them after turning and in this day and age people buy what they want and don't try to bastardize existing guns like we used to do with the old Springfields, Mausers and Enfields. Before the advent of modern, stress relived steels barrels used to do a lot of kinky stuff when they were turned or cut down. Now days they are pretty stable and seldom give trouble. If you have something made from the 1980s forward, odds are it will be smooth sailing. The older stuff was kind of a crap shoot and one or two out of ten would show a bit of measurable warp. There is a reason that gunsmiths and barrel makers all had those windlass looking barrel presses back in the day. I haven't seen one of those antediluvian pipe squishers in fifteen years or more. Now days when barrels start looking to one side or another it's generally because some clown attempts to do triple salchow, leading into a double axle with a toe loop with their quad and catches a handlebar and does a lip stand.

19 November 2016, 02:42

Steve E.

speerchucker

That's pretty cool, I've never heard it described that way.

Steve......

19 November 2016, 07:10

speerchucker30x378

quote:
Originally posted by Steve E.:
speerchucker

That's pretty cool, I've never heard it described that way.

Steve......

I'm VERY, descriptive !

19 November 2016, 08:19

Rolland

quote:
Originally posted by speerchucker30x378:
I don't turn many barrels anymore. I no longer have bluing tanks to reblue them after turning and in this day and age people buy what they want and don't try to bastardize existing guns like we used to do with the old Springfields, Mausers and Enfields. Before the advent of modern, stress relived steels barrels used to do a lot of kinky stuff when they were turned or cut down. Now days they are pretty stable and seldom give trouble. If you have something made from the 1980s forward, odds are it will be smooth sailing. The older stuff was kind of a crap shoot and one or two out of ten would show a bit of measurable warp. There is a reason that gunsmiths and barrel makers all had those windlass looking barrel presses back in the day. I haven't seen one of those antediluvian pipe squishers in fifteen years or more. Now days when barrels start looking to one side or another it's generally because some clown attempts to do triple salchow, leading into a double axle with a toe loop with their quad and catches a handlebar and does a lip stand.

yeah what he said

19 November 2016, 09:02

Bobster

quote:
Originally posted by speerchucker30x378:
I don't turn many barrels anymore. I no longer have bluing tanks to reblue them ......."

Make you some PVC pipe steamers for $20 and re-kindle your practice.

Bob
www.rustblue.com

19 November 2016, 10:04

speerchucker30x378

Nnnaaawww thanks. If you're doing it right, life should get less stressful as you get older. I quite rust bluing 25 years ago. It was a bigger headache than caustic bluing. I quit caustic bluing 10 years back. After 25 years of trying to explain to people why you can't blue a gun for $50, I finally said fawk-em. After 25 years of whining, stainless steel has become mighty sporty and attractive to me. If they want it black, they can take it to one of the kids who play with powder coat, cera coat, diamond coat, coaty coat or painty coat in their garage and for $35, they will make it black.

LOL

25 November 2016, 18:42

Snellstrom

loud-n-boomer
I have the very same rifle you mentioned. Mine is extremely accurate however it is very heavy and I've often thought I'd use it more if it were lighter.
The other day I dropped it off at my gunsmith (Kevin Weaver) he is turning it down to .625" and shortening to 22" then adding a standing leaf rear and banded ramp front sight.
When it returns to me (most likely February) I will post results.
I too am curious as to the effect on accuracy but willing to take the chance.

26 November 2016, 05:01

loud-n-boomer

Thanks for the response Snellstrom. I will wait and see how yours turns out before I do anything.

26 November 2016, 06:05

Snellstrom

What contour were you thinking, were you going to bob it shorter?

26 November 2016, 08:15

loud-n-boomer

I was thinking something around a #4 contour and leave it at 24 inches.

26 November 2016, 21:05

Matt Norman

quote:
some clown attempts to do triple salchow, leading into a double axle with a toe loop with their quad and catches a handlebar and does a lip stand.

It only counts if one says 'Hey guys, watch THIS!' beforehand. Am told that in some parts it's okay if one states 'Here, hold my beer'

28 November 2016, 02:52

Blackbart2

LnB:

May not matter at all, but I am pretty sure that all the large bore Model 70 Bbls, which I think means .375 and up, are not hammer forged. I believe they are button rifled. I believe this is true for all of their stainless barrels. I remember reading that somewhere and see if I can dig up the reference.

Bb