We have been giving our bird dogs annual western diamond back rattlesnake inoculations (cheap insurance).
Just curious as to their effectiveness? Anyone had a dog hit by a snake that had the shot? How did the animal fare?

EZ

We have been fortunate and our dogs have not been bitten. We snake proofed our dogs and they are give snakes a wide berth; even forsaking birds that are near the snakes.

Snake inoculations are only good for a specific snake, so if the dog is bit by a different type of rattler, the inoculation will not be of any use.

quote:

Snake inoculations are only good for a specific snake, so if the dog is bit by a different type of rattler, the inoculation will not be of any use.

Not exactly true.

http://www.redrockbiologics.com/FAQ.html#2


What types of snakes does this vaccine protect against?
This rattlesnake vaccine was developed to protect against Western Diamondback Rattlesnake venom. It is most effective against this snake's venom.

Venom from many other snakes found throughout the United States is similar to the venom of the Western Diamondback Rattlesnake. Because of these similarities, this vaccine also provides protection against the venoms of the Western Rattlesnake (including the Prairie, Great Basin, Northern and Southern Pacific Rattlesnakes), Sidewinder, Timber Rattlesnake, Massasauga and the Copperhead. This vaccine provides partial protection against the Eastern Diamondback Rattlesnake.

This vaccine does not provide protection against the Water Moccasin (Cottonmouth), Mojave Rattlesnake or Coral Snakes. Red Rock Biologics is developing a variety of vaccines to provide the best protection against poisonous snakes for dogs in each part of the country.

Guys,
I find this a very interesting topic. Never knew that you could "innoculate" a dog against snakes.
I just keep some anti venom in the truck in a cooler box. The anti-venom needs to be given by drip. Just hopes it never gets to that....

Wm. Haas of the Miami Serpentarium successfully innoculated himself against many varieties of venomous snakes includeing he Cobras, Fer de Lance, and Australian Tiger Snake. He survived multiple cobra bites. Had interesting reactions to the venom long after most people would be dead. Some very psychedellic moments there.

Had my springer innoculated a year or two ago. Vet said its not a cure all but a head start and if you dog is bit you still need to high tail it to the nearest vet

Snake avoidance classes work well. (works on sight, smell and sound) but need a refresher every few years.
After the first class my springer was afraid to walk by a snake looking stick.

We float a lot of rivers here in Idaho and were taking a break on shore when the dog became a little skittish round a log and found this guy by the log


Just wish there was a skunk avoidance school. My springer doesnt seem to learn on skunks

My lab was bitten while we were in Kansas one year on a bird hunt.

There was a vet in the area but we didn't get to him for about 45 minutes. By that time her mouth was swelling pretty good. The vet gave her antihistamine. He said snake bites will not kill a dog but it will a human.

i have a austrailian cattle dog,
common name "heeler" that was bit 10 days after the booster.
head and neck swelled twice normal size.
found him after being missing all afternoon
about 7pm that evening.
he never seemed bothered by it,still eating drinking and a normal rate of breathing.
the next morning at 7am you couldn't tell there had been any swelling.
heeler dogs in my childhood after being bit by a snake would sull up ,lay in a corner and not eat or drink for days.
wife talked me into the snake shots and i admit i was skeptical, but now i'm a believer

From what I gather Rattlesnake Vaccine does not actually vaccinate against the damage of snake venom: it merely slows down its effects so that you have more time to get to the vet.


Both my dogs are vaccinated. I hope I never need to find out if it works.

Someone earlier said snakebites wouldn't kill a dog, just cause swelling and pain...

With a copperhead bite that is true, but a rattler that injects sufficient venom will definitely kill any size dog, and cause rapid organ failure. The dogs that just swell with a rattlesnake bite just didn't get sufficient invenomation.

While the vaccine provides good protection, and helps to neutralize the venom, I would always treat as soon as possible as well.

My nephew had his pit bull vaccinated. Got bit twice by a western diamonback. Head swelled. Vet said most likely the second bite had lots of poison. He said often a first bite will not have much venom but when second strike is needed it will contain a lot. He figured dog would have died had it not been vaccinated.

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
We have been giving our bird dogs annual western diamond back rattlesnake inoculations (cheap insurance).
Just curious as to their effectiveness? Anyone had a dog hit by a snake that had the shot? How did the animal fare?

EZ

I had one get bit last year on the face. It took about 1.5-2 hours to get him to a vet. I gave him a injection of dextamethasone (azium) before we started down the mountain to the vet. This limited the swelling. The vet administered some antivenom and other then a swollen head for a few days and a permanent scar above his eye he is fine. My understanding was that giving him the rattlesnake shot allowed the time (as did the dex) and allowed less of the expensive antivenom to be used (about 1/4 of what could/would have been used according to the vet but I don't know that for sure). So I guess I'm positive about the product, that was the first year I did the shot and I did it for all the dogs again this year. I would try to to get ahold of some lasix or dextamethasone to administer to reduce the swelling etc if you are far from the vet's office. Dex is the first shot the vet is going to give the dog when you get to his office anyhow.

When I was younger we raised english pointers for hunting quail. For some reason these dogs seemed to hate snakes and would kill them if the had the chance. The snakes we came across were copperheads and cottenmouths. They got bit from time to time with not much ill effect to the dog, besides localized swelling. I saw one of the old dogs get hit in the face twice by a copperhead one time. The vet gave him an anti-inflamatory. Our vet said he did not think this type of snake injected alot of venom most time with dog bites, and the most serrious problem would be swelling of an air way. I don't have any experince with rattlesnakes and dogs, but see how that could cause more problems as I belive their venom to be more toxic.

Any veterinarian who tells you a copperhead won't kill a dog has never treated many snake bites. Some of the obscure rattlesnakes on the plains (ther's one in the Dakotas) aren't bad but the eastern diamondback is the most toxic snake in North America. The western diamondback is not far behind. The moccasins are kind of variable. The moccason gives you all he's got with every bite. The rattlesnake can selectively vary the venom dose. There is a serious disagreement whether or not steroids do any good fro snakebites. DMSO will help slow swelling. The only real treatment is antivennin and if you don't need but one bottle you didn't need it in the first place. A friend of mine treats over 300 snakebites a year and he never gives less than 3 bottles.
I've treated hundreds of snake bites in the last 43 years and they are extremely variable as to envenomation and individual sensitivty. If it's a big snake you better give lots of antivennin.
Only had 3 coral snake bites and 2 died. The other one never had any signs. No broken skin either. One got it on the ear and one on the tongue.

I believe in dexamethasone but not everyone does. As I said there is some serious disagreement among the academics. I always give it.