If you don't, you should.
My Heeler got it AGAIN yesterday.
Head swelled up twice normal size, thou he never quit eating or drinking.
Back to normal this morning.
Normal for a Heeler anyway

Heelers are made of tuff stuff

Tell me the brand or maker please, I got too much money invested in my dogs.

Don't know Brand name
Whatever the Vet gives them

My vet says don't bother with the vaccine as it is not from the prairie rattler. The efficacy has not been proven as the vaccine is made from different snake venom. It also depends on where the dog gets bit.

I would suggest taking your dog to a rattlesnake breaking clinic and have him schooled to stay away from snakes. Our club puts on one very year with live defanged rattlers.

I read a/b it in the Vet column in the Retriever Journal,
I think the maker is Red Rocks laboratories,
Works on Western diamondback and similar snake venom, NOT water moccasin,
Both my Labs get it yearly. $ 25.00. Cheap insurance.
The desnaking is also a good idea. All of mine have had it too.

I was going to do it for my Wiemaranar but was putting it off for a couple months. He got bit under the jaw last Friday in my block walled back yard in a subdivision while I was at work. I have no idea how long it was between the bite and when I got home but he was swelled up plenty.

A $800 vet visit (no anti venom because you have to skip a mortgage payment to afford that) and a lot of care for 3 days and he made it through and is back to normal now. The vet did say that now he is vaccinated because of the bite. He also said that big, young dogs usually come through it. I had four friends scour the back yard while I was at the vet and they found no snake - I guess it left.

I'm in Arizona and here we do have a snake that the injections won't help. Called the Mojave Rattler - has a different type of venom - a nerve toxin. Basicly no hope if they get bit by one of those bastards. Touch and go for people too.

I will be starting to get regular snake vaccinations for my dogs from now on.

Gentlemen,

In regards to rattlesnake vaccine. My wife is a long time DVM she has quit offering it at our clinic. We've had two dogs have adverse reactions to the vaccine and die. The manufacturer is very put offish and won't answer direct questions about basic safety testing, protocol and effectiveness.

Please find all the information you can before vaccinating and make an educated decision knowing the risks involved. This vaccine can kill your dog.

As a rule of thumb a dog bit forward of the ears has a very good chance of surviving a rattlesnake bite. Bites on the legs, feet and tails generally have a higher mortality rate. I lost one of my favorite dogs to a bite in the neck several years ago. This was three days after he finished snake avoidance training.

BTW all of my dogs had rattlesnake avoidance training. It just doesn't work on some dogs (Hard headed German Hunting Terriers for instance.)

Surestrike's remarks mirror that given by our vet here in Prescott, Az. We are new to the area and began getting advice on vaccine for our dogs almost immediately, since the Prescott area has lots of snakes. At our first appointment with a new vet, she was tepid at best about both the vaccine and aversion training.

Basically, she offers these points to consider:

# the vaccine can cause serious side effects, especially in dogs with allergies

# the degree if envenomation from bite(s) is an unknown so there has never been a reliable way to determine the effectiveness of the vaccine

# the location of the bite on the dog is hugely important

# bite treatment protocol remains the same for patients who have been vaccinated and those who have not

# vaccine has no effect on wound site necrosis

# there is no vaccine for the Mojave Green, which has neurotoxic venom

As to aversion training, she believes it to be ineffective on dogs who have had previous E collar training and know the difference between when they are wearing the collar when they are not. No collar, no consequences.

She has treated several dogs that have had aversion training. Some have been bitten on more than one occasion.

Her practice treats several cases a year. In her experience, most bites occur in the field under uncontrolled circumstances when the dog and snake come together without warning and when neither the snake nor the dog knows the other is present. Bites under these conditions are unavoidable.

Nevertheless, beyond dealing with the potential side effects of the vaccine, she says it can't hurt, and freely gives them. She simply wants her patients' owners to make an informed decision and adjust expectations accordingly.

We have two labs. One has life long allergies. We're still contemplating giving her the vaccine. The other will get it soon.

I asked the Auburn University Small Animal Teaching Hospital practitioners about this and the response was largely what I figured. The "vaccine" is based off of Southwestern species, which being from Alabama, doesn't do us much good. And the recommended treatment is the exact same if you hadn't given the dose. A vet in the town I am from has marketed it to the unaware consumer and has made a lot of money. That's her ethical problem not mine.The vet I intern with has lost two to snakebites dogs in 35 years of practice. Antibiotics, steroids, and supportive care. One of the two was a jack russell female that belonged to a friend of mine. Bitten on the forearm by a really large eastern diamondback and apparently got the full bore. By the time she got to the clinic ~1hr after her bite, she was hemmorhaging badly from the wound and tissue necrosis was already present. Surestrike's info on bite location is precisely what I've been taught and seen in my limited career. If you don't mind my asking surestrike, where do you live and where did she go to school?

in the last 6 years we have had 4 dogs snake bitten- the last time was a dog that had been bitten before, so 5 bites in total( plus i also got bitten). we used to give the vaccine but don't anymore- mainly because we have 25 dogs and the cost was a bit much! when the last bite occurred a few months ago( on a dog previously bitten 3 years ago), we treated it with oral Prednisone and Benadryl. within 3 hours the swelling stopped and within 5 hours it had regressed almost to normal, with no long term effects. food for thought, as both drugs are cheap and readily available....

A note on the Vaccine: it does NOT preclude the need for care. The "Vaccine" simply SLOWS DOWN the venom reaction, buying you time to get the dog to a vet. Depending on the size of the dog it may buy you a couple hours.

Also note: the Mojave Green is actually a nasty combo Neuro-Hemotoxic venom. Even worse is that Mojave's have a known genetic defect where they might not grow a rattle at all. It's evolution at its finest. The "Rattle-less Rattlesnake".

you are absolutely correct. the pamphlet that came with the vaccine stressed that it essentially bought you extra time to get to a vet( and antivenin) and decreased the amount(and number) of VERY expensive vials of antivenin need to treat the bite. my 4 vet bill averaged $4500, ranging from $3500 to $5800 each. of course, the major component was the anti-venin at $700-800/vial. of course the human anti- venin version i received was a bit more-$3000/vial for 18 vials!! thank God for health insurance-( my 4 day hospital stay was billed at $72,000). we gave our dogs the vaccine for 3 years and in the meantime killed off the rattlesnakes around the ranch( killed about 150 over the 3 years). i have to think that the dog that got bit recently and did well with Predisone and Benadryl benefitted from having been bitten before AND receiving the vaccine....

Man that is crazy. I am only 26 years old, but have been in the woods since I was a young boy. In all those days, I can count the number of rattlers Ive seen on one hand. I think two eastern dbs, one timber rattler and a pygmy. Only encountered one cottonmouth on the ground, and have never seen a copperhead in the wild. Maybe I'm just lucky, or I am extremely unaware of my surroundings. I'd like to think it was the former.

I have been told the vac.works by some and not by others...we have given all our hunting dogs the vac. for several years now and have had several dogs bitten,I have not lost a dog since I started using the vac...have so much $ invested in each one and of course they are family ,I want to do all I can for them,I give all 10 dogs in our kennel the vac.each year...like the vet says it can not hurt them...like JDOLLAR we have killed well over 150 at our place in South Georgia and as many dry land cottonmouths as rattlers...we have killed so many I do not even skin them anymore...

same here, Kin. for a while my wife had me skin the larger ones and tan the hides for craft projects. after a while, she said "stop- i have enough". this year has been good. we killed 24 by the middle of June around the barn and house but we haven't killed any since then. last year we hit an all time high-85 scattered throughout the "season", all within 50 yards of my door....i look upon the vaccine a cheap insurance if you have a "working" dog. ours are basically just "home" dogs that don't roam, so we no longer vaccinate them.

you are right Jerry,as you know all of our dogs are in the field from Nov. to Mar.each year and with most of the working dogs in our area getting the vac.,the vet only charges about $25 for it and when we get our yearly shots it is included...cheap insurance indeed...

I've been practicing in rural South Texas for 37 years. We average 47 snakebite cases/yr. The Red Rock vaccine has proven helpful, but we've still lost dogs to rattlesnake bites that had been vaccinated . Snakes have the ability to control the amount of venom they release, according to recent research.We obviously never know how much venom they get. There is also a big difference in venom virulence or potency, depending on geographical location. Across the board, the most toxic venoms come from the Southwestern U.S., Mexico, and Central America.
Personally, I vaccinate my dogs every 6 mos. and carry antivenin and support meds when I bird hunt.I got snakebit when I was 12 and I have a healthy respect for rattlesnakes!

Interestingly attendant to this thread, I found a Mojave Green on my patio last night. I went out with my two dogs to supervise their nightly ritual and discovered the snake coiled on the cement against a raised planter.

One of my dogs was out in front of me and walked past the snake, within about a foot. I am at a loss to understand how my dog missed the snake. Had she turned her head even slightly to her left, both the dog and the snake would have been face-to-face.

It is very cool for our area this time of year, about 60 degrees. The snake was very sluggish.

Thank goodness my dogs are okay. The snake....not so much.

jdollar, both of my Labs have been vaccinated.
Picked up some Benadryl,prednisone and antibiotics for the travel bag.
If one of them gets bitten, how much do I give them ?
Any advice from one of you vets is also appreciated.
Thank you

we give ours 25mg Benadryl and 10mg Predisone. both are safe enough that overdose isn't an issue. the antibiotics are only used if signs of a bite infection occur in a day or 2.

quote:

Surestrike's info on bite location is precisely what I've been taught and seen in my limited career. If you don't mind my asking surestrike, where do you live and where did she go to school?

Model7LSS,

My wife went to Vet school at CSU, Ft Collins, Co. She has practiced in Arizona, Southern New Mexico, Northern New Mexico and currently she practices in and we live in Central Co.

thank you. My vet was smart enough to put the dosages on the bottles for me.

just out of curiosity, what doses did he recommend? our dogs are all small- less than 10 lbs and i prefer to err on the heavy side, as the drugs are not toxic..

My male weighs 90+, my female 60
Prednisone 20 mg
Male (5) daily, Female (3.5) daily
Rilexine (antibiotic) 600mg
Male (1.5) Female (1) every 12 hrs
Benadryl as per info on box (2) every 4 hrs