What performance are you getting and/or expecting at extended ranges? Specifically, expansion hardness/softness of the bullets you use.

Do you use an exceptionally soft bullet that will expand down to 1600fps or less, or is it even a consideration?

What do you do to compensate for a closer in target if you have very soft bullets loaded?

Thanks

Dave,

I believe you have a basic idea of how far a bullet "should" expand sufficiently to harvest an animal based upon the manufactures minimum fps for reliable expansion. Also, following the manufactures maximum fps as not to blow up a bullet on too close an animal. Simply running our bullet's muzzle vel through a ballistic program will get you a distance that is the beginning of how close you can get before you might start having catastrophic bullet failure.

One of my rifles I shoot LR is in 30-06 AI that can push a 180 BT and AB to 3000 fps. Based upon "opinion" (that I forgot where it came from) I determined the closest distance I could shoot an elk, with the BT, was 250 yds. Since both these bullets hit the same POI, when the spike elk popped out at 225 yds, I chambered the AB and killed him, still. My only complaint was, IMHO, it took too long for the bull to die. The hit was a double lung hunt, through and through. He simply ran a large 50 yd circle, coming back the original area the hit occured. He layed down but didn't lay his head down and expire for about 5 minutes. Had this been a mature bull he might have traveled quite a ways. I believe had I him him the BT, and knowing the max suggested muzzle vel is 3200, the quicker expansion would have ended things in seconds, not minutes.

One side hit with 180 Accubond.


Offside exit.



Alan

GSSP, elk are tough critters. I put 3 holes thru a 6 pt bull (800 lbs) right about where you hit yours with a 375 H&H Ackley Improved (300 gr. Sierra BTs at 2925 starting velocity). I was shooting at 340 yds and I misjudged the 30 mph cross wind and hit too far back in the chest diaphragm area. He did'nt drop until after the third shot and all the bullets opened up into beautiful mushrooms or the rough equivalent (found in underskin on opposite side). The heart lies 1/4th chest-depth up from where the front legs insert into the chest. Need to hit further forward. I've killed many bulls with 180 gr NBTs at various distances - they go down like they've been hit with a grenade. Regards, AIU

quote:

they go down like they've been hit with a grenade

200gr BT's out of a .338 do the same thing. Dead elk. Period.

GSSP- I have experienced both ends of the spectrum from soft bullets up close, to using a bullet too hard to have the effect I wanted on game. I was just wondering how the dedicated long ranger hunters ballance this out, and what is suggested when a bullet is at the end of its range of opperation, either on the high or low end.

Is there any thought given to a bullets effectiveness when getting to the lower end of its operating range? Does it matter on the shots killing effectiveness at all?

Part of the reason I don't use the mono metals ttsx, et. al, is that I don't have confidence in the bullet working well at under 2200fps.

Dave,

I strongly suspect when a bullet manufacturer states in writing a minimum speed for opening, they have done sufficient testing to prove as much. That said there are two monometal bullet makers that rate their bullets down to 1600 and 1300. Theoretically the distances involved are between 1200 and 1500yds--distances I wouldn't dare try an animal shot without a few years of practice.

I still have to wonder about bullet stability in flesh at extreme distances. Have seen some truely remarkable pictures of damage and wondered if it was infact caused by the bullet destabilising and tumbling the heart/lung area before exiting?!

Andy

Drew. I've primarly used the Nosler BT's and Accubonds out of my 7mm STW. I've only hit one antelope at 1000 yards. It was a broadside heart shot. The damage was much less dramtatic then say at 200 yards, but it did the job. Actually with that shot placement, any bullet would of done the job. The main reason for the AB's is they hold together much better on the short range shots. Even at 400 yards the BT's can leave a mess. At 200 or less the AB's are still pretty dramatic, do I try to keep to neck shots at those short ranges unless taking a running shot.

I know that the 300 SMK 338 bullet will expand in an Elk at 1400+ yards