Turnbull Restorations is now converting tang safety/rebounding hammer Miroku 1886's to J. Brownings original design.

They have my Miroku 1886 EL right now for conversion. Will be back in 4 to 6 weeks ... in time for moose season.

Why do people hate the tang safety?

I've got 2 Miroku M1895 Repros', a .405Win and .30-06. Both function perfectly.

So just curious...

Showing my ignorance here. Do these only have a full-cock notch, or do they also have a half-cock? If a half-cock is present, can the tang safety be ignored and simply use the gun as one would an original?

The tang models have a rebounding hammer, that some say gives light primer strikes. I have a tang 86 and 3 rebounder 94's and have never had problems. The tang safety 86's do not have 1/2 cock. Realistically, if you have a new one that works well, astetics is the only reason to have it changed. That said, at some point I would like to have mine converted to original specs too.

Demonical,

It's right where a lot of us want to put a tang sight. I'm not EVEN going to get into the trigger...

Rich
50-110 fan

That's a legit' reason I guess. I find my .405 is very accurate with the stock irons.

John Browning's original design for the 1886 is time proven and needed no modification. The tang safety/rebounding hammer mess is a corporate attorney's solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

The trigger on the Miroku/USRAC 1886 reproductions, including mine, is terrible, and seem to be beyond a gunsmith's means to set them right. The original trigger system was excellent as I expect the Turnbull restored trigger to be. Further, for some reason, I've found the tang safety to volunteer itself on without me being aware until I pull the trigger and hear that loud, hollow thunk from the rebounding hammer. I believe that half-cock as safety is more useful and safer, particularly in a dangerous situation. I'm a firm believer in K.I.S.S. ... keep it simple, stupid. And the Miroku/USRAC tang safety with rebounding hammer system is simply stupid ... detrimental to an otherwise excellent, classic rifle.

^ So what's the bill to get the rifle 'corrected'?

My guess is several hundren from Turnbull. Problem there is that you are going to tell yourself that while it is there, you may as well spring for the full case finish on the gun and-- a 50-110 or 475 Turnbull would be much more fun than a 45/70. So figure about $2500.00

Fellas, I completely understand the objections to the changes that were made, to J.M. Brownings original design. The half-cock safety is a great design. But let's also admit that, these rifles do work just fine, as is.

I can also appreciate that people with easy access to the great Doug Turnbull, would use his services, to correct these type issues. It would cost me far more than it's worth, living in this neck of the woods, to get this done, so I won't even contemplate alterations.

With my rifle, because of the rebounding hammer design, SAFE position for me is with the hammer let down. The damn thing isn't near the firing pin, when in that position.

The tang safety is an after-thought to me.

FWIW, I would never get my M-1895 Miroku .405Win changed to .475Turnbull. I could see taking a M-1886 Win and getting that done though, or one of the Repro' '86's especially. The .475Turnbull is Bad-Ass!!

Turnbull Restoration charges $350 for the procedure.

But let's also admit that, these rifles do work just fine, as is.
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Demonical,
My Miroku 1886 EL would have light primer strikes with over 50% misfires until my gunsmith repaired it.. Cost was less than $45.00 IIRC.. He didn't remove the tang safety however..
Glad to hear that your 1895's don't/didn't have this problem as I have two just like yours except my .405 is a TD still unfired after 3 years.. The 30-06 I bought like NIB but have never fired it..

This bull was shot last Oct. Two shots at 150 yards, shooting offhand. Bullet was the 200gr Nosler Partion.

Never had a light primer strike with either of my Miroku Repro's.

I think the Miroku/USRA 1886 EL is very well made. Miroku does excellent work. However, the design modifications were USRA's. The Miroku/Browning 1886s and 1895s were true to John Brownings designs and I probably should have gone with a Browning, but I wanted an '86 EL, and Browning didn't produce one.

Just minutes ago, UPS delivered my USRAC/Miroku '86EL back home from its visit to Doug Turnbull. Very quick service, and the work is beautiful!

No evidence of the despised tang safety or the rebounding hammer. I'm very impressed and happy. The trigger is much improved. Very neat work. Kudos to Turnbull Manufacturing; they are the best at what they do.

Now, have to put the FastFire back on and head to the "range."

Please give us a few photos when you can. I love to see those winchester lever guns!!

Here are my attempts at photographing my USRAC/Miroku 1886. I'm a virgin, so be gentle.











This is a hunting rifle, not a wall hanger, but she's mighty nice, IMHO.

Let's see if this works.

Forgot to add the picture of the tang-safety-less tang. Turnbull sure does great work.

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(Some day, I'll be more computer literate.)

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And again

great looking rifle!!

OK I have to say it.....Send it to Turnbull (nice work BTW) spend the $ to have it put period correct....then put a red dot on it????????

If I was interested in "period correct," I would have installed a crescent buttstock and a tang sight.

I much prefer the original half-cock safety and trigger. I found the USRAC/Miroku trigger to be terrible ... annoying. And the tang safety on mine would volunteer "on" some times, without my being aware. It now has half cock and an excellent trigger. Being rather picky about my gear, that's what I wanted and that's what I got. And the FastFire idea and mount came from Doug Turnbull and makes sense to me. Previously, she wore a Williams FoolProof, which I like, but for my old, tired eyes, the red dot works much better. And its small and low profile ...doesn't require me to alter my cheek weld. This is a hunting rifle, not a show piece.

Just had to pick a little Great rifle

Hey, Endgame, beautiful rifle. Would you mind sharing what the actual bill was on your safety change?

I just called Turnbull's and the $350 was quoted as a reweld on the safety but then the numbers went through the roof to get the gun "finished". Reblue, case the hammer, and was told blueing would not cover the reweld, so I needed a fully cased reciever....

Not going to work well on my engraved lwt.

Since the salesman didn't even know the stomper in their gallery was a current Winchester and kept telling me it was an in-house engraving job I wasn't very secure in the info I was getting. I have had Turnbull do a number of small projects for customers cover the years. Last couple have been dismal.

He would be my first choice for working on my engraved '86. But too many questions at the moment.

RDB ....
The charges were $350 for the basic restoration to the original design, $150 for trigger work and $100 to replace the flimsy fore arm hanger with a stronger part.

I was told that the welded tang might stand out when touch up blued, so I might want to reblue or color-case the receiver. I said no thanks - Its a hunting rifle, not a show piece. The hammer was a surprise when it arrived ... color-cased. Very nice.

The work looks top rate to me. I understand that the rifles that are .475s bearing Turnbull's trademark all began as USRAC/Mirokus and had the same conversion performed.

I am confused. This thread says something about restoring a Miroku 1886. Then 1895's float in, then it's about the tang safety, then it's the trigger.

Are we all talking about a japanese copy of the excellent 1886 Winchester rifle or what?

I got lost with the picture of the dead moose and the reference to not rechambering a 405 to 475 Turnbull.

Help......


Rich

I have a 1895 Browning that was rebored and rechambered to 375 Scovile by Dick Nickle for me a few years back. Shoots great. Makes a 405 look a little weak between 2 and 300

That help?

That's because the 405 was designed for sportsman who had the skills to get within a few yards of their quarry. Today the bowhunters still do that, most of the rifle guys need to shoot from far away.

Rich
DRSS

I asked Doug Turnbull last week what they charge to modify the 1886.

My question: "Can you quote me on removing the tang safety, reblueing the reciever and case color on hammer, forend end cap and lever?"

Turnbull's reply: "to weld the tang safty in and blue it it MAY show or it may no.

To do the work, diss, weld and polish the area, blue and color case the small parts, and reassemble would run $650." ($100 of that $650 was case color)

I took an 1886 Winchester (Miroku) deer hunting this year and pulled down on Bambi, squeezed the trigger and nothing happened. The hammer dropped as it should but nothing went boom. I checked the chamber and I had a round in the chamber. After several more attempts and 4 rounds run through action the deer moved on. Close examination showed the tiniest of scratch on each primer, but obviously not enough to do the trick. The rifle is now at Brownings repair center in Arnold Missouri. I'm not sure the cause of the failure but can only guess it's a broken firing pin???? It leaves me with a lack of confidence in the rifle. What is ironic is it must have broke on the last shot I fired at the rifle range prior to deer season? All test rounds were without a problem. How wierd is that?

Good thing you were not staring down that barrel at an angry grizzly!

Hello Strapman:

My Browning repro '71 had a complex firing pin/ bolt assembly that required the moon and stars to be in alignment--as well having absolutely no lube on it--to fire consistently in cold weather. I assume the Miroku/USRAC 86s have the same firing pin because mine acts the same way and will be fixed soon. It should be noted that, because of the rebounding hammer, the firing pin may be different from that in my gun.

Once the safety features on the pin and in the bolt are eliminated, the firing pin acts like a solid pin and fires reliably. If you're handy, you can likely do the fix yourself. When
you're finished, you'll marvel at the intricate machining made necessary by an over-complicated design, intended to solve a problem that didn't exist.

Dave Manson

Thanks Dave,
I appreciate your input. I need to talk to my gunsmith about this as I have no faith in this rifle. It wasn't real cold that morning when I was hunting, maybe 30 degrees. However, I'm still amazed that the rifle had to break on the last shot at the range on the last time I tested the rifle and I dragged it along on a hunting rifle completely unaware that it was broken. Strange coincidence.

quote:

Originally posted by Demonical:
Fellas, I completely understand the objections to the changes that were made, to J.M. Brownings original design. The half-cock safety is a great design. But let's also admit that, these rifles do work just fine, as is.

I had an extra light from the year 2000 run. After 100 rounds or so, the gun would not fire- leaving very faint dimples in the primer. There is very good reason to have your Miroku 86 converted by Tunbull!