Folks,

I have just put on layaway a 1886 xtra lite reproduction in 45/70 and am wondering if it is firstly drilled & tapped for a receiver sight and secondly is there a steel version of the Lyman 66wb to fit it and where can you get them from if there is ??

Thanks PC.

PC
I have one of the new 1886s and it was not drilled and tapped for the reciever site. My 1886 and 1895 Winchesters are currently off being drilled and tapped for Lyman 66 receiver sites. I did not pay enough attention to the sites to tell if they were steel or aluminium.
What ever they were made it will an improvement to the buckhorn sites currently on them.
Jim

It is my understanding that Lyman now makes all their receiver sights out of aluminum. I got this from them while trying to find a receiver sight for my Browning 1895 rifle.
Too bad. I'd much rather have one made of steel. I've got several of the Williams sights, and I don't much care for the aluminum. It seems much too fragile for serious hunting. JMHO.
Paul B.

Keep your eye on e-bay as the all steel sights come up fairly often. If the seller shows it in a plastic box it probably isn't steel. If the seller doesn't know or say what he has just have them check it with a magnet. If the gun knows what he has you will probably end up paying a little extra for a good one. Tang sights for the 94 and 86 show up here as well.
C.G.B.

Thanks folks,

I am hoping it is drilled and tapped for the Lyman site, I read somewhere else that they where. I am in Australia so it will be a bit of mucking about to get this rifle to Australia but apperntly they are a really nice gun.

Arkypete tell me more about the new version 1886 xtra lite are they smooth and do they feel and point good ?? How do you compare them to a Marlin 1895 ??

PC
Mine is the full sized take down model, 26 inch octagonal barrel with full length magazine tube. It's heavy, but absorbs hot loads real well. I've found the rifle to very accurate shooting off hand using a tang site. The problem with the tang site is if I grip the wrist of the rifle stock the tang site base gives me a whack on the thumb joint which really hurts after 20 or 30 rounds.
The action is smooth, without a single hitch. Trigger is rather nice and clean, not as nice as some of my bolt guns but nice. The whole rifle has smoothed out as I used it.
With the tang site I have no problem banging eight inch gongs at 100 and 200 meters. I'll shoot off hand at the hundred meter gong then shoot the 200 meter, back and forth. I'll shoot at the 300 meter 12 inch gong after adjusting the tang site. I get fairly regular hits as long as I take my time and squeeze the trigger.
I shoot nothing but cast bullets, 350 grain Saeco mostly and 445 grain Lyman when I'm feeling adventuresome. I think the 445 grain bullet is the more accurate of the two but the steel butt plate gets tiring after a number of rounds off the bench load testing, so I've not done any extensive accuracy tests.
I my opinion the rifle was made for cast bullets.
Jim

Thanks Jim,

I loved the look of the take down model as well but it was just out of my price range.


Have you used it on game yet ??

I've not taken 1886 hunting, but I have used my Siamese Mauser converted to 45-70 hunting with the 445 Grain Lyman. This rifle/bullet combination is very accurate and powerful. While I've never chronographed the load I'm guessing a velocity of 1,600 to 1,800 fps. I've never used water dropped cast bullets, to harden them, in this Mauser. Whitetail deer here in Virginia don't come armor plated.
For practice and playing I've used cast bullets from old 1950s and 1950s 45 Colt bullet molds weighing 255 to 260 with 12-14 grains of Unique. This load has the recoil and noice level of a 22 RF, yet will punch thru an 8 inch or 10 inch oak at 50 yards.
I have used the 45 Colt bullet load for squirrel hunting, thinking I could use the fronteersman technique of barking the squirrel. Shoot under the squirrel and the bullet would throw splinters etc into the critter, bring him down. Well, I had not refined my loads that well and a 45 caliber bullet does a lot of damage to a squirrel. I never barked a squirrel, blew a couple in half, shot the branch out from under them. took off their tail or head.
I finally decided that I may have been using too much gun for Virginia squirrels.
Jim

Jim,

an issue I am worried about with cast bullets is leading, also I have no castting equipemnt so I would buy already cast bullets if I where to ever use them. If I drove a gas checked 400gr bullet to 1800 fps say would you get leaidng ?? They seem really cheap compared to jacketed bullets, but I can not see them as being as devestating on game say as the 405 gr rem soft. But rather they would be like a full metal jacket military bullet

I have shot a lot of game down here in oz with my Marlin 1895 and various 300 gr & 400 gr jacketed bullets the toughest being the woodleigh 405 gr flat nose 45/70 bullet, would be good for your bears and bigger stuff.

PC:
My 1886 ELR came drilled and tapped for receiver sights. There is a benefit to the aluminum sights. Being lighter than steel they stress the attachment screws less under recoil forces. I have a Foolproof on mine and will eventually replace it with the Lyman as the Lyman allows rapid adjustment between predetermined vertical adjustment points.

You'll like the rifle and the overall quality of manufacture. If you have large hands and plan to shoot heavy loads be prepared to modify your grip within the finger loop as it is relatively small and can beat your middle finger up pretty good if you shoot many rounds. A leather glove with the finger tips cut off also helps protect your middle finger.

I shoot only cast in mine and with good lube it does not lead to any extent at all.

PC
The whole trick to cast bullets is size of the bullet, the diameter. If your bullet is .459 or .460 diameter with even a 50/50 Alox lube you'll be fine. With the same size bullet with one of the the new super lubes, LBT, Rooster Red, one of the other hard lubes you'll be in even better shape.
I found two cast bullet makers that will size bullets to my .459 or .460 diameter. I'm working my way thru 500 385 grain .459 gas checked bullets that seem to be just about perfect.
A word of caution, clean out the copper fouling, the copper fouling will result in leading and pour accracy.
My barrel did not need any breaking in and I'd bet your's will not. Just clean out the copper.
I've found that IMR 4064 works well for lower pressure near top velocity loads, with heavy bullets, works well, IMR 4198 does well with 370 to 405 grain bullets, IMR 3031 does well across the board but to me has more recoil, Rl-7 does well with 350 grain bullets at top end velocity.
Did I mention about cleaning out the copper fouling?
I've not shot a jacketed bullet thru either of my 45-70s in 30 years. I've still got several hundred Remington and Winchester 405, almost forgot Speer, jacketed bullets down at the loading shed that I have no earthly use for.
Jim

Well thanks for the heads up folks I may keep this win 1886 for cast bullets if I do not convert it, I will purchase a lyman 66wb for it aluminium or not.

In regards to purchasing already cast bullets how do you tell if they have a hard enough lube on them to stop leading ??

My reason for buying the 1886 extra lite was to have an action long enough for the 50-110 round which I would definitely learn how to cast bullets for due to lack of flat 50 cal bullets for tubeular mags.

Stocker,

My hand are probaly a tad bigger than some guys, I am wondering if you could purchase a large loop lever for the 1886 or have your smith make one up ??

If you have pics of your 1886 I would like to see them. How do you think it compares to a Marlin mate ??

PC: I don't know of a source for a larger loop. A good smith could make some modifications to the existing loop and I think if you do a search for Wild West Guns (I think they are in Alaska) you can see some modifications they do to lever loops.

Sorry have no pics and no way of posting them. You can also usually find pictures at the various gun auction web sites.

The Marlin and Winchester are slightly different concepts in that the Marlin allows center line scope mounting. The Winchester is quite true to the original design with the exception of some changes to the trigger and hammer operation and the addition of the tang safety to satisfy the legal beagles.

As far as action strength I don't think there is much to choose between. I have fired test loads in my 86 that exceed any published load for lever guns and found no signs of stress except to me. The recoil from a light rifle is significant.

If you are buying cast bullets as opposed to making your own simply ask the maker what lube he is using and asking what hardness he is turning them out at. LBT Blue is considered to be a very good lube for top end loads in these caliber types and some of the casters specify their use of it. I have had recent dealings with a gent from the US to supply a heavy 348 bullet (255 grains). If I find them to be accurate I'll end up ordering my own mold from NEI. He uses LBT Blue and makes his bullets hard enough for the velocities I want to operate them at. You can contact him by e-mail at wdoudna@hotmail.com . He also has a web site at www.customcastbullets.com. Nice guy to deal with by the way and very thoughtful in corresponding with his customers.

Fit, polish and finish are to my eye superior in the Winchester however it is also a significantly more expensive rifle. If you are thinking of reworking a rifle to a larger caliber I believe the Winchester is a better platform to start with as fewer internal modifications will be required.

The choice for me was based on the fact that there is little traditional use of Marlins in the area I live. I have seen more Marlins in 45-70 being used in the last ten years than I have seen in all other calibers combined over the past 50 years. We just grew up seeing, shooting and owning Winchesters and it is ingrained.

PC:

When I referred to modifying my grip within the finger loop I was referring to placing my middle finger outside the loop when I am doing a lot of shooting at the range with heavy loads.
I invariably forget until I shoot the first one and with a bit of arthritis in that finger I am abruptly reminded.

Thanks for the help stocker. I am lookin forwards to this rifle a lot mate.