Having thoroughly tested three BSA scopes I suggest you buy a low cost Bushnell. My experience with 2 2.5 power shotgun scopes and a 3x12 Contender BSA scope have poisened my opinion of them.

First of all forget the 30-30 and go with a larger caliber. I have many Winchester's and several Marlins. I kept the .375 Marlin and got rid of the Winchester .375 BigBore because I neede a scoped rifle. Pleanty of gun for bear and deer and hogs up close. Really puts them down. I also have a 38-55 Winnie but it is a full octagon '94 and a little heavy. I have been shooting a Marlin 444 recently and again it is great on bear. Very good with heavy bullets and with hard cast 310 grain as well. Some of the micro barrels are not as good with cast bullets. I have been working on tuning a .35 Remington also in a 336 Marlin but so far it has not found its load for accuracy and velocity with the heavy for caliber loads. My other favorite is a Winchester '86 in 45-70. It is very heavy as it also has the full 30 inches of octagon and tube. I tend not to hunt with it for that reason.

My best so far is my model '71 in 450 Alaskan which is good for everything that walks. It is very stout and a lot of fun to shoot. Sometime soon I will get a chance to hunt with it.

Yes I do have several 30-30's as well and have killed several deer and pigs with them but honestly feel thal the larger calibers are better for nearly any hunting situation, especially in heavy cover.

I used to enjoy shooting open sights and peep sights and still have the old buckhorns on some of the rifles. The Marlin 375 has a burris mini 4x. The 444 has a Leupold 2.5 compact. The model 71 has a Williams peep without aperture. I also have a Savage 99 in 300 which carries an old Weaver pivot mount with a Weaver 4x on it. The '94 in 38-55 has a Lyman tang as does the '86 along with the original ladder sights.

I guess there is a different use with the different calibers.

Good luck with yours.

Frank

I'll hazard a guess or two:



The receiver platform of the Win was not designed for scope mounting and the Marlin platform was not accomodating for a scope until the middle of the 1950's when drilling and tapping was done on privatley owned Marlins and then this was practice was adopted by the Marlin factory.



Later of editions of Win XTR's named angle eject models were factory drilled and tapped for scope mounting.





Fit and Finish of original Winchester XTR models was and is superb compared to Marlin.



I've hunted Deer for 45+ years now, using 44mags, 30-30's, 270's, 308's, 338's, 444's, lever 375's. And right behind me hanging on the wall is a head mount of a 14 point, A-typical Mule Deer that dress out at 300 lbs. shot by my Dad with his 30-30! Can send you a picture. But guess what I take two rifles when hunting and one is ALWAYS MY MARLIN STAINLESS 30-30 with a 4x, stainless Weaver rifle scope.



When hunting I reach for the rifle of choice it's my thutty-thutty most of the time.



No matter what there is something magical about hunting with a lever action caliber more than 100 years old; and a bit more skill is required.



90+ per cent of all Deer are killed within 150 yards and my thutty knocks'em just as dead as if I had shot one with my custom 338 mag...but there is no magic with the 338.





For some reasaon when I walk the Sandhills of Western Nebraska, Valentine area and I am carrying my lever action, I could swear that sometimes when coming to the top of a Sandhill and the wind in my face I hear in the distance war yells of Souix Dog Soldiers and the bugle of the 7th calvarly....hunting is not always about killing.

The current Winchester 38-55 can be had for around $1700. It's a collectable and not meant to be a hunting rifle. If the rumor mill is true then Winchester will have a 38-55 legacy and Trails end for '05.

There is absolutely no problem scoping an angle eject '94. The one I use the most is a Black Shadow 30-30 rifle with Weaver K3 in Leupold mounts. Three shot one inch groups using 170 Silver Tips are the norm. I use the rifle so much for deer because it is light and really gets the job done.

Frank, let me say first off I do not object to the "Keith theory" in any regard. OTH, I don't think the 30-30 qualifies as a rocket in any sense, though that is a subjective evaluation on my part. To the point though, I'm at the phase in life that I can no longer recall with any precision the number of deer and hogs I have shot much less those with a Mod. 94 in 30-30. I've yet to recover a bullet from any, and the site where the deer stood when shot looks like a Sam Peckinpah movie set to my eye. It usually include chunks and parts and a LOT of blood. Blood trails are generous to the point of absurdity, both with Rem Core-lokts and my own handloads.

I recognize the advantage of large bores and large meplat area in the terminal phase, and the disadvantages in regards to exterior ballistics. You want to use them, then great! I do too, but it is for my amusement not from necessity. I think you're going WAY out on a very flimsy limb when you wax critical of the 30-30. It has probably killed more deer/hogs and who knows what else, than most if not all of the other cartridges combined. IIRC it killed one of the largest griz ever killed in N.A., but I wouldn't be so silly as to recommend it for such an endeavor.

Good hunting!

Now Dan, I don't think I was putting the 30-30 down at all except to say that is doesn't work for me as a heavy brush gun for bear, hogs or for deer. I do have several and have used them for a variety of game over the years including Mule deer in Utah. I will admit that I used to use the 150 and 170 grain factory loads and not the 255 to 315 grain loads I use in the larger calibers. It is a well documented fact that the 30-30 has killed lots of everything since way back so no argument there. I guess I just believe that heavy is better in heavy brush and rough terrain where an animal that isn't dropped right now can end up in hellish canyons just a few hundred yards away. Those that do are just easier to track with bigger holes in them.
Frank

Well alrighty then, NEXT SUBJECT!

Ah Dan, brings me back to the days of the "Wild Bunch". That crazy Mexican General saying, "You want Angel, We give you Angel". Then the sh#t hit the fan. One of my favorite movies. William Holden, dawm fine actor.

Properly used a 30-30 is as good as anything else..I have killed a number of deer, antelope and elk with a 30-30 and never had a problem...

I always limited my shots to 200 yards on deer and antelope and most elk were shot at 50 to 150 yards...

Remember a 30-06 or a 300 Wby becomes a 30-30 at some point and noone seems to think shooting an elk at 400 or 500 yards with a 300 Wby is a problem...

A properly constructed bullet at a decent velocity will kill anything if you stick it in the right spot...

I hunt deer about every year with a 25-35, never shoot further than 100 to 150 yards and it kills them..and I let a some big boys walk away because the are just out of range, but I have shot my share to the big bucks and leaving them for someone that reall wants one doesn't bother me at all..maybe some kid will get that big'un....

Use the 30-30 right and it will serve you well, and you will be the better hunter for it...

I grew up in Western Colorado and in 1952 my dad bought a Winchester 98- 30/30. You couldn't put the deer in my house that was killed with that rifle. Mule deer, Elk, mountain lions, white tailed deer, antleope and other things have been taken with it. I shot my first deer with it and made some shots no body would believe. I still have it oiled up and put away. If you really want to see what the old 30/30 will do, go out to Western Colorado or Eastern Utah and go up in the hills to a sheep herder's camp. They have packed one since they were born and can shoot a running coyote from a horse anyday. I have Marlin .41 magnum lever I like to shoot.

quote:

Originally posted by beltloop:
No matter what there is something magical about hunting with a lever action caliber more than 100 years old; and a bit more skill is required.

One of the main reasons I prefer to use a Lever Gun. And yes indeed, hunting is not always about killing. (Well, it is nice to bring home the bacon........)

I have a great respect for the 30-30, 25-35, 38-55 and 32 Special..I have used the 30-30 and 25-35 extensively over the year, still do on Idaho Mule deer...It takes me back in time, tests my skills as a hunter not a shooter...and they kill very well indeed with a proper shot placement, much like a .470 it takes proper placement of the bullet.....

I wouldn't consider putting a scope on a rifle that is ment to shoot game at under 200 yards, I don't need a scope at under 200 yards...If I scope a gun it will be a flat shooting long range rifle like a 250 Sav. on up...