Most all 'lampoon' the 450, and when this caliber was introduced it was the short barreled version. Later, when Marlin got an IQ boost they introduced a 22" barrel model 450.



Here are my questions and so far I have not been aware of these questions being answered:



I think a long barreled 45-70 will out perform a short barreled 450 M!



Will a short barrel 45-70 out perform a short barreled 450?



Will a long barreld 450 out perform a short barreled 45-70?



A long barreld 450 vs a long barreled 45-70...which has the edge....



No mix and match parts: same poweder, same bullet, same primer, same make of case...!





Is there a velocity difference favoring one or the other?

Again, loaded to their potential in Marlin lever guns of similar configuration the 45-70 Gov't and 450 Marlin a virtual ballistic equivalents. They are different cartridges and reach their potential with different powders.

Hodgdon #27
Marlin 1895 45-70 Gov't 24" barrel
400 grain Speer Flat Point, 2.54" COAL
Winchester brass
CCI 200 primer
50.5 grains H4198 MAXIMUM 2002 fps 39,400 CUP

Hodgdon 2003 Annual Manual
Marlin 1895 450 Marlin 24" barrel
400 grain Speer Flat Point, 2.52" COAL
Hornady brass
Winchester Large Rifle primer
52.5 grains compressed H322 MAXIMUM 2023 fps 41,900 PSI

The belt has little effect other than to prevent chambering in a 45-70 and magnums.

you can load the 45-70 to do anything the 450 Marlin will do in any barrel length

I'd like to see printed facts....and mathmatical stat's showing this..

Do you know what the belt is for? Well, it isn't really there for increased strength, it is for headspacing the cartridge in the chamber. Rimless cartridges headspace on the shoulder, rimmed cartridges on the rim and belted cartridges on the belt. I wish this old wives tale of MAGNUM catridges having the belt for containing increased pressures would finally die and go away.

The internet is running over with 450 vs. 45-70 questions. The 450 was a brain fart of some junior engineer at Marlin trying to save his ass and job. The 450 will disappear just like the 225 Winchester did...another useless cartridge invented to replace something that already existed (22-250). The 450 is a sales gimmick intended to boost sales under the guise of being a more potent round than the old stand-by. Now, if you THINK you're better off with a 450, then buy one.

Okay, now with the 450 having higher working pressures what about comparisons with heavier bullets when fired in barrels of equal length?



All other elements the SAME!



How significant is the 'BELT'on the case of the 450...?

Loaded to their potential in Marlin lever guns of similar configuration the 45-70 Gov't and 450 Marlin a virtual ballistic equivalents. Some say the edge goes to the 45-70 because of slightly greater case capacity, but the difference is insignificant as the 450 Marlin can be loaded to somewhat greater pressure due to a smaller cross-sectional area interfacing the bolt.



Hodgdon #27

Marlin 1895 45-70 Gov't 24" barrel

350 grain Hornady Round Nose, 2.54" COAL

Winchester brass

CCI 200 primer

54 grains H4198 MAXIMUM 2191 fps 39,300 CUP



Hodgdon 2003 Annual Manual

Marlin 1895 450 Marlin 24" barrel

350 grain Hornady Flat Point, 2.53" COAL

Hornady brass

Winchester Large Rifle primer

58 grains compressed H322 MAXIMUM 2196 fps 42,300 PSI

The purpose of the belt on this round is to prevent high pressure ammo from being loaded in trapdoor Springfields and the like.