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One of Us |
anyone ever use this caliber, .444 Marlin, to take an elk, if so how did it work out. | ||
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| One of Us |
not that big but the 375 works just fine. | |||
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Since this is the lever gun forum I assume you mean the 375 Win. We know that the H+H will do it. The 444 is a great round as well. The one I HAD I loaned out for a hunt + it never came home. Still, have all my brass + dies, just no rifle. Never mistake motion for action. | |||
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As long as the ranges are under 200 yards it well be a decent elk cartridge. AS long as you use a good stout bullet in it. If you live in elk country and have a lot of choices and time and where and when one hunts. But if I was traveling to elk country a ways I would use one of the better rifle cartridges. When your a out of state non resident hunter good changes at elk can be rare. | |||
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P dog has good advise. You really limit yourself using a 444, 45-70, 30-30 and 25-35 on elk in that you will or should let some big bulls walk, because the range was too far, when a 30-06 or larger would have worked.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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True. Just because I think it's a fairly good round doesn't mean that that would be the one I chose. I still love the 375 H+H + although it might be considered 'overkill' I already own one that I am confident in. Never mistake motion for action. | |||
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yep the 375 win. I hunt the same ground you guy's do on a DIY hunt here. bringing a lever gun to hunt Elk on a ranch would increase your chances over mine by about a 50 to 1 ratio. I still take one of the 375's [2 lever guns and a shorter case length revolver] from time to time and deal with the consequences of what happens that day. sometimes it works out for me sometimes it don't. | |||
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Some years back there was a Canadian guide on the Marlin Owners forum who used a .444 on a couple of grizzlies and said he was satisfied with its performance. I don't recall what the bullet was. Obviously range with any large bore lever action cartridge is a limitation but it's no more unreasonable than say using a double rifle with open sights in Africa is. If that's what you want to do than go for it and have fun. Getting close just adds to the accomplishment. Roger ___________________________ I'm a trophy hunter - until something better comes along. *we band of 45-70ers* | |||
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https://cuttingedgebullets.com/44-240gr-handgun-solid These are what I shoot in mine. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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going to shoot Hornady 265 gr. Flat points. Yes, a shorter range weapon with those limitations, but I shot a bison bull with this rifle many years ago, it walked about 50 yds after I shot it from a sitting position from around 55-60 yds so as long as I do my part Im sure it will kill an elk. Was just looking for anyone who might have done this already for their feedback. | |||
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i luv my 444, tc encore with a 23" MGM barrel. i use 300gr fn gc(saeco) and some 2400/dacron that goes 1624 fps. its heck on deer(avg 150lbs). i would use it on elk except the velocity would be 2000fps+. “All that was great in the past was ridiculed, condemned, combated, suppressed — only to emerge all the more powerfully, all the more triumphantly from the struggle.” ― Nikola Tesla | |||
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Bob Milek wrote a piece about using a 444 marlin on a moose a bunch of years ago... IIRC he wasn't that impressed. Still, a 240 gr 44 caliber bullet at 2400 fps aint going to hurt... | |||
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Well, Bob wasn't impressed with much that wasn't a single-shot handgun. Not that that's wrong but that is where his primary interests did lie. I read his column for years in Guns+ Ammo + he did know his stuff. Never mistake motion for action. | |||
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http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/ you can use this forum on the 444. “All that was great in the past was ridiculed, condemned, combated, suppressed — only to emerge all the more powerfully, all the more triumphantly from the struggle.” ― Nikola Tesla | |||
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| One of Us |
The best 22 that I own (along with the Winchester 63) is the Marlin 39 that I have owned + shot since Christ was a Corporal. Never mistake motion for action. | |||
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My post referred to a practical standpoint to answer the question, listing the probable that can foul success...That said if one wants to shoot elk with a 444 and realizes the difficulty factor then more power to him or her..It would be a sporting obstacle to add to the hunt for sure.. I shot a number of elk and a ton of deer thru grade school and High school and college to a lesser extent with a 25-35 Win. and I still do from time to time, and yes its a challenge and I have had to pass on some mighty big bucks and bull elk..If you want to see a really big bull, then pack a rifle that not fit for shots beyond 200 yards, the big ones show up at 300 or so every damn time!!!   Quoting elk kills with sub calibers doesn't prove or even mean a damn thing, its a stunt, that's it..Many elk and deer have been killed with all sub calibers but not at long distance and elk hunting is expensive even a DIY hunt, why complicate that with a rifle that won't perform...Elk rifles start with the 30-06 and go up from there..Ive seen miserable results with the 45-70, 348, 30-30, 250, 300 Sav. and others and Ive seen success with the same.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Elk hunt done. 7x7 bull, 3 shots with the .444 with Hornady 265 flat point reloads. 1 slug recovered, expanded to .714 in. dia, remaining weight of recovered bullet was 250.0 grs. Pics available but need some help in posting | |||
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Three shots is an indicator your shooting a sub caliber for the job at hand in many cases, but you did well..I can say the same for my old 25-35 Win carbine, it didn't use to worry me, but as I age I have more confidence in my 06 and 338..A lot has to do with my lack of ability to take off on a long blood trail that goes in the worst of spots... Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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What are the circumstances of the shots? Can't say it's a marginal caliber whithout details. Would the first shot have killed it, but you had time to pump more shots. Were the first shots around the edges? Plenty of elk have taken 3 magnum hits before they go down. Same story no matter what the caliber, need all the details before a rush to judgment. | |||
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The .444 Marlin i would qualify as a darlin' and if I was going for elk I would tighten my belt 'cause a 629 I'd be packin'. That's one verse. | |||
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I don't know about sub caliber Ray. he is shooting a lever gun and multiple shots are certainly a possibility in a short period of time. on a big Elk you shoot till they are down,, or go get them out of the bottom. i'll take the extra shots every single time if I can. | |||
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additional info on the shots: #1 about 70 yds broadside off 3 leg shooting sticks, was a good center mass hit behind left front leg, no reaction from elk, he just turned and walked away. waited a few minutes and went in to where he stood, followed trail we think he had been on, after 40 feet or so found decent blood pool in trail, looked it was coughed up/out of mouth. kept following trail and found some small blood spots in leftover snow. #2 shot, also from sticks after we came over small rise and saw elk lying on ground, he got up and as he turned I fired #2 on left side, later determined to be back thru gut area. This shot about 45 yds or so based on later rough step off. #3 Shot from 20 yds or so after we caught up with elk and had circled to left to close range, elk had hard time while trying to stand, never did get on his feet at this point and it was obvious he was hurt bad from prior 2 shots, my decision to shoot 3 time was as much to end suffering for the elk, guess I could have waited him out to die, but hate to see that in an animal. So if 3 shots were needed, I would have done the same with a bigger caliber. Only pass thru on elk was the 3rd shot from the close range. the 1 recovered slug did its jb, we found it on the off side right in line with the lungs, which we found damaged during field dressing. Done Africa a couple times, there its keep shooting if its moving and I used same theory here on this hunt. Hope that explains things better (especially for Ray) willi | |||
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It sounds to me like the first shot was all that was really "needed" to kill the animal, since it was down when you saw it after the first shot. I suspect it would have died soon without the other two, but as you said, they were more to end the suffering than to just kill. Shot placement means more than caliber as long as it's adequate to begin with. One shot , one kill | |||
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Sounds like it worked just fine. I do not see a 30-06 working any better at hat range. The big advantage of th 30-06 would be the ability to minimize bullet drop at longer distance. Perhaps it might penetrate better if you used a very soft bullet in the .444. | |||
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Sorry but all it explained to me is he followed a poor blood trail a long ways before he got his elk, that sort of thing is what I call being undergunned..that's how elk get away and are never recovered..Ive never had an elk go more than 30 yards with a .338 Win. and Ive shot a lot of elk, and Ive recovered a lot of elk for our hunters, some of which were lost,when the old bull got into a bunch of cows and moved to Montana or went into a hell hole in a deep canyon of black timber and swamp, and I have to say most of those elk were wounded by hunters who were undergunned with various calibers are shot too far away in some cases. That's what it explained, especially to Ray.. Ive shot elk with some real light calibers like the 25-35, 250 Savage and 30-30. Got close and placed my shot, most went down to the shot, a couple ended up with some damn long tracking jobs..Thats why Im an advocate of a hunter using the largest caliber he can shoot well. Long tracking jobs in the Selway for instance can ruin several days of a hunt,and my dispostition as well..Im retired now, but I have a good memory of those hard times. What someone hunts with is his business not mine, but don't expect me to agree with something I don't believe in.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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My thinking also, if I get a shot at a 7 x7, I am shooting until down. If I can get in 3 shots before it falls I will. I am not one who stands and looks while the game runs over the hill. The comment that it was poor placement is unwarranted unless you were there and saw it yourself. | |||
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I agree keep shooting ammo is cheap compared to loosing it. Or having get into some place hard. | |||
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I won't argue that keep shooting if you have to but Im looking for a knock down on elk, I want them down at the shot, and most of the time they do that with a larger caliber...If your of a mind to use a gun and have to keep shooting then just wait, sooner or later that big bull with go to the bottom of the divide and you will have to pack him out, or he might never be recovered!! To each his own on light calibers for elk, Ive been on both ends of that rope. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Bisonhunter, glad you killed a fine bull. There are some excellent discussions about the .444 at Marshall Stanton's Beartooth Bullets site when the site is fully functioning. Friend Pete Thorniley has used his extensively in Africa with heavy cast. There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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| One of Us |
My 444 disappeared a couple of years ago + no one seems to know where. I hate that. Never mistake motion for action. | |||
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| One of Us |
On the Marlin owners forum there is a gentleman that goes by the handle Yukon254. He lives and guides in the Yukon for grizzly, moose etc. Like any guide he needs a rifle to do two things, finishing an animal going away wounded and stopping one coming at him. He's a big fan of the .444 Marlin and says it's entirely adequate. If I remember correctly he uses 300gr cast in his rifle. Given his experience I tend to believe him. But what does he know, he only lives and works year round with big bears.  Roger ___________________________ I'm a trophy hunter - until something better comes along. *we band of 45-70ers* | |||
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I've killed a bunch with archery gear Shoot any animal thru the lungs and they will die. If you can not follow a blood trail you should not be hunting. I never had an elk go more than 75 yds after slicing up their lungs with a broadhead. Trick is not to barge right in and kick them out of their bed. | |||
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Being a fellow bow hunter I fully agree with you. Roger ___________________________ I'm a trophy hunter - until something better comes along. *we band of 45-70ers* | |||
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My dad bought me one when I was a young teen in 1968...The old style with the high Monte Carlo stock,no pistol grip and 24" barrel ....Boy did I love that Rifle and thought I was Robert Ruark with it...No Elk but many Dead Deer,Armadilos,Turtles and Nutria! So wish I still had THAT one but it was stolen years later! I will say I could fire it fast like the Rifleman ! I would think the 265 thicker jacket is way better than the 240s! I wouldnt hesitate to use it on Bear like the Yukon Guide because you could sling lead like a BAR!  "That's not a knife..THIS is a KNIFE" ! | |||
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If I was hunting out of state, paying a non-resident license fee, I'd pick a caliber much more powerful than a 444 Marlin. You may only get one chance at a shot, 20 to 500 yards. You have to make it count. I live in Colorado, a license doesn't cost that much and I shoot cows anyway. I don't need a trophy. So things like a 30-30, 444marlin, 375 Win, work just fine for the locals who use them. | |||
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I really like the boat paddle stocked first rifles. I have been looking for one in great shape for years. They must work well, because you rarely see them for sale. | |||
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I think 2 are on Gunsinternational or Gunsamerica now... "That's not a knife..THIS is a KNIFE" ! | |||
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| one of us |
thank you, I will check them out. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Lever Action Rifles .444 marlin verses elk
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