Lately I've had a yen for an inexpensive cast bullet rifle. Been dreaming about a bolt in .35 caliber but about given up ever finding one.

Today I shifted gears and started looking at Winchester levers...the .357 Mag in particular.
Anyone have one of these and willing to give me some feedback. I used to have a Marlin in this caliber and loved it...but Marlins seem to get worse and worse to me. I get bad vibes when I hold one.

Also, I realized just a plain Jane old 30/30 is dang hard to beat as a cast bullet rifle. It's almost pointless to shoot jacketed stuff in them.

Any thoughts on this idea??

Finally, what does everyone think about a used Model 94 Winchester purchased from a gunshow? I've seen 30/30 with such wild variations in their chambers and headspace while the guns actually look to be in GOOD shape.

Are 30/30 chambers ALWAYS sloppy. New or used? Most look like they were chambered with a pocket knife?

What's the chance of getting snakebit buying a used 94? What to look for?

PS - Yes, I know the Savage 99s are stronger, better made and much more accurate...but I don't like them. They just feel clunky to me and I've never been able to feel any attachment to one even if I did kill my first deer with one. I still don't like them.

Two things to watch for when shopping for used M94 Winchesters: excessive headspace & muzzle wear caused by cleaning rods.



Buy a Forster "Field" headspace gage. Put it in the chamber and close the bolt. The locking bolt should NOT rise to its fully upward position. Compare its position with the gage both in and out of the chamber.



Buy a jewelers loupe and look closely at the rifling at the crown. If the rifling isn't sharp at and slightly below the crown, don't buy the rifle.



Use either the Lyman 311041 or the Lee C309-170-FP cast of wheelweights at 1800 fps or less, and you'll have a great cast bullet M94 rifle.

Damn good advice, Junior. Thank you for the ideas.

I have a Rossi 92 in 357 mag and it is a real fun gun to shoot. The Rossi is a strong gun and should be able to handle pressures up to 50ksi. They make the Puma in 454 Casull. You might also think about a 375 Win. big Bullet, Moderate veocity and not everyone has one.

As soon as I get a chance to get to the range, I'll be running a bunch of 180 Cast loads through the Rossi 357 from Sub sonic to as much as she'll take.
Should be fun.

Pecos
Because I've got a thing for 45 caliber bullets I bought one of the Rossi 45 Colt levers.
Once I lapped the barrel I've been in love.
I found that 20 grains of H110 behind a 300 grain Saeco cast bullet was about as close to perfection as you's ever want.
Jim

Hmmm, I'll check into the Rossi line. I hadn't considered it as an option. Mo good ideas.

I second the Rossi, mine likes 23 grains of Lil Gun behind a 315 grain Lee gas check boolit. 2" groups at 75 yds all day with iron sights, course the steel butt plate does announce firing.

Sorry, forgot.. I do in fact own a Winnie in 357 Mag as you originally asked. Frankly I'm a little underwhelmed. the finish is no better than my Rossi and it weighs considerably more, the action is rough and the trigger is atrocious. Other than that, it has fair sights I've tried 158 grain gas checked, 158 gr XTP's, 180 gr XTP's and can only get reasonable accuracy from my 180 gr Saeco RFN.

My all time favorite cast bullet rifle is my Marlin 1894 in .44 mag. It'll shoot 1" groups all day as long as the alloy is at least medium to hard and sized no smaller than .430". I got it in the mid 80's and it's a micro-groove barrel but it likes lead. I makes for a fun plinking gun or a serious short range hunting rig.

Another fun one might be the Marlin .32 H&R if/when they hit the stores. I have a singe shot and it really like anything from 105 SWC o 165 flatnoses.

Pecos, you might want to consider a levergun in 35 Rem, one of the older Marlins. They shoot well and handle lead quite well. None of the guns mentioned so far are a bad approach. I've not had much experience(shooting lead) with the 30-30 but think it will work fine as well. Seems too for everybody that does it. Few things I think that make or break this endeavor is the velocity/twist relationship. Slow and slow are good things for lead, and the larger the bore, the easier it is to deal with. As to making an individual gun shoot it's usually all about bullet diameter IMO. FWIW, if you were to decide to try paper patching later on, you might find the .308 bore about as small as you can go without having to take special steps with moulds/swaging in regards to finished diameter. My .02 worth.

Digi, I think you're exactly right about the lead guns. The bigger the bore and don't get crazy with twist or velocity. And if they don't shoot, size the bullets BIGGER. Oversized a couple of .001's is good.

My experience with the 30/30 and cast bullets is it's a good one for lead. I'm not sure if the original 30/30s were even loaded with jacketed bullets. Does anyone know when the jacketed bullets came along?

I've had lots of "Old Timers" try to tell me the Marlin Micro Groove won't shoot lead. WRONG Who ever saw a Marlin .22 that wouldn't shoot? And in big bore rifles they will shoot just super...IF you have the right size. (Usually oversized.)

Anyway, I fellow doesn't give up much shooting lead from a 30/30. And he may even gain accuracy with a little tuning.

I'm still dreaming of it.

Whoever suggested the Marlin 35 Rem...I could live with that. Finding one is the problem.

Pecos, here's an example of great accuracy from a Model 94 with cast bullets. The group was shot with peep sights--a Williams 5D peep rear sight and a Lyman 17AHB Target Front Sight.



For more how-to info, see http://www.castbullet.com/shooting/accu.htm

Junior, I agree that for sure no one need give up accuracy to shoot cast bullets. In fact, I've played with many guns that would shoot cast better than any jacketed. I suppose just for the simple reason that cast is more "tunable."

I used to have an old /06 that would dump 5 205 gr cast bullets into 9/16" at 100 yds. I could never do that with ANY jacketed loading in that rifle.

I have 2 nice Rem 788's in 30-30 that were bought just to shoot cast bullets in. Both are scoped and in good to excellant condition. With the Lee 170 gr bullets and some careful handloading I can get groups of approx, 1.5 inches all day long with out a lot of load development. I use wheel weights, size them to .308 and just load them with 2230 or H335 and shoot them. Right up to factory ballistics. I also have 5 lever action 30-30 that I use these same loads in, but they are all open sights and not near as accurate(Old Eyes). 30-30 is just about the perfect cast bullet rifle, and I do like the 45/70 for cast also.
I do have a Win Trapper in 357 and shoot nothing but 150-158 gr. cast bullets in it but it is just a plinking gun for me. Fun, but haven't ever measured a group with it. I also shoot a couple of Win. Trappers in 44 mag, with cast bullets and they work out fine. My son's Ruger M77/44 also likes cast bullets. Light loads group well and heavy loads take down a deer like the hammer of Thor!! < !--color-->

Pecos

You never mentioned hunting rifle, just cast bullet. I love my Uberti 73 Short Rifle in 44WCF with the MAV bullet (205 gr. WW) and 37.5 gr of Goex FFFG. It's just fun shooting out of that 20" barrel, get a good lube star with my lube, and it's marginal for deer. Adequate within probably 70 yards. 37.5gr is about all I can get in the case comfortably, I'm afraid I'll buldge it in compression with any more. I haven't clocked it, but I'll bet I'm getting over 1000 fps out of that rifle.

Of course, if you have to you can go with smokeless in it, but I've resisted the temptation.