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| One of Us |
Greetings more knowledgeable than I, I am interested in a lever gun for the purpose of hunting deer in ohio. The area I hunt will give me under 100 yard shots, and most likely around 50 yards average. I had one lever gun years ago that shot about as well as a north Korean missle. So needless to say, I no longer have it. So, which brand tends to be the most accurate? I'm looking at a 44m to match my handgun, but also like the 45-70,maybe even the 444, which would do the job without being excessively overpowered for the job? I also like a shorter barrel but which one out to 20 inches? Thoughts? advice? Thanks Meat Eater. | ||
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One of Us |
I think you'd be best served by getting an older(mid-1990s or older) Marlin 30-30. They are plenty accurate for your shooting distances with a 1-X or 2.5X Weaver K-series used scope on them, and shoot at least as flat as a.444 and flatter than a .45-70. Ammo & components are easier to come by, and penetration is fully adequate. Lord only knows how many North American deer of all species have been killed with rifles chambered for them since 1895, and the cartridge is still plenty alive and kickin'. And the rifles are still very inexpensive to come by, either new or used. Between the .44 Mag, .444 Marlin, and 45-70 gov't at the ranges you shoot at, I'd take the .44 Mag; lighter than the others, cheaper and more commonly available ammo in small town stores almost everywhere. My country gal's just a moonshiner's daughter, but I love her still. | |||
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They have to be "straight wall" cartridges....a 30/30 is not! Steve | |||
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Don't forget the .38-55. It is often under-rated. . | |||
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| One of Us |
the .444 will shoot with the least drop at 100 yds. the .45-70 is a handloading proposition if you want full-power loads without paying top dollar. the .44 mag lever action is a nice idea, but for deer hunting, I would want more. nothing wrong with the .38-55 or the .375 win, either. if I needed a straight-walled cartridge for deer hunting, and I did not reload, it would be a .444. | |||
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Why in the world? For the distances stated the 44 mag will kill like Thor's hammer! | |||
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Ooops | |||
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Ohier, I have never been satisfied with the accuracy of the slug guns I have had so they are no longer. I have been using my TC Encore BP. Meat Eater. | |||
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t 100 yds the energy is just over 1000 ft-lbs, the minimum in some states. enough, for sure, but not my idea of a hammer. to be fair, I thought the trajectory would be terrible, but with a 50-yd zero, the drop at 100 yds is only 2 inches. http://www.remington.com/pages...rces/ballistics.aspx | |||
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| One of Us |
first choice marlin in 35rem, I absolutly love the 35 rem (the real thors hammer) second choice 12gauge rifled barrel and sabot slugs, Price taken into consideration too. | |||
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one of us |
30-30 and 35 Remington not legal! | |||
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| one of us |
If I looked in my safe currently for LEGAL RIFLES... Marlin 1894 44 mag made 1984 pre-remlin, marlin 1895 45/70 (3 different versions, All pre-remlin), marlin Turnbull 50 Alaskan, Winchester 94 Packer 450 Marlin, Winchester 94 Packer 444 Marlin, Winchester 94 38-55, Winchester 1886 45/70 and Winchester 1886 50-110 Winchester. So what will I use?  The 1972 Marlin 1895 in 45/70 with Bushnell 1.5x5 Firefly 3200 scope. Good enough for shots of 200 yards and great for 25 yard shots. I'm using 300 grain hornady hollowpoints at 2000fps in my handloads. Shoots accurate and acceptable drop at distances I'll shoot. The 44 will work fine on does and yearlings but if you get a nice buck that field dresses at 230 pounds --- you will wish you had more gun! | |||
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Buckeye, nice collection. I have been thinking 444, or 45-70. The 44 was attractive since I already have two handguns in this caliber. One a super redhawk for hunting, the other a 4 in 629 smith for out west backpacking. How are the new Marlins? I understand to not find one with the "microgroove" barrels. What about the Winchesters, and years or models with noticeable problems? Meat Eater. | |||
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| One of Us |
OP, have you considered a single-shot? you can get 2 for the cost of one lever action. | |||
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| one of us |
I hunted with a friend on his farm in Indiana for several years before he passed away in 2012. There they allow hunting with a rifle if it is in a handgun caliber. I bought a Marlin 1894 in .45 Colt and really liked it - made 3 one-shot kills. I used the 300 gr. Hornady XTP bullet with a max. load of Win. 296. Velocity was almost exactly 1500 fps. and would usually shoot about 1 inch groups at 100 yards. My worst 5-shot 100 yard group was just under 1.5 inches. The bullet always exited so I could not see how they expanded, but they killed quickly and left about a 1 inch hole. I put a Leupold 1-4X scope on it. Brush was thick where we hunted, and the scope was nice for shooting through holes. I chose the .45 Colt because of the 1 in 20 twist. Marlin put a 1 in 38 twist in the .44 Magnum. It is fine for 240 gr. bullets, but talking to several people there who had these rifles, some would shoot 270-300 gr. bullets and some would not. The 300 gr. bullets stabilize well in the .45 Colt. I just prefer a heavier bullet and am willing to give up some velocity. My friend used a Ruger M77 in .44 Magnum for several years and was generally satisfied with it. It would not stabilize the 270 gr. or heavier bullets. Not long before he died he bought a Ruger No. 1 in .475 Linebaugh but never got to shoot a deer with it. Another friend of his used a Contender carbine in .500 S&W and was very happy with it. | |||
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.38-55 and .44 Rem. Mag. would work well under those conditions. I just have a really dumb question here, but HOW, did they come up with a regulation limiting it to straight wall cases? I mean depending on what an individual wanted, they could go with a Model 95 Winchester in .405 or a Sharps reproduction in 45-120. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Ohio is just getting warm to the rifle as a deer hunting tool. Been gun only for decades. They made the jump to pistols years ago and that was a major change. Macs B U.S. Army Retired Alles gut! | |||
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I knew they had been shotgun only for along time, but it just seems odd that they came up with the straight walled case concept. Did they include any caliber size restriction, or just that it has to be a non-bottle neck. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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| one of us |
The 'new' marlins from Remington are junk. To get an original marlin, look for a JM stamp on the barrel just in front of the receiver and you want a serial number of 91 or lower. If the serial number starts with MR and is on the left side of the receiver ... its a remlin. As far as microgroove being a problem... its never been for me. I have a microgroove 44 mag in the 1894 and it shoots great. I use it for cowboy action competition to the tune of 7500 rounds a year. No problems with function or accuracy. As far as the Winchesters go, I like the 92 for handgun rounds and the 94 for rifle rounds. The handgun rounds can give feeding problems in a 94 depending on the individual gun. The cross bolt 94's have a rebounding hammer which depending on the gun can give some ignition problems, but you can easily remove the rebounding feature. The 'new' Winchesters are very nice and I would not hesitate to buy one of them. | |||
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| one of us |
No caliber restriction, has to be a straight wall as available in the handguns that are legal. You are only allowed 3 rounds in the gun. It's been a 10 year battle to get this passed. | |||
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That is amazing. I am happy for you folks in getting that option.  Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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There is no need for discussion for me; 45-70 is it. It will kill deer very well and you can use it for anything else in North America; loaded up to hot loads. I did kill one deer with a Win 94 in 44 mag; did well, but the 45-70 is far better. Forget the 44 mag; weak and only good for deer. 45-70. | |||
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Crazy, here is the wording from the announcement that I read. The Ohio Wildlife Council approved these specific straight-walled cartridge rifles for deer hunting: .357 Magnum, .357 Maximum, .38 Special, .375 Super Magnum, .375 Winchester, .38-55, .41 Long Colt, .41 Magnum, .44 Special, .44 Magnum, .444 Marlin, .45 ACP, .45 Colt, .45 Long Colt, .45 Winchester Magnum, .45 Smith & Wesson, .454 Casull, .460 Smith & Wesson, .45-70, .45-90, .45-110, .475 Linebaugh, .50-70, .50-90, .50-100, .50-110 and .500 Smith & Wesson. Since this rifle is only for Ohio and deer, sounds like the 44 or 45 colt are good. I have other big boomers for the other big game in North America. Meat Eater. | |||
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I have only killed one deer with my 1894 Marlin in .44 Rem Mag. It was a 65 maybe 70 yard shot with a cast bullet, but it did the job with no complaints from me. Either it or the .45LC should serve you well. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Well, .44Mag and .45LC ? You already said you have a handgun in .44Mag so that makes the most sense. If you are to choose something that is only for the rifle then you are best served choosing one of the commonly found lever rifle cartridges listed, i.e. .38-55, .444 Marlin, or .45-70. I don't think many would consider the .38-55 a "big boomer". . | |||
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Were there the possibility of shots out to 100/125 yards or so I would go with the .38-55. I have one, an 1894 Winchester Commemorative and have used it on deer/javelina and the one black bear I have killed. The only drawback with the .38-55 is that unlike the .375 Winchester which does use a .375 bullet, the .38-55 often is over bore. Instead of shooting .375 bullets it is more accurate with .377 or even .380. My rifle does best with .377 diameter Barnes Originals. Also from what I have experienced it is more of a gun to work up hand loads for as factory loads are pretty anemic, and I also have not found factory loads all that easy to get hold of. These are just my observations. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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And I recommended the .44 Magnum, if you read the whole post. My country gal's just a moonshiner's daughter, but I love her still. | |||
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| One of Us |
Rossi model 92 winchester knock-off in 454 Casull. Shoots a 340 grain LBT LFNGC @2000fps. | |||
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| one of us |
The interesting thing will be the run on these rifles in the stores. Let's face it, deer hunting with a shotgun works... but its not really exciting. Black powder is a pain... the season is generally the coldest week of the year. I hope this starts the ball rolling and eventually expands to rifle hunting with no restrictions. The game wardens complain that the land is 'too flat' for something like a .270. But shooting from a tree stand into the ground pretty much negates that argument. Also, the southern half of the state is part of the Appalacian Mountain range so its anything but flat. I have pretty much switched my deer hunting to Kentucky as my family has several farms there and you can hunt with just about anything. But it would be nice to be able to hunt out the back door again. | |||
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| one of us |
Stright walled cartridges like the 45-70, 44 mag, 38-55, 375, 444 are legal and the 30-30, 32 Special, etc are not?? That is amazing, what kind of idiots do they hire in Ohio, may be an inbreeding problem? its totally void of reason.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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My understanding is the idea that since there is a handgun season, those same cartridges should be available in a rifle during what was strictly a shotgun season. So then they had to come up with "approved" pistol cartridges, and instead of saying "no bottleneck cartridges" to keep the 30-06's out they went with the "straight wall" designation. When all this was going on I was browsing an Ohio hunting forum and was surprised with how much resistance there was from some shotgun hunters. for every hour in front of the computer you should have 3 hours outside | |||
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For years, the group that fought the hardest to keep crossbows from being legalized during archery season here in Texas, were archers. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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| One of Us |
Rossi makes the 1892 clone for the .454 Casull as well as 45 Colt and 44 Mag if you wanted a pistol caliber carbine. They are offered in 16", 20", and 24". They also make the Rio Grande in 45-70. Both the 1892 and the Rio Grande are pretty cheap to buy compared to anything else in the same class. I have both a .45 Colt and a 45-70 and they are very accurate. I have loaded my 1892 with some seriously stout loads and it has shot everything with no signs of pressure. The Rio Grade comes with a scope mount and I mounted a 1-4X Leupold on it with quick detachable leupold rings. It to can handle some pretty stout loads. I am shooting a paper patched 450gr cast bullet at 1850fps with very good accuracy. Another rifle that doesn't get mentioned very often is the Henry. They seem to be top notch and offer both pistol calibers and 45-70s. If I were to buy a new rifle the first choice would be the Henry. The newest Marlins have improved their quality control and fewer people are complaining about them but you can still find one that has shoddy QC. | |||
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Same thing here in PA. The United Bowman of PA fought the use of crossbows tooth and nail. Tom Z NRA Life Member | |||
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Palladin: The Henry 45/70 does not have a loading gate in the side of the receiver so the tube magazine is the only way to load. I do not care for the elimination of the loading gate. | |||
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| One of Us |
It certainly would take some getting used to. I have held them at the Shot Show and they just feel great and point nicely. Their fit and finish exceed anyone else on the market right now. Another one to consider would be the Browning BLR in .450 Marlin. It's not a traditional Lever action rifle I know but they are one seriously strong action and Browning makes a nice rifle. I think they also make a take down version in the .450 as well. | |||
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| one of us |
The .450 Marlin is not on the approved list. I know its straight wall, but I don't know if the Game Warden would give you a hard time. I know the warden for Delaware County would arrest you though. He is that kind of guy. So, I'd get a letter from the office in Columbus saying it was legal before I ran out and bought one. | |||
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| One of Us |
It's odd that they would let you use 45-70, 45-90, and 45-110 as well as the 50 cal equals but not the 450 Marlin. I am sure like you said some Wardens wouldn't make to much of a fuss about it but there is always that one who wants to make an example out of someone. I would guess Ohio will amend the law to include some that were left out or that all straight walled cases were ok to use. What is listed is still far better than a shotgun in my opinion though. | |||
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| one of us |
There is little rhyme or reason to the whole thing. The goal is supposed to be to reduce the deer herd and stop some of the million or so car accidents we have every year with the deer. If you are safe with a .......... (fill in your weapon choice), logic says you will be as safe with a rifle (handgun round or other). It will be just like the CCW thing. A long history of no problems from the residents but lots of hand ringing and doom and gloom predictions from the liberal media and politicians. | |||
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