I got to looking into my barrel the other day of my .308 Winchester 1966 vintage Model 88 after a good cleaning and could see that the prior owner had damaged several lands near the muzzle. The gun is in good but not excellent condition, the stock is beat up pretty bad and looks to be refinished. the blue is good except a few scratches, the sling swivels are replacements and I had to grind the forearm swivel bolt off as it was touching the barrel. Overall the gun shoots into about a 3" group with WW 150 grain powerpoints at 100 yards. I gave this no thought until I outshot the gun the other day using a Marlin .44mag with a 2x scope! How much would I hurt the value of the gun if I cut 2 inches off the barrel, recrowned and remounted the front sight? I like hunting with it as it is light, fast and handy and for my 30-50 yard shots is fine. Any reason not to solve this problem cheaply by reducing barrel length??

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy P Coaltrain:
How much would I hurt the value of the gun if I cut 2 inches off the barrel, recrowned and remounted the front sight?

Not much if it's done professionally.

The only 88s with any substantial collector value are the pre-64s in .284 and some of the early "cloverleaf tang" guns. The condition in which you describe your rifle, its value is primarily as a shooter.

The rifle does have some collector value and the barrel is only 22" now. Have it recrowned or recrown it yourself.

I may do the crown on mine this winter and take before and after pics. Mine shoots about 2 moa now.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage99:
The rifle does have some collector value and the barrel is only 22" now.

Not particularly. Read his description; it's a post-64 rifle with a fair amount of wear. Unless YOU -- RIGHT NOW -- are willing to buy the rifle, you shouldn't give collector "advice."

The rifle has a significantly deep scratch perpendicular to the bore axis and about 1 inch into the bore, it runs across one land but not as deep as a groove. The prior owner probably cleaned it with a rock attached to a power drill. At any rate I think I am going to cut it off, 2 inches will not make much difference in the handling and there are many times where I hunt a short rifle is appreciated. Cheers. JimmyP

Just Some Guy,

I gave my opinion thats all. I suggest that you calm down. OK?

As I said I would do the crown over. If it shoots well then your all set and the front sight will still be on it. If not then cut off the 2". If you cut the 2" and it won't shoot then what? I would not be that interested in it if it did not look somewhat original.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage99:
Just Some Guy,

I gave my opinion thats all. I suggest that you calm down. OK?

As I said I would do the crown over. If it shoots well then your all set and the front sight will still be on it. If not then cut off the 2". If you cut the 2" and it won't shoot then what? I would not be that interested in it if it did not look somewhat original.

My guess is you're not interested in his gun. Period. So what difference does it make to you if he wants to modify it to suit his purposes? Not a damned bit.

Let me reiterate:

Unless you're prepared to fork over some cash for his gun RIGHT NOW or you can hook him up with someone who is interested in buying his gun RIGHT NOW, then STFU. Savvy? This value BS is just that; it's all theoretical and not worth a damned thing unless the guy is:

A) Serious about selling his gun.

and

B) Has a serious buyer.

I don't see any of that criteria, just someone pontificating silly-ass nonsense. (I.e., you.) Don't give advice you're not willing to take yourself. It's not a hard concept to grasp.

You just want to argue. I prefer to enjoy a conversation about guns.

Your on ignore.

Goodbye.

Cutting the barrel some inches could destroy the balance and make it back heavy. That would disturb the practical accuracy, as a back heavy rifle are hard to fire steady off-hand.

My suggestion would be to counterbore the barrel two inches. Thus you get rid of the damaged muzzle and still keep balance.

Regards,

Fritz

Edit: check this discussion: http://www.shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?t=27123

quote:

Originally posted by Savage99:
You just want to argue. I prefer to enjoy a conversation about guns.

Your[sic] on ignore.

Goodbye.

There's no argument. You posted bullshit "advice" and you were called on it. Now you want to play sour grapes and take your ball and go home. So the question reamins, ARE YOU -- RIGHT NOW -- INTERESTED IN BUYING HIS RIFLE?

Unless you have the cash (doubtful), have an interest in buying (also doubtful), can put the original poster in contact with a serious buyer (doubly doubtful), then who in the hell are you to dispense idiotic "advice" concerning his firearms? Further, unless the original poster was interested in selling his rifle, I don't understand why you are even concerning yourself with this.

quote:

Originally posted by Fritz Kraut:
Cutting the barrel some inches could destroy the balance and make it back heavy. That would disturb the practical accuracy, as a back heavy rifle are hard to fire steady off-hand.

My suggestion would be to counterbore the barrel two inches. Thus you get rid of the damaged muzzle and still keep balance.

Regards,

Fritz

You might want to do your homework before offering your "advice." If he cuts the barrel two inches, it will still be LONGER than the barrel on the factory Model 88 carbines.

quote:

Originally posted by Just Some Guy:

quote:

Originally posted by Fritz Kraut:
Cutting the barrel some inches could destroy the balance and make it back heavy. That would disturb the practical accuracy, as a back heavy rifle are hard to fire steady off-hand.

My suggestion would be to counterbore the barrel two inches. Thus you get rid of the damaged muzzle and still keep balance.

Regards,

Fritz

You might want to do your homework before offering your "advice." If he cuts the barrel two inches, it will still be LONGER than the barrel on the factory Model 88 carbines.

I presume that you are running for The-Most-Charming-Person-of-the-Forum Golden Award. I'll give my vote for you, I promise.

Fritz

P.S. The M88 rifle doesn't have the same stock as the carbine, and the barrel profiles are different.

quote:

Originally posted by Fritz Kraut:
P.S. The M88 rifle doesn't have the same stock as the carbine, and the barrel profiles are different.

Once again, DO YOUR HOMEWORK. The two stocks have the SAME LOP. The barrels also have the SAME profile. In fact, carbine stocks will interchange on rifles and vice-versa.

Rifle barrel:


Carbine barrel:


Any questions?

quote:

Originally posted by Just Some Guy:
---Any questions?

No questions at all, only a renewed promise to to vote for you in The-Most-Charming-Person-of-the-Forum Golden Award run. you will honestly deserve it.

Fritz

Fritz Kraut---Yea I'll vote for Just Some Gay. He will run his on campaign,afterall, he is president of his own fan club too.

Jimmy P
I have done a lot of hunting with 308 rifles with 18 to 20 inch bbls.

I like them a lot.
If you cut it back, and it feels butt heavy just take off the buttplate and remove some stock wood with a wood bit.

Thank you for all of your replies. This gun is after all just a gun to hunt with. I bought it as most of my shots are under 50 yards at deer that are under 150 pounds. I did also notice there was a nick in the muzzle, and I took some emory paper and smoothed the nick out using a 270 bullet as a mandrel, I will shoot it first and see if anything is improved with both 150 grain and 180 grain power points. I don't mind 20 inch barrel length and a 308, the 16.25 inch guns however are in my opinion abusive to your ears in a hunting situation. I am not worried about the resale as I am into the Zeiss 3 x 9 Conquest with German #4 reticle and light weight talley's on it than I am into the gun! If all else fails, I will just have to bite the bullet so to speak and put on a new barrel, or have it rebored to .358 Winchester.

I like the idea of reboring the barrel to 358 winchester, or perhaps the 338 Federal over cutting down the barrel.

Besides a 3" gun at 100 yards is plenty accurate for 50 yard shooting. I'd try some other ammo if see if another brand does better in your rifle. There is also the fire lapping option that might help address the bore scratches.

I have iron sights on my pre-64 308 88 and a scope on my pre-64 284. The scoped rifle isn't a bench rest quality shooter, but will do about 1 1/4" @ 100 yards with handloads.

Just Some Gay...hahahahaha