Reading the 100-yard 22 rimfire ammo test has lead me to the throw the following into the mix.
Over the past 5-years a small group of us shooters have been shooting 22 LRs fron the benchrest in an effort to test two things. One, what is the most coinsistantly accurate 22 LR ammo, and two how far can it be shot with reasonible accuracy.

The rifles that we have used and continue to use are (2) Cooper 57-M, H&R M12 custom with LiJia Barrel By Borden, (3) Anschutz, (2) M52 Winchester,and a bunch of other rifles off and on like Marlins, Mossbergs, and Winchester 69As, Winchester 68, Remington 541T, T/C Contender carbine, and on and on.

Scopes used in the testing, are Leupold 36X, 6.5-20X, 4.5-14X, B&L 6-24X, Nightforce 8-32X, Unertl, and a bunch of junk scopes like BSA, Simmons, Sportview. The junk scopes went to wayside very fast in the early days.

There was about everything in ammo tested from Eley, Lapua, Federal, Winchester, Remington, Winchester, CCI, RWS, Wolfe, adn so on. I wish we had kept records of the amount of ammo we expended, but we didn't. I can give you only an idea with the following. We recently took six 5-gallon buckets of empty 22 LR brass to the junk yard. That's a bunch!

The testing was started at the 50-yard range and the better ammo was then tested again at 100-yards. Right from the start of the 100-yard testing there was noted a big drop in accuracy! Moving to 150-yards and 200-yards this was even more evedent. It should be noted here that all of the testing was done out of doors, but wind flags were used throughout. Testing continued to a range of 425-yards, at first with serious intent and then just for the fun of it.

After all of this we have found facts that stand out. First let's set aside the need for good glass, an accurate rifle, shooting skills, wind flags, and so on, and take a look at the ammo it self. Here in is the problem. This should come as no big suprise.

The most accurate 22 LR ammo is intended for use in target shooting and it is loaded to sub-sonic velocity. This ammo is intended for use under 100-yards. It is too low in velocity to shoot any great distances. High velocity ammo is intended for small game hunting and plinking. There is no ammo that is being made for shooting at extended ranges with the 22 LR having better accuracy.

The folks that shoot rimfire benchrest pay high dollar prices for their match ammo, and then sort it out on lots by rim thickness and weight and so on. This tells me that even the best of the best is not all that good, and the bigest problem is that the shooter has very little control over the ammo available.

The majority of the problem being the ammo it would point to what the centerfire benchrest shooter have known for decades. To have the very best in ammo you have to load it yourself!

At present there is nobody offering loading tool, primed casings,and bullets for the shooter to load his own. With all the interest in 22 rimfire shooting I'm suprised that it is not available.

There is one company that is missing the marketing boat here, and that is Hornady. As I see it Hornady is the one manufacture that could grab the market and idea by storm! They are the makers of fine re-loading equipment, bullets, and have been probing the rimfire market with their 17 rimfires. What do you think would happen if a manufacture like Hornady made loading equipment, primed casing, adn several bullet weights and shapes available?

Maybe we should put a bug in their ear!

I think it would be great to buy primed cases, lubed quality bullets, then load up your own for your rifle. I just don't know if it is worth it for the amount of business Hornady would see.

I don't think your findings are a real surprise. Some seem to think the statistical analysis is useless because rimfire is inconsistent. Instead, it is this very inconsistency which makes the use of statistics necessary not to fool yourself. Centerfire has been developed to the point, that ammo is not a big problem.

sendaro,
Let's take this one step further. With Hornady already making fine 17HMR and Mack II rimfires; would it be any problem for them to come out with a really accurate plain ole' 22LR with some kind of a nifty vmax bullet? Could they keep the price down enough to go under the Mach II so folks would buy it. How deep would it cut into the 17's popularity? They're riding a high right now selling all the 17's they can for 10-11 bucks a box so I doubt their interest would be very great. Just my thoughts. jp

While I have my reservations about the personal loading of rimfires for accuracy, I do see the market potential for a new breed of .22 LR's. That is where Sendaro is spot on. Think how well CCi has done with the stinger, and other "specialty" cartridges. Now the idea I would promote might be that V-Max style with light weight (25 grain) but bigger shape (open cavity in the (dare I say) jacketed .222 diameter bullet??? The possibilities are endless, but the .17 craze will run it's course and the manufacturers will need another band wagon to jump upon.

My 2 cents.....................................

quote:

Originally posted by Sendaro:
The folks that shoot rimfire benchrest pay high dollar prices for their match ammo, and then sort it out on lots by rim thickness and weight and so on. This tells me that even the best of the best is not all that good, and the bigest problem is that the shooter has very little control over the ammo available.

This is where you lost me. Eley,RWS, Lapua etc spend millions to load you the best ammo they can make (in bulk). Your assumption above is pretty wild, in that these shooters checking batches, are looking for extreemly minor variations, THAT SUIT THEIR RIFLE.

Plus, if they got the inferior stuff, they still could win an event anyway. Their just looking for any and all chance for an edge.
According to your assumption all benchrest reloaders will have the "Best" ammo and come a tie? Don't think so.

JAL,I'm sure that the companys that you have mentioned do put a lot of money in their product but that does not make it perfact. The shooters that shoot 22LR in BR comp. do sort their ammo into batches. They are looking for thebest accuracy they can get.
Centerfire benchrest shooters have the control to produce the best ammo for their rifle and the game they play, that's my point.
Reading comprehention can be difficult for some.Just like spelling is for me.

Sendaro, I think you know little of what you speak. For one so quick to criticize everyone that has a different opinion, you certainly do not know much of anything about shooting subsonic ammo for instance. The stuff works very well indeed at distances beyond 100 yds. You just have to know how to read the wind and shoot. It ain't like plinking at 50 ft.

Probably as many bench rest shooters weigh and sort their primers and bullets as do sort for rim thickness. If you are shooting quality ammo, you will get quality results, presuming you and your equipment are up to it.

I'm a rather average shooter but I have no trouble scoring in the mid 240s at 200 yds. I suspect a really good shooter could do quite a bit better.

FWIW, you CAN reload .22 ammo if you want to pull bullets, dump powder etc. I've got some black powder loaded .22 lr ammo that was made that way and it shoots fairly well all things considered.

Brent

quote:

Originally posted by Sendaro:
JAL,I'm sure that the companys that you have mentioned do put a lot of money in their product but that does not make it perfact. The shooters that shoot 22LR in BR comp. do sort their ammo into batches. They are looking for thebest accuracy they can get.
Centerfire benchrest shooters have the control to produce the best ammo for their rifle and the game they play, that's my point.
Reading comprehention can be difficult for some.Just like spelling is for me.

Sorry YOUR comprehention is a bit off too.
I know the RF shooters sort their ammo and I never said they didn't. They even make international trips to the factory(s) to do so.
And I have heard some (Russians?) have hand loaded their own.

Nor did I say anyones ammo is "perfect". I doubt anyone's handloads will be either.

Again, CF benchrest shooters don't and can't produce the "best" ammo for their rifle what ever your point is/was. They just do the best they can, up to a point. Again, it's quite common for them to shoot a "best" group while fireforming their brass to make this so called best competition ammo.

And, I believe my spelling is worse than my comprehention, so maybe we have something in common.

If you'll check rimfire central you'll find all the rim fire 17's are made by CCI hornady just makes the bullet. Thay have a v-max in the 22 mag now, maybe they will try it in a 22lr before long.

Gentlemen,
I have been on the search for the most accurate .22 fo almost 35 years.
What I have found to date is this:
Ruger 77-22 with a Green Mountain Fluted target barrel, a after market trigger (forgot which one) and plain old Remington sub-sonics.
One hole groups at 50 yds. 10 shot groups that are .25 inches CTC. This is the best I have seen. Don't own stock in any of them, just stating a fact.
This combo has eliminated many a varmint around the house. Low noise and deadly accurate.

Dave

quote:

One hole groups at 50 yds. 10 shot groups that are .25 inches CTC. This is the best I have seen.

Exactly. The .22 LR is NOT a 100+ yard cartridge. Wind flags or not, ANY wind will blow the slow little pills around like leaves in a hurricane.

I'm amazed at how good and how inexpensive most .22 rimfire ammunition is. No amount of "improvement" will let you shoot "cone of fire" size groups at 200 yards with an 1100 or 1200 fps 40 grain bullet with a ballistic coefficient less than that of a coffee mug.

The .22 LR is an incredibly efficient round that hasn't changed appreciably in 100 years. Leave it alone and enjoy it.

Couldn't agree more. Great small pest round at close ranges, great fun plinker/target round at any range. Why expect miracles??

Don't forget Fiocchi 320 and 340M.......with Anschutz M1413, maybe a .60 cal. group of 10 @100 yards. My replacement for the long gone Federal 900.......try the 'silver bullet'

I got lucky and hit a 1 inch three shot group at 178 yards with a 22. Lapua Speed Ace ammo, it had energy to penetrate a milk jug full of water, and has killed several crows at that range.

all .22 rimfires shoot all .22 bullets diferently.... my 1022 custom with a midway barrel made by green mountain shoots the federal bulk packed 36 gr ammo into .23" groups at 40 yards..... some other ammo goes into much bigger groups...


LIFE IS SHORT.............

quote:

Originally posted by Sendaro:
Reading the 100-yard 22 rimfire ammo test has lead me to the throw the following into the mix.

I see the Lapua L is a little oversize, think that may have a beneficial effect. How many other target .22 shells are oversize by some amount?