Anyone tried them?

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
Anyone tried them?

I have not shot any Tac 22, but the Norma Match seemed all right. Someone ventured the opinion that it is made by RWS, and the headstamp looks like that might be the case.

I've tried both in a custom KIDD and a CZ 452. I'd say its low-to-mid level target ammo- a little step up from CCI Standard Velocity but not coming close to Eley Match or Edge. Functioned just fine in both guns. I do recall seeing the RWS headstamp on the cases.

I bought a bunch of the TAC ammo at $6/box and it seemed fairly priced relative to other ammo, although I'll just stick with CCI SV if I can get my hands on it at $4/box. I don't think the Match at $8/box is as good a value.

You can see some groups from TAC at the bottom of this photo:

I'm a serious 22 RF competition target shooter. I compete in an international winter offhand league (scores sent weekly via e-mail, posted on a website). That burns 50 rounds a week for score, plus 20 or 30 for practice. Distance is 50 feet. Match runs from 1 January to the end of April. The max score is 1250 points per week. Until you can score more than 1100 points, CCI Standard Velocity or equivalent is all you need. Last season, I shot CCI Target Shorts. They are as accurate as I can hold. If your scores are consistently over 1100, its time for a step or two up. Maybe that is where TAC might come in. If you can buy the CCI SV for $4 to $5 a box, buy as much as you can. It is fine practice ammo.

For the rest of the year, we mix things up. We shoot 100 yard offhand, 50-shot & 100-shot weekly matches. Wolf, SK, Armscorp SV, Eley Club and the like are good enough for practice. My guess is that Norma Match fits there. If your scores are in the 1100 range for a 50-shot match, you should be shooting Wolf Match Extra or SK rifle match or maybe something like Eley Team. That stuff runs $7.5 to $8.5 a box when you buy it by the case and include freight in the price. We tried Eley Edge, but it did not perform well enough to justify the additional cost.

If you are shooting in formal competition, don't embarrass yourself. Go for Eley Match or Lapua Midas +, recognizing that the cost for a case (including freight) will be almost $1600.

This month & next, we will be shooting 100-shot matches offhand at 200 yards. Wolf Match Extra or SK rifle match or Eley Team are OK unless you are shooting for glory. For the Hudson, I shoot Lapua Midas + and most of the rest use Eley Match Black. Eley Club is completely out of gas at 200.

Our most difficult matches are the BR50/50 and our 50-shot Monica 100-yard benchrest match and our 200-yard benchrest match. Those are demanding and deserve the best you can afford. We shoot Lapua Midas + or Eley Match Black. None of us thinks the really expensive stuff (Eley Tenex) is justified.

We have shot a couple of trials at 300 yards. We used SK rifle match for the 300 yard experiments. Once you figure out elevation and wind, the SK will hit a 1/2-gallon juice container with every shot.

We are all shooting purpose-built single shot target rifles; sometimes old (my Farrow and 2 Ballards and 2 Stevens 414 rifles and a Winchester Winder and a Remington Hepburn) and some newer (a Weirauch and a couple of Anschutz bolt actions, and a BSA International). We shoot some events with scopes and some with iron sights.

Each of us shoots at least a case (5,000 rounds) a year, usually more like 2 cases.

Thanks for the information to all! I guess I'll try some.

FYI Mid-South has bricks of Tac for $50, and Match for $70, plus shipping and insurance. I just ordered 4 Tac and 1 Match, 5 bricks total, shipping was $11.87 and $2.50 insurance.

Waterman:

What target do you use at the 50 foot postal match?

We use the 6-bull American Single Shot Rifle Association (ASSRA) #7 or Wyoming Schuetzen Union (WSU) gallery target. It is a reduction of the Schuetzen-type German 25-ring target. 1 sighter bull and 5 bulls for score. Scoring is by eye or with a regular NRA-type plug.

Rings are 1/4" diameter. 25-ring at center. 24-ring is 1/8" wide on each side. Rings in decreasing value are each 1/8" wide. The outside ring is 17. Anything wider is a miss. Total bull diameter is 2 1/4".

The same type & size of target was used in the winter or indoor schuetzen competition from the 1870s until it died in 1917. The range in the gaslight days was 75 feet. The switch to 50 foot range was the result of indoor ranges designed for NRA-type events. The 25-yard ranges are few and far between.

Targets are sold by ASSRA (see their website, assra.com) and by SPG, Inc. (See that website) SPG is the same guy who markets bullet lube. The targets are colored red. The difference between the two makers is paper and the shade of red used for the targets. ASSRA is the "official" source of targets, but it is a volunteer-run organization and getting targets takes some work by the purchaser. SPG is a business, takes credit cards, order on line, etc.

The red color works well for most shooters using iron sights. If you use a scope, you might want to try a copy of the red target done in black on a copy machine, using card stock. The WSU targets are not copyright protected. Our club used targets made locally, printed on card stock on a commercial copying machine called a Riso. We had a big order printed and are using that. But the copy shop burned down, the Riso is no more. Not sure what we will do when the targets run out.

http://www.dsaiowa.com/DSA%20W...0Postal%20League.htm

The above address leads to the Davenport (Iowa, USA) Shooting Association, the guys who will run the winter league this year. The DSA site also has a downloadable file to print your own targets.

We use the same target, 2 shots per bull, at 100-yards benchrest. Very difficult. That is our "Monica" match.

For our normal weekly matches, we shoot 2 shots at each bull, 10 shots for score per target, 5 targets per match.

quote:

Originally posted by Evan K.:
I've tried both in a custom KIDD and a CZ 452. I'd say its low-to-mid level target ammo- a little step up from CCI Standard Velocity but not coming close to Eley Match or Edge. Functioned just fine in both guns. I do recall seeing the RWS headstamp on the cases.

I bought a bunch of the TAC ammo at $6/box and it seemed fairly priced relative to other ammo, although I'll just stick with CCI SV if I can get my hands on it at $4/box. I don't think the Match at $8/box is as good a value.

You can see some groups from TAC at the bottom of this photo:

Who made the riflestock?

I did. Took that photo before I checkered the fore-end and finished the thing. More of that rifle: http://forums.accuratereloadin...371006802#3371006802

Back on topic, I found a couple of photos of targets shot with that rifle and the Norma ammo. I was having issues with the barrel so it was not shooting at 100% but you can see how it does relative to CCI and Eley.





If you have a rifle that is shooting consistently I'd expect some decent groups but with occasional fliers like Wolf or SK- which is an extremely good value for .22 ammo.

Wow . . . I'm a real guppy here! I'm not the world's greatest shot and I haven't tried any of the really good stuff and likely will not: I shoot a CZ 452 Silhouette mostly informally at paper and for sniping ground squirrels my wife wants eliminated.

But JFWIW . . . My experience is mostly with SK Subsonic (Green Dot), SK Rifle Match (Red Dot) and Norma TAC. I've had the best luck with Norma TAC and just ordered a couple of bricks. At 50 yards I'm almost always at 0.5 — 0.7 inches with 5 shots with the Norma TAC, slightly bigger with the SK loads.

Every .22 rifle seems to be a rule unto itself. What works in one may not work well in another. And what shoots well at one range may not shoot well at another.

If you shoot at a grid (good idea), try only shooting 2 shots at each intersection. You will gain a lot more information for the same number of shots fired. You will use a lot more paper, however.

quote:

Originally posted by waterman:
Every .22 rifle seems to be a rule unto itself. What works in one may not work well in another. And what shoots well at one range may not shoot well at another.

If you shoot at a grid (good idea), try only shooting 2 shots at each intersection. You will gain a lot more information for the same number of shots fired. You will use a lot more paper, however.

I agree very much with your first statement. I usually shoot three shots per group at the grid targets and measure them with OnTarget afterwards. Using more targets isn't that big of a deal when it's just printer paper and a Sharpie marker.

I have shot two cases of the Match. It is a bargain at the price, being less accurate than Eley Match and Lapua Midas+ in my Anschutz 1913a but much better than the TAC and other ammo similarly priced to the Norma Match.

Sir,

Answering the question as you ask it won't get you the ammo that shoots best in your rifle. You really need to try everything suitable in that rifle.

Getting the most accurate ammo for a serious rimfire can be a real pain in the arse. You need a dealer that will sell you a box or two of anything suitable. You need to test it under optimum conditions and that ain't outside if the wind is blowing.

Then, If you actually find some magic, you gotta buy enough of that specific lot to last you. In a way you're lucky, you found an ammo that your gun likes. I have a good friend who is one of the top ARA shooters in the country. He literally buys a case of ammo when he finds something good. Like most people I can't afford a case of the best stuff.

A good tuner will tighen your groups even more after you have the best ammo.

Unfortunately, most of the brands mentioned here will give you an occasional flyer and that can mean as much as 3/4" to 1" at 50 yds.
The only way to eliminate the flyers is to buy the really expensive stuff, around $20.00 a box, and a case of that is simply out of my price range.

The gun above is a Bill Calfee rifle that I shot in ARA matches here in Michigan for a few years. When I got the gun it was way too muzzle heavy. Filling the buttstock with lead shot fixed that. The stock was a really ugly swirley when I got it and I had a friend paint it (He is very talented) and it, then, looked like is does above.

I finally quit with the ARA... most of the matches are 2 -3 hours away, and they shoot either four or six cards a day. Figure lunch, fuel and between 4 and 6 boxes of Eley Red Box and, to me, that was almost as bad as trying to run a Formula One team for a year. (O.K. so I exaggerate slightly.)

A couple of friends (Both centerfire Hall of Fame shooters) and I decided some time ago to shoot the cheaper stuff and live with an occasional flyer. You can have fun shooting without going broke but you will get the flyers.

Just for fun I have been known to show up at an occasional egg shoot with Eley Club or Sport stuffed in a Red Box... a little intimidation is good...

quote:

. . . Originally posted by Dick Wright:
Just for fun I have been known to show up at an occasional egg shoot with Eley Club or Sport stuffed in a Red Box... a little intimidation is good...

Sir, you are evil and I love it.

When my daughter was a fast pitch softball pitcher, she had lots of speed and great control and that was fairly intimidating.

But as she warmed up for the first inning, when the opposing team was watching her closely to time her pitches, we always had her throw strikes or near strikes . . . except for the last pitch, which went terribly, horribly wild . . . .

She had no problems with the first 5 - 10 hitters.

I love it... Sports are supposed to be fun. One of the best experiences I have had was coaching a high school girls softball team way back when. The kids were wonderful... the parents not so much.

Dick, is Bill still building rifles. I liked his articles on building 22 rifles.

Dick . . . I coached several Little League teams and helped with a traveling team.

I was dragged kicking and screaming (almost) into my first "job" and I did so purely so my daughter would do something other than read and homework.

My biases re. girls playing softball were confirmed when I saw my team: lots of cute girls with pink ribbons in their hair.

Then . . . they took the field. And there was the sliding (in shorts, no less) and the anger when they made a mistake or lost.

There was also their response to my poor effort to console them when they'd lost a game they should have won . . .

Me: Well, we played well but just lost. It happens.

Stasi: We sucked. We need more practice.

Team: Yeah. We gotta do better than this . . .

How could I not love this?

I scheduled more practices and we ultimately won the league championship.

For my efforts, I was doused in that horrible soft drink "Mellow Yellow." My wife made me sit in the cargo area of an old Chevy station wagon on the way home.

God I miss those days!

Last week I tried 2 boxes of the Norma Match in my old Farrow at 100 yards. I decided to try it because I read a report somewhere that said it had fat bullets. The Farrow has a .2241 groove diameter. It did NOT like the Norma Match. Several flyers per box, some 4 to 6 inches out. Since the Farrow is my favorite OH rifle, I will stick with Eley Club for short range stuff and the higher priced stuff for serious 100 & 200 yard shooting.

I shot some Sunday at an NRA benchrest shoot, my 513T doesn't like it. Two targets with Norma Match and two more with Center-X, scores were higher with Center-X. Not much wind Sunday. It is an experienced rifle and seems to do best with a little extra bullet diameter (Lapua L but egad, the price these days).

Next week is an ARA shoot, the plan is to maybe try the Norma Match in an unlimited rifle.