Hi all,

I'm sort of new to the Accurate Reloading Forums. Lots of good information here. Thanks guys.

Anyway, I recently came into a couple Mausers and plan on using one of them as a base to build a 35 Whelen on. I keep reading here and there about how well this cartridge works and keep seeing lots of other cartridges compared to it, so I'm relatively sold on it. I would also like to hunt Alaska someday and hopefully shoot a bear and some of the other large Alaskan critters.

How does the 35 Whelen stack up as an Alaskan cartridge? Could I safely hunt bear with it, or would I want to get my hands on something larger? I figure moose, I could get away with, but how about a bear? How any of you guys hunted up there with this cartridge?

Thanks for you time.

Tex21

It will be a lot less work to build a .376 Steyr on your Mauser, Just open the bolt
face (8mm anyway) and you get 2400 fps with 300g projectile
that is almost 375H&H velosity!! in a short cartridge

Good luck!!

TEX

Please take the following as my opinions only, and know that I don't advance them as undisputable facts.
My background is that I live in Montana, hunt quite a bit, and have worked in gun stores in Montana, and for a few days on Kodiak Island, Alaska.
I had a all consuming desire to build a 35 Whelen a few years ago, and now have had two. In my opinion, the 30-06 will do anything the 35 Whelen will do and do it better. In the 1/2 dozen larger animals I have experience with, the 35 Whelen does not penetrate impressively. part of this migh have been due to the fact that most 35 Whelen barrels have a 1/14 or 1/16 twist and will not ( ot at least mine didn't) stabilize bullets heavier than 225 grains at 200 yards and beyond. I would guess that a 7 mag with a 160 grain bullet, or a 30-06 with a 200 grain Nosler would out penetrate anything you could put through the Whelen.
When I started looking around, I saw very very few serious hunters in Montana using the 35 Whelen, I think thats one of the best indicators of what works, is to see what the REAL (guides, hunters that shoot lots of elk) use.
In my opinion, the only advantage the 35 Whelen has is its nostalgia value.
I haven't used the 338/06, but from the research I have done, I think it might perform better in the field than the 35 Whelen. I suspect, but have never seen any one state it, that the 30-06 case just doesn't have enough power to push a bullet with the frontal area of a 35 caliber bullet as deep as it will a 30 caliber bullet.
I realize that a lot of people think the 35 Whelen has near magical qualities, but sometimes the worst place to get an objective opinion is from a guy that owns a fire arm.
Good luck.

It's just plain hogwash that a Whelen won't stabilize bullets heavier than 225 gr out to well over 200 yards . Although I have no hard and firm data to prove it , I also believe the .35 caliber bullets will penetrate right along with the smaller calibers , assuming sectional density amd bullet construction are equal . I have not seen anyone actually using .35 calibers that has been complaining about inadequate penetration .



The Whelen cartridge has always been a gun cranks' and reloader caliber . You HAVE to reload to get the real good out of this cartridge .



I suspect most guides and outfitters do not fall into the gun nut/reloader category , and that is why will not see them using cartridges such as the Whelen much . It's just way easier for them to use a .338 and pick up factory ammo or components just about anywhere .



As far as no "serious" hunters using the Whelen , well most of them have been convinced you need a high velocity cartridge with a 400 yard trajectory , and truth to tell , it does come in handy in a few situations .



All that said , a handloaded Whelen with good 250 gr bullets should do quite well for moose and interior Alaskan bear hunting . Good loads will deliver ft lbs of energy on par with a 300 magnum ..........

SD

I wasn't very clear about what I said about the Whelen not stabilizing heavier bullets. What I meant to warn is that if some one is building a Whelen, they should specify a fast enough twist to stabilize heavier bullets. The Remington Model 700 Classic comes with a 1-16 twist, and often won't stabilize heavier bullets at 200 yards and belong.
The 35 Whelen shoots short fat bullets and they lose their energy quite quickly. That is the Whelen's big disadvantage. Also, bullets that are short and fat are not good at penetrating compared to longer bullets. When you start shooting at 200 yards and past, you have two handicaps; the 35 Whelen bullet has lost a lot of its energy, and the bullet is not the ideal shape for penetration- not an ideal situation.
The 338/06 also has the advantages of having a better selection of bullets available for it.
If someone wants to build a 35 Whelen and immerse themselves in the nostalgia of it, have at, I did. But to build a Whelen with the thought that you are getting a ballistic advantage, you are kidding youself.

Good hunting

The 225 gr .35 caliber bullets are ballistically equal to 165 gr .30 s or 200 to 210 gr .338 s . The 250 gr .35 caliber will perform on a par with 180 gr .30 s or 225 gr .338 s . If you want to equal the performance of 200 gr 30 calibers , or 250 gr .338 bullets , you will need 270 to 280 gr .35 caliber slugs , which are offerred by Swift , Kodiak , North Fork , and others.

The .35 calibers may look short because of their diameter , but their actual length is not shorter by much , if any , compared to bullets of other calibers and similar sectional density . The .375 caliber bullets also "look" shorter than the smaller calibers , and we all know how worthless a .375 is on big game .....right?

I don't claim a .35 Whelen gives you any big ballistic advantage over other cartridges . What it does (with good handloads) is deliver about the same thump as .300 s or standard factory .338 cartridges , with very reasonable recoil and muzzle blast . Accordingly , the Whelen rifle can be built somewhat lighter and shorter and result in the same level of shooter comfort as heavier , longer magnum rifles .

And the .35 caliber bullets will make bigger holes in game than anything out of a .30 caliber........

Tex21,
Greetings! In my local area, a fair number of fellows use the 35 Whelen for bear and moose. Several others sport the Ackley Imp. version or jump to the 375 Whelen. It is a good choice for Alaska. Some of these fellows fell to the "nostalgia' bug; however, all I know have recognized that it is a decisive killer out to 200 and doubly so inside. Years ago when I was concerned about things like caliber choice, it was on my "short list" for a medium rifle. Alas, I fell victim to the 2.5" belted fever.
There are many choices a fellow could make for good or ill. I do not believe for a second that the 35 Whelen would reside in the "ill" column.
best,
bhtr

As for the 35 whelen not having an advantage over smaller cartridges-that's crazy.I have had 5 whelen's and used them alot over the years.Load it with a good 250gr bullet,and it will exit on broadside moose,and is more than enough for bear.It will make a bigger hole than a 30 cal and it will penetrate as well or better then the 30cal 180gr.I know this form experience.The 30/06 is a great cartridge but to say the whelen is a lessor cartridge on big animals is insane,the whelen was made for moose and big bears.

I like the 338 Win mag alot better than the 35 Whelen.Its alot more powerful and a lot less trouble.I had a 35 Whelen in 700 Classic .It shot good and I put a fiberglass stock on it.I just got tired of having 338 bullets ,358,375 AND 416 .If you do stay with the 35 Whelen I would build a stainless with fiberglass stock.I would save the trouble and buy a Ruger All weather 338 win mag.Mine ahoot 3/4 " groups at 200 yards with factory ammo.

Thanks for the information and opinions guys.

The jury is still out on what I'll build later on this year. A magnum would be nice, but I'm not up to tackling that just yet, so I'm sticking with .473" cartridge base. I am also leaning heavily towards the Ackley Improved cartridges. Who knows what I'll end up with...

In any event, if I ever do get to go to Alaska, I may just buy something bigger, what with as much it costs to go on a trip like that. Anywho, thanks again fellows.

Tex21

Here is what Finn Aagaard had to say about the .338-06, .30-06 and the .35 Whelen about penetration tests he conducted:



"They show that in my rifles slightly higher velocities were obtainable in the Whelen than in the .338-06 with bullets of the same wight. The .338 gave deeper penetration, even with its 210 and 225-grain Noslers against the 250-grain Noslers in the .35 Whelen, but the Whelen made wider holes..."



"The deepest penetration of all with the Nosler bullets was achieved by the 220-grain semispitzer in the .30-06..."

-------------------

In my view, the .30-06 with the heavier .30-caliber bullets does as well as the .338-06 and the .35 Whelen on game. The .30-06 loaded with Hornady Light Magnum, or with Federal HE ammo "almost" makes it a poor man's .300. But there is no way the .35 Whelen equals the .300WM in power.



Other than that, the .35 Whelen should do very well for moose hunting in Alaska. Large bears are killed with the .30-06, so it should be possible with a .35 Whelen. I would feel very insecure if there was a grizzly bear 75 yards away and with only a .30-06 or a .35 Whelen on my hands, but that's me.



And for those of you who think AK interior grizzly bears are small: Often it's true, but not too far away from Fairbanks someone I know killed a 9'4" grizzly with his .375H&H a few years ago. He had seen a larger one a day or two before, and that's the one he was looking for when he found the one he killed.

Ray

Thanks for that post. I feel a little vindicated for what I posted about the 35 Whelen. At the time I owned one, I felt terribly insulted if anyone questioned the absolute superiority of it, but evetually reason prevailed.
Most critters seem to sucumb quickly to a well placed bullet from nearly any caliber, but us gun nuts seem to think if we shoot the common vole with our 45/70 Ackley Improved and it dies, that is proof that the 45/70 Ackley Improved is the one and only adequate rifle for hunting the common vole.

Good hunting

Bodunchar

I have never hunted Alaska but have a Rem 7600 in 35 Whelen that I use here in NC. I would be interested to hear from folks that have used the Whelen past 200 yards, either on paper or game. I have always viewed it as a brush type cartidge and think it is great in that role.
Jason

sdgunslinger writes, "mine runs about 1.25 MOA and holds that out to 400"
Thanks, that is the kind of information was looking for.
Jason

I think the 35 whelen easily equals the 300wm,energy figures mean nothing it is velosity squared with no frontal area added in.The 35 has alot more frontal area than a 30cal,with plenty of penetration .If I had to decide between a 300mag and a whelen for big bear-no contest,I 'll take a bigger bullet any day.I shoot a 9.3x64 for the stuff that bites back-It doesn't equal the energy of my 340 wby but it kills better in my experience,bigger bullet of equal design will destroy more tissue.Ask any experienced african hunter which he would rather have for dangerous game 35 whelen/9.3x62 or 300mag!

My 35 Whelen hits with a noticable amount of authority ...........more than my 06 by a wide margin. I use 250 grain Round nose bullets. Nothing I have shot with it has required more than 1 shot. Nothing went more than 2 paces (black bears). The 5 deer I have killed with it have all dropped where they stood. Compareably..........when using my 06, the 7 deer I have shot, with equal shot placement (heart & lungs) have all died but only after running 30-100 yards. And none of them dropped at the hit as with the Whelen.

To say the 35 whelen is a short range affair, and has no more effectiveness than an �06 is a bit of a stretch, typical regurgitation of gun mag and gun store diatribe. A hunting guide I highly respect has said that from what he�s seen in the field, the 35 whelen�s effectiveness is on par with the 375 H&H. That makes a lot of sense, as you are looking at similar diameter and weight of bullets. The several hunters I know up here that use the whelen swear by it as a very effective hunting round.

Despite high velocities, and heavy bullet weights, the 30 caliber is a small bore. There is only so much work a small bore bullet can do. One can jack up velocity to gain range, or jack up bullet weight or bullet construction to gain penetration, buy you are still limited. A lightly constructed bullet can provide dramatic wound channels at the expense of penetration, or a stout bullet can be used to gain penetration at the cost of the wound channel.

The beauty of a medium bore is you don�t have to sacrifice the wound channel or the penetration. If one is looking for sufficient penetration for larger game from all angles, ability to break bones and a suitable wound channel the medium bore is the choice. Weather it be the 338 on the small end, or a 375 on the larger end, or the 35 or 9.3mm in the middle, they are all admirable performers.

As with any cartridge, just choose suitable bullets. There are plenty of outstanding 225 and 250 gr to choose from. Don�t dismiss cast bullets either, for practice or hunting. You can run the gamut of 150-180 gr pistol bullets for plinking and small game, up to the 280 gr for large game.

Finally, the average whitetail hunter won�t see any benefit with the whelen over the �06. It is on larger game that it comes into it�s own.

All you have said may be correct, Paul. But it is a fact that in Alaska the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM are the most popular cartridges with Alaska hunters, and more bears, moose, and caribou are killed with these three than most other cartridges.

In my view, both the .338-06 and the .35 Whelen are wonderful cartridges, but their only advantage over the .30-06 is their use of larger diameter bullets,and so the possibility of a slightly wider wound channel. Shoot a heavy .30 bullet in the same spot as the other two, and more than likely the result will be the same. I don't think one would kill deader than the other.