Mr. Shoemaker reading your comments on 45/70's, you use a Kodiak 400 grainer @ about 1800 fps. Here in Canada it is very tough to get those bullets.
Available in quantities are 405 Rem. bulk bullets and Speers version. The speer I believe is softer then the 405 Rem. Have you had any experience on moose or large black bears with those bullets?
I worked up a very accurate load @ 1800 fps.in my featherweight 1886 Jap.with 405 Rems.
How do you rate that bullet's performance on moose?
Is this bullet may be too soft to break upper front leg bone and also penetrate all that muscle tissue at that 1800 fps muzzle velocity? The bulk of my Moose shooting distance is 20-60 yards, for called in bulls.
In the dense boreal forest I often do not get a chance to pick the shot of my choice. I must make the best of any lethal or crippling area that is presented. Whether it is the shoulder, neck,rear-end,face on, or head. I usually use a .308 Win.or my .338 with 180 and 250 grain Nosler partitions. With either I do fine at said distances with bone or lung/heart shots. Actually I am extremely happy with either ones performance. Still I want to use and baptize my 45/70 on a moose or large black bear, you know the feeling uh? I like the carrying and handling characteristics of this rifle equiped with AO sights.A sheer joy to carry on long foot trips.

But can the 405 Rem. bullet break that upperarm bone of a moose and still travel into the heart/lung????

I believe the 405 Rem.will do fine on the neck and tail root shots or even shoulder blade/spine shots. Am I right?

I appreciate your or any other experienced persons input.
Thanks

From my experiences the 405 grain Remington bullets work quite well at 1800fps and I would not be afraid to tackle close range moose with one. That said, if you can get Kodiak bullets or flat nosed North Fork bullets or even hard cast lead ones I would prefer them. The 430 grain hard cast gas check Buffalo Bore bullets give 1975fps in my M-86 and certainly penetrate superbly.

I keep mentioning to folks but never even get an acknowledgement....that a bullet worth considering for you blokes who hunt larger game in the states with your 45/70's is the Woodleigh 405 gr 45/70 Flat Point bullet. It is a ripper to say the least, expands and hangs together.

PC,



Believe me I agree with you 100%, the Woodleigh bullets are among the toughest jacketed bullets made. Very heavy jackets, bonded core design and of the highest quality. I'm surprised they're not more popular here. I personally have been experimenting with them in my .458 Win and have been very impressed. The trouble for me is getting them from suppliers - they seem to be out of stock for lengthy periods of time.



Woodleigh Weldcore bullets rate a "10" in my book!

I'm a new guy here, maybe this has been covered, but....How are the Barnes Originals 400 gr FP bullets working out at the 1800+fps velocity range for large animals like grizzlies and moose? This is what I carry in my Browning 86 carbine in Wyoming for a bear repellant load. I'm heading north this summer to scout for land to buy and figured to use this same coombination.

458 Win, 458 Ruger no.1,Malamute,PC,
Thanks for your excellent and helpfull suggestions.

Shrike,

I just enjoy talking about guns and if I can help someone in the process I am a happy bloke.

Anyway, my missus does not listen to my gun talk, she just does not understand like you blokes

.458, in Oz we are lucky In suppose as woodleigh's are made here, you would be suprised that we pay more money for a regular Hornady bullet in certain calibres than we do for a woodleigh. For example I would have to pay $60AUS for .458 500 gr softs in Hornady Brand while woodleighs cost me $50AUS !! Sierr'a are quite often dearer again.

Shrike, Bullets are not a mystery. At 45-70 velocities,a hard bullet will punch a hole thru bone and keep going; while a soft bullet will have a tendency to spread out and impart energy to a very large section of bone, tearing it OFF, and keep going. Bullet penetration will be deeper for the hard bullet. Lead fouling will be greater for soft bullets. For a 458 you probably need a jacketed bullet to hold down the lead foul in the bore, but for the 45-70 it is probably optional. God, man, you are shooting a 400gr bullet at 1800 fps at a soft skinned animal. Even a big bear will go down with a decent hit from that amount of energy. As perspective, I have taken 2 BIG moose with a 454 Casull shooting 350gr gascheck cast lead (mildly hard)at 1650 fps (not even close to your energy level) with one shot each at 35 yards. Neither bullet was recovered. One bullet went thru both shoulders. Good hunting.

PC,
Do you know who imports Woodleigh bullets in Canada or the US????

Shrike,

MidwayUSA carries Woodleighs. The link to the Woodleigh section is below.

Craig

Woodleigh

You could also e-mail woodleigh directly and ask them who they export to in your area, I have no experice with bears but the woodleigh in the 45/70 would be my choice for, as well as for moose and elk....one day maybe I will have an oppurtunity who knows

Thanks guys for the help!!