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My dream is to take two grizzlies in Alaska one day,one with a lever action & one with one of my Double rifles,I have not hunted big game with a lever action,I have with a big bore double rifle,I would appreciate hearing from hunters who hunt with levers in Alaska,I currently have three Lever wildcats based off the 348 win,416/348,450/348 & the 475 Turnbull,what have you used & how was the hunt? DRSS | ||
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Interesting thread, I hope some of the Alaskans and Alaska hunters will weigh in. Mike | |||
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I believe Phil Shoemakers son uses a 475 Turnbull. | |||
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I have 2ea somewhat modified 45/70 Marlin lever rifles, one stainless and one blued with 20" barrels. I have carried them both quiet a bit when hiking, but actually never hunted with them. I certainly would not hesitate to shoot moose and grizzly with them. I prefer hard-cast 430'ish to 460 grain and hard-cast bullets. These have been Buffalo Bore and Grizzly Ammo factory loads. | |||
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I have a bunch of the 460 cast performance bullets but have not shot any yet,my latest favorite bullet is the Woodleigh soft point,for the levers I compress the bullet in a vice just enough to get rid of the lead tip,so far in the 416 & the Turnbull I am getting decent velocity,the 500 woody in the Turnbull gives me an easy 2000 fps. DRSS | |||
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Well as long as your welling to hunt to a bit closer. They well work just fine there can be a lot of fun in limiting ones self. Bow and handgun hunters do it all the times. Use what you find interesting and go for. | |||
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I know Phil has a 45-70 Win. 86 that he keeps handy at his camp... Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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I also just picked up a M-95 in 30-06 and am trying to decide whether to simply use it with 220 gr Partitions or rebore it to either 35 Whelen or 9.3x62 ? I am leaning on simply using as is for awhile as I am pretty comfortable with the 220 gr bullets in the 30-06 as they are reliable penetrators. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Quite a few years ago in Anchorage I handled a used one of those in 9.3X62 - a custom job by Bansner (IIRC). It was sweeeet! Hate I let that one go by... Antlers Double Rifle Shooters Society Heym 450/400 3" | |||
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Tho the Marlin 45/70 and 444 have always been fairly popular. The rifle that really made a Huge impact on what residents use Alot in brown bear /grizzly country. Was the 45/70 and later 450 Marlin , Guide Gun. Tho I have no doubt that bolt action 06s and 300s are used more. I know a whole lot of people that use theirs for deer, bear, moose and some even caribou hunting. And for the experienced Alaskan , once the stainless Guide Gun came out. They traded the short barreled shotguns for a GG. A friend at Game Crik killed a 7'ish bear as it was coming up the steps of his porch with one . He was shooting iirc the 430 ? gr Buffalo Bore factory 45/70 ammo. The bullet traveled thru about 5' of bear and was found in its rump when they skun it out. It was a 1 shot instant kill. Another friend in Sitka is a Winchester nut and Model 71 aficionado. He hunted for decades with his 348 that has an under 100 serial # . I worked up loads in his newly acquired M 71 in 450/348. Pushing a 400 gr KBC bullet at 2200 fps. If your lever gun is reliable, there isn't much big game hunting up here you can't do with one My Winchester friend also among his Many vintage Winchester lever guns , both rifle and shotguns. Has a 95 in 35 Winchester that was proofed in Ceylon. It is a carbine length barreled rifle. Extremely sweet rifle. If it could only talk. I killed my first 2 deer in Alaska in 80 with my Savage 99 , 358 Winchester. Wish I still had That rifle. I shot 250 gr Hornady handloads out of it that the reloading manuals said were going 2200 fps. As far as range goes, alot of times, a guy has to do some extra work to find a shot at over 150 yards . So I really don't think you would be limited with an iron sighted rifle. I could have filled The 4 caribou tags I had last fall with my ghost ring sighted 375 Whelan A.I. . But was having fun watching a friend get his first 2 bou. Phil Shoemaker : "I went to a .30-06 on a fine old Mauser action. That worked successfully for a few years until a wounded, vindictive brown bear taught me that precise bullet placement is not always possible in thick alders, at spitting distances and when time is measured in split seconds. Lucky to come out of that lesson alive, I decided to look for a more suitable rifle." | |||
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Appreciate the input,did your friend ever shoot anything with the 400 @ 2200? I have the North Fork 405 going that from mine but have not hunted that load yet,I am also very fond of the 71's. DRSS | |||
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Seems like theres plenty of opportunity to get close enough to game up here with an iron sighted lever gun, my moose this last fall was more or less 50 yards. As an aside, the annual limit on brown bears here in Dillingham is two, (2) so you could bring both guns and use them on one trip. I'd prefer to avoid the cast bullets. Regardless their accuracy, expanding bullets that'll maybe do more internal damage and come closer to anchoring a bear in place seem like a good idea to me. Theres a guy here in town that uses a lever gun on caribou, moose, bear and the like, he seems to think its neato. | |||
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In the late '80s and early '90s I shot moose and caribou with a .45-70 extra light weight 1886 Winchester, two .32-20s--a '73 and a model 65. My firse 'boo was with a .348 model 71 deluxe. All the Winchesters are gone now and I use doubles: .450 no2 for grizzly, several caribou with a .450-400, and my last moose with a .600 (definatley overkill). Good luck. Cal _______________________________ Cal Pappas, Willow, Alaska www.CalPappas.com www.CalPappas.blogspot.com 1994 Zimbabwe 1997 Zimbabwe 1998 Zimbabwe 1999 Zimbabwe 1999 Namibia, Botswana, Zambia--vacation 2000 Australia 2002 South Africa 2003 South Africa 2003 Zimbabwe 2005 South Africa 2005 Zimbabwe 2006 Tanzania 2006 Zimbabwe--vacation 2007 Zimbabwe--vacation 2008 Zimbabwe 2012 Australia 2013 South Africa 2013 Zimbabwe 2013 Australia 2016 Zimbabwe 2017 Zimbabwe 2018 South Africa 2018 Zimbabwe--vacation 2019 South Africa 2019 Botswana 2019 Zimbabwe vacation 2021 South Africa 2021 South Africa (2nd hunt a month later) ______________________________ | |||
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I had a client with the 444 marlin xlr on a grizzly a handful of years ago that grizzly didn't argue at all. He had it scoped which for me would detract from the whole point of a lever gun. Something special about iron sights no matter what kinda gun your carrying. | |||
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I favor a Marlin Cowboy rechambered to 50 Alaskan for bear hunting. I have a 50-110 Winchester 86, but have not had the chance to shoot it yet. It will also be used in lever gun hunts. | |||
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Phil, I still think that 95 wants to be a 400 Whelen.  Marty "...I advise the gun. While this gives a moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprize, and independance to the mind. Games played with the ball and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks." Thomas Jefferson | |||
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Phil, Ive shot elk with my wildcat 9.5x62, 9.3x62, and 35 Whelen on elk..they all worked fine, but the 30-06 with 220 gr. Nosler partitions killed them just as good or so it seemed with limited numbers since I seldom use the same gun twice it seems, always something new.. I sold my 95 SRC in 30-06, I have wished many times that I had it back. It was an ideal horseback elk rifle and I used it on elk a good bit, and based on that I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a bear with it. Id just leave it a 30-06 and shoot 200 or 220 gr. Nosler partitions..actually I like the 200 as well as the 220 and it shoots flatter or so Im told? hard to say they both seem to shoot pretty darn flat. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Not that I know of yet. Phil Shoemaker : "I went to a .30-06 on a fine old Mauser action. That worked successfully for a few years until a wounded, vindictive brown bear taught me that precise bullet placement is not always possible in thick alders, at spitting distances and when time is measured in split seconds. Lucky to come out of that lesson alive, I decided to look for a more suitable rifle." | |||
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How many bears have been killed with a 30-30 Winchester when it was new? | |||
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probably more than we would believe. | |||
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How many brown/grizzly have you taken with that Marlin? | |||
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Doug Turnbull killed Dall sheep with one of his lever actions in (I think) 2015. No scope. | |||
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Doug also killed his moose and brown bear with his 1886 and it worked great. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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I personally don't keep count of bear kills with whatever rifle I use. I know of a few that fell using a .45-70 405 hardcast in my years of carrying. Certainly you're aware that you should get in pretty close. I believe it to be one big bore levers to quickly put a bear down. I don't want to agree with the .30-30 in hunting Grizzlies and say it's easy, those here that use them shoot them directly in the head....directly. Like when they stick there big head in there canvas tent. It happens, your mind set I think is key when you carry and hunt. Good luck. | |||
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1 grizzly and 4 black bears. | |||
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The .50 AK in a Marlin is a lot of power in a small package. | |||
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What is your favorite load on these hunts? & how many shots on the grizzly if you don't mind me being nosey I just picked up a stainless & wood model 71 Browning,that has been converted to the 450 Alaskan by Mcgowen,barrel has a built in break,this gun is 8lbs 6 ozs,it's screaming Alaska to me. DRSS | |||
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I use the 535 Grain Woodleigh. I flatten the nose a bit by removing the lead rounded tip and make it a flat point at the jacket, just for safety in the lever action. All bears were killed with a single shot breaking both shoulders and destroying the heart. None of the bears traveled more than 25 yards from where they were shot. Two of the black bears were pretty good size, honestly squaring a 6'9" and another 6'11". The Grizzly at 7'2". | |||
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You sure have it all dialed in,definitely cannot go wrong with the Woodleighs,what velocity are you getting? I am also using them in my levers,.416 410gr,.458 480 gr & .474 500gr,& like you I am also flattening out the lead nose,they all shoot pretty accurate. DRSS | |||
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I run them at 1850fps. I can go a bit faster, but this load is accurate and they open up ok, judging from the golf ball sized exit wounds, so I am happy. | |||
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Ive used the 30-30 about as much as anyone, never on a Grizzly or Brown, but I would if need be.. Most folks believe a 300 Win mag is bear medicine to 400 yards it seems..Might I bring your attention that a 30-30 at 150 to 200 yards is as effective as 300 at 300 to 400.. My dad used to say his 300 Win. at 200 yards was a 30-30 out there where he shot them..  Actually he seldom if ever hunted with that 300, even for elk, preferring his 25-35, 30-30 or in later years the 250-3000 Savage 99...He didn't like recoil and he was just a cowboy/rancher and seldom shot far. However he was one of the best hunters I've ever known, and always got his deer or elk, and seldom got off his horse until he had a deer or elk in range. I tend to do that myself, its my preferred method of hunting, and its the most fun. Always a lever action when when hunting horseback.Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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