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Wanton Waste law
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Picture of Mike_Dettorre
posted
This question came up on the American Big Game forum when we were discussing gutless field dressing.

As you can imagine gutless field dressing leaves the ribs and likely some of the neck meat as well as various scraps around the carcass that is left behind.

Is this a violation of the Wanton Waste law in AK because section 16.30.010 is pretty broadly written.


Mike

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10094 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
Yup. Any little edible scrap left over is considered wanton waste.

A friend got a ticket once cuz he used a chainsaw to cut the Mooses head off. Took most of the neck meat but left the meat that was filled with bone fragments. Wanton waste.


A lesson in irony

The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people.

Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us... "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."

Thus ends today's lesson in irony.
 
Posts: 1626 | Location: Michigan but dreaming of my home in AK | Registered: 01 March 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of Mike_Dettorre
posted Hide Post
So basically you can only leave the lower legs and the head in the field?

Did this change in the last several years? I was on a caribou hunt in '97 and I thought I remember the guide saying something about you had to take at least 7 ribs but could leave the rest or something like that.


Mike

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10094 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
You gotta take the rib meat, you can leave the bones. It is a grey area but the meat has to come out.


A lesson in irony

The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people.

Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us... "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."

Thus ends today's lesson in irony.
 
Posts: 1626 | Location: Michigan but dreaming of my home in AK | Registered: 01 March 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of Scott King
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We salvage all edible meat by law. Tender loin, rib meat, neck, brisket and on. In my opinion it'd be a mistake to leave the tasty eats of the loins or ribs because we don't want to work around the entrails.
 
Posts: 9215 | Location: Dillingham Alaska | Registered: 10 April 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of 22Rimfire
posted Hide Post
Some areas you have to take it out of the field still on the bone others allow you to debone it in the field, but if it is edible meat you better take it out with you!
If you destroy it or let it spoil in the field it is also wanton waste.
Some of us hunt for the meat with the trophy being secondary.
The trophies will come in time if you hunt ethically and do not waste.
Waste not want not! If someone is wastefull in our area they are not welcome and will answer for it!
When my wife gets through deboning an animal the predators go hungry!


Ignore your rights and they will go away!
 
Posts: 149 | Location: Talkeetna Alaska | Registered: 13 September 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of Mike_Dettorre
posted Hide Post
Nobody is suggesting the wanton waste meat. It was just a question about how the AK law is written.


Mike

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10094 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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Picture of Abob
posted Hide Post
ADF&G has a tape they sell that follows the "gutless" process except you do gut the animal after removing the Qtrs, backstrap, etc. Once gutted, you remove tenderloins & rib neat. Advantage, most of the good parts are bagged before you get to the messy part.


Jim

fur, feathers, & meat in the freezersalute
"Pass it on to your kids"
 
Posts: 822 | Location: Palmer, Alaska | Registered: 22 October 2008Reply With Quote
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Picture of Mike_Dettorre
posted Hide Post
Well you can certainly get tenderloins without gutting an animal but awfully tough to get the rib meat without tossing the guts.


Mike

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10094 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
Your right Mike, that's why you do it last IMO. Get most of the meat bagged and when you finally get rid of the guts, the critter is a lot lighter to deal with.

I always gut last.


A lesson in irony

The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people.

Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us... "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."

Thus ends today's lesson in irony.
 
Posts: 1626 | Location: Michigan but dreaming of my home in AK | Registered: 01 March 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of PWS
posted Hide Post
You can also be fined for "Failure to Salvage" which is a lesser penalty than wanton waste.
 
Posts: 1141 | Location: Kodiak | Registered: 01 February 2005Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
What we do is take a pic of each side of the animal when we bone it out. The pic has a time and date on it. It is better to be safe than sorry.
 
Posts: 560 | Location: Michigan, US | Registered: 10 April 2007Reply With Quote
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Game wardens stopped in to visit us on a caribou hunt. This was about a decade ago so things may have changed. We were half way across a lake with 2 bulls when they flew over and pulled into our camp. When they asked about the rib meat from one of the animals we told them that it had been shot a couple times in the ribs. They were cool with that and went on their way.
 
Posts: 481 | Location: Midwest USA | Registered: 14 November 2008Reply With Quote
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This is the way we handled our meat this year on the caribou drop camp.

Just sawed each ribcage out, then there were no questions.


This is what it looked like on the Traeger back home. Went really well with corn on the cob and a sweet pea salad.


"If you are not working to protect hunting, then you are working to destroy it". Fred Bear
 
Posts: 444 | Location: WA. State | Registered: 06 November 2009Reply With Quote
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Picture of Scott King
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Lapidary:
Game wardens stopped in to visit us on a caribou hunt. This was about a decade ago so things may have changed. We were half way across a lake with 2 bulls when they flew over and pulled into our camp. When they asked about the rib meat from one of the animals we told them that it had been shot a couple times in the ribs. They were cool with that and went on their way.


I'd not advise doing that again for two reasons: 1) caribou ribs are good eats and I'd not recommend leaving them for the ravens. 2) on average I'd say a bullet might destroy the meat in a two or three inch diameter around the hole, but beyond that the meat is edible. The cops know it and if so inclined they'll get you for it. I bring out all the meat, leave nothing behind and butcher appropriately at home.

Look, at least around here you can give away some meat and although I like eating it and therefore don't see the need to get rid of it, if you want to you probably can give away what you don't want to take home. Avoid the hastle and bring every ounce out with you and when you get to town figger out what to do with it there. Be nice to your outfitter and nicely ask his assistance.
 
Posts: 9215 | Location: Dillingham Alaska | Registered: 10 April 2006Reply With Quote
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Probably good advice Scott. I'm sure the CO's could have written us up for something if they wanted. If I recall I didn't have my harvest ticket with me, because I'd accidentally left it at camp. They said that was no big deal either as long as I actually had the ticket. I got it and notched it right in front of them. These two were a feather in the cap of law enforcement. They made sure we were following the spirit of the laws and didn't look at everything under a microscope. I got the feeling they just wanted to make sure we were legally enjoying the Alaska experience.

We did get the ribs off of the other caribou, as we brought it back to camp whole. The caribou that we left the ribs on, we field dressed like we do in elk camp. Pretty much just leave the ribs and guts. If we ever do it again I'd be sure to get the ribs.

We did donate a bunch of the meat in Dillingham, our pilot even knew a lady that made soup from the bones. No guide on that trip, it was a DIY.
 
Posts: 481 | Location: Midwest USA | Registered: 14 November 2008Reply With Quote
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