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Hi, I'm looking to book a brown bear hunt but really need to get a handle on the total cost of the hunt. That includes everything including a nice bear rug with a lifelike head attached. I'm looking for a top notch outfitter so I'm willing to pay, but don't want to find out the hunt costs twice what I budgeted for at the end. Thanks, Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | ||
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To start--what is your budget??? It's no use for me to give you a cost if in the end you only have 5000 to start. | |||
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I was thinking about $20,000 total. If it's much more than that, I think I will do Africa first. Also I've recently had a heart problem, so while I expect to be at 80 to 90%, I'm looking for a less strenuous hunt. I'm used to hunting elk on foot on public lands in Colorado, but don't think I'll be up to that kind of strain for several years. Maybe a Kodiak Island boat hunt would be best? Thanks again, Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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I think you would be real close to 20000 after ever thing. | |||
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Ive never been guided but I live in the middle of it and hear about it so I'll take a guess if you don't mind. $1k in airfare. $1k or a little less in shipping the trophy to your taxidermist. Less than $2k in the rug. Bring the rifle you already own and expect some wear and tear. Less than $500.00 in new and nifty personal gear like boots and rain gear. Less than $500.00 in personal expenses during travel before and after the hunt. Other than that I believe the only other expense is the cost of the advertized hunt. The guide should be picking you up and dropping you back off at a major airport hub like Kodiak, Dillingham, King Salmon or even Anchorage. I believe he/ she will be covering all expenses while you are in their possession. | |||
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I think Scott is pritty close except he forgot the nonresident $85. license and the $500. tag. Bottom end for a decent Brown bear hunt would be about $10,000 but I would be very carefull if I was shopping in this price range. Average would be $12,000-$16,000. The top end hunt around $20,000 and some a little more. PM sent with my price. DRSS NRA life AK Master Guide 124 | |||
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Kodiak and the distall Alaska Peninsula 20,000 to 22,500 actual hunt cost plus another 4,000-5,000 in extras. So 24,000 to 27,500 all in for these areas. Other areas on the peninsula, southeast, PWS, Briston Bay 15,000 to 20,000 actual hunt cost and again 4,000 to 5,000 in extras. So 19,000 to 25,000 all in for these areas. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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$500 is of course assuming he is reasonable outfitted for extreme Alaskan hunting conditions to start with. Not being a butt, but most whitetail gear need not apply! Doesn't make much sense to me spending 20,000-25,000 on a brown bear hunt and then not spending the extra 1,000-1,500 on quality gear that would allow them to have a more enjoyable, sucessful, comfortable, easy hunt. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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If your looking at the Peninsula and your outfitter tells you that your hunt originates in the Chigniks, Port Heiden or Perryville (or other South villages) your looking at another grand in air travel from Anchorage. Check Peninsula Airlines for rates. Also, factor in shipping a wet bear hide to Anchorage or the lower 48. It can be spendy. Getting moose horns out of here is absolutely nuts... | |||
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I wouldnt think twice about brown bear hunting in wool pants and sweaters or fleece pants and sweaters covered by good rain gear, xtra tough boots, or pac boots or hip waders, having one change of in my duffle bag. I'm under the impression that most hunters have some combination of the above so I see little need to buy a new wardrobe. I think good rain gear should cost less than $200.00 and appropriate sandals about the same, so,......... Ok maybe a blaze orange fleece vest might not work so well but on the other hand the color of warm clothing under a wind breaker or rain jacket doesn't really matter. I always forget something. Hopefully I only forget the hunting license in internet posting and not while hunting.  | |||
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Mine came in right at $22,370, and that is with some reduction because I did the moose hunt with it. (I am counting the return airfare only, and half of the trophy expediting.) The tip for the guide was extra. Remember the plane costs are way up with the "extra baggage fees" Don't skimp on the cold and wet weather gear, or it will be one of the most miserable experiences of your life. | |||
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Good estimates but---I don't see any money allocated for the following-- motels/hotels extra meals during travel tips for guides,cooks,wranglers etc, etc license fees, extra baggage fees delivery to airport and return pick up 15 to 20 percent extra for not accounted items. beer or other boose. Not critical,just want to help get the hunter a true cost. | |||
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before I scrolled down any, my guesstimate was $25,500 from my airport here and back and the cost to the taxidermist. Guides in Alaska, and I looked at seven urls here first, are just not much interested in selling a hunt for much less than $20-25K. As long as the State protects them by requiring non-resident big bear hunters to employ the services of a guide it is not going to change. That's life. Think three week DG Safari trophy bull with ivory Elephant for a little less money. You won't have to worry about freezing or buying several hundred dollars worth of artic survival clothing either that you never use again. Sad but true these days, Africa is the DG bargain again in 2011. Rich OK: here is where outfitters inundate this thread with bargain basement offers for ten day to two week hunts. | |||
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With who and where would one find a 21 day trophy elephant/dangerous game safari for less than a brown bear hunt actually worth taking? Brett PS. Certainly NOT knocking African hunting, but a trophy elephant hunt won't get you a brown bear (if that's what you really want) 100% of the time! DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Brett, for me it was his second post, the: "I was thinking about $20,000 total. If it's much more than that I think I'll do Africa first." Your estimate was more than 10% higher, and came in on the "lowball" side of the curve. As far as a trophy tusked bull Elephant hunt, here are two places to price for well under 25K. www.cmsafaris.com is where I would start. Ask MJines for a reference, I think he has hunted Elephants with Buzz four or five times. www.hhksafaris.com would be my second site. Ask 465 H&H for a reference here, he has hunted Elephants with them five or six times. Need any more? No offense, but this gentlemen seems to be weighing the two options cost wise, and Africa, when the trip is taken in toto is a much better experience for the money. Best wishes to all for a Joyous and Prosperous New Year of 2011. Rich DRSS two more trips the the Dark Continent and then we talk Alaska. | |||
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You can do a boat based hunt in SE Alaska for a lot less than $20K all in. I did mine in 2007. Hunt was $10K my rug was $1600. I doubt that I had more than another $1400 in expenses including. Call it $13K total. Mike Never under estimate the internet community to use any opportunity to reply to a post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence problem.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Brownie hunts are expensive, plain and simple. What are you truely after? If you want a nice bear go to the SE or average kodiak hunt. If you want book go to the penn or find a damn fine guide on Kodiak who knows a sweet spot. Good bears are to be taken and I have always said the next record bear is gonna come from the penn. Its all about money, yeah you can do an african hunt for less and get 7 animals or you can come to AK and do a once in a lifetime hunt where you could freeze your butt off, eat decent food ride in a cub (usually) and pay out your butt to go after a brown bear. A lesson in irony The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people. Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us... "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves." Thus ends today's lesson in irony. | |||
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Best hunt of my life. Still dream about the time up that way. As soon as I am allowed to hunt BB in SE Alaska again, I plan on going. I was well under $20,000 for my hunt. Jim and Burt at Baranof did a bang up job for me. Great boats, super hard working guides and very easy to get along with. Jamie | |||
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They have the same bears in Kamchakta as we have in Alaska and they cost 1/3rd to 1/2. Safari Outfitters in Cody Wyoming is a good outfit if you want a solid company that has been around since the 1960's and not a fly by night outfit that hasnt. Plus you get the added benefit of a trip to Russia, something pretty exciting if you haven't done it before. For the cost of a bear in Alaska you should be able to shoot 2 bears or a bear and a moose in Kamchakta. | |||
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Safari Outfitters Brown Bear Grizz North America 1. Grizzly Bear B.C./Cassiar 10 days/Sept $10,000 Whitehorse Moose, Caribou, Wolf, Black Bear 2. Grizzly Bear Yukon 10 days/May-Sept $12,500 Whitehorse 3. Grizzly Bear Alaska/Unit 19/17 10 days/Sept $9,800 Soldotna Black Bear, Wolf, Caribou 4. Grizzly Bear B.C./Skeena 11 days/Sept $12,000 + T.F Smithers Moose, Caribou, Wolf, Black Bear 5. Brown Bear Alaska/Unit 16 10 days/May-Oct $13,200 Anchorage Caribou (fall only) 6. Brown Bear Alaska/Unit 9 10 days/varies by yr $18,500 King Salmon 7. Brown Bear Alaska/Kodiak 10 days/May-Oct $14,500 Kodiak Sitka Deer (fall only) $1000 Safari Outfitters Brown Bear/Grizz Asia and Europe Brown Bear 10-days $12,500 Kamchatka & Apr 25 – May 30 Moose in fall – Hotels in Petro not included. (Russia) Magadan Sept 1 – Oct 5 (Kamchatka only) Siberian Brown Bear 10-days $10,900 Khabarovsk Region Sept 1 – Oct 20 Snow Sheep if available in area. Population not strong. (Russia) Amur Brown Bear 10-days $10,900 Khabarovsk Region Sept 1 – Oct 20 Moose (Russia) Mideastern Brown Bear 9-day schedule $25,000 Turkey Aug – Nov Anatolian Chamois. Bear & Chamois are found in (Turkey /Armenia/Russia) 7-hunting days Mar – May same NE area. Eurasian Brown Bear 5-day stay €9,200 Romania Spring/Fall Price includes bear to 350 CIC points. From 350.1 to (Europe) 4-day hunt 400.0, add 1,000 Euros; from 400.1 add +70 Euros per point. NH @ €600 I don't work for Safari Outfitters, but the folks there are long time friends of mine. Talk to Clark Jeffs. | |||
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From CMS website: 14 (not 21 days) Elephant Bull 1 x 1 $15,400 + Trophy bull trophy fee of $13,000-15,000 + $6,500 in misc gov fees, tips, airfair, transfer, ect = $34,900-36,900 Now Rich I may not be a physicist or math profesor, but I do believe $35,000-37,000 is more money than $19,000-27,500 every day of the week and twice on sunday! Not to mention the fact that you were initially talking about a 21 day DG hunt and now we're down to 14 days. Brett PS. HHK isn't much better. 14 day trophy bull all in ranges from $31,000-41,000. DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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I am going in Oct way down on the Penn. Hunt cost is $16,500 Air to ANC $700 Air to Perryville - $900 License/tag $585 Misc- tips/extra food/drinks/1 night hotel, shipping, misc should be an additional $3000ish I have not accounted for taxidermy as I don't know what I want to do. The extra flight to the lower Penn is an added cost of this hunt. Also, we get to stay in cabins, not tents, which to me is a nice bonus. I have done the AK tent thing, and though I would again, I am all over being able to truly dry my stuff out every night and have real heat and a shower. If you are interested in the particulars of this hunt (that has been 90% on 9-10 foot bears for the past 8 years), just send me a PM. I will answer you when I get back from a cougar hunt on Jan 10. Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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Brett, I did the same math as you just before you posted! You did leave out: $5k for just the basic elephant taxidermy I had done (hide tanned, couple of feet, ears, etc) and another $2k to ship the same back. I also have spent >>>$2k and counting making cool things out of the hide now that I have it back. All the taxidermy is of course optional, but why in the world would you pay for a trophy bull and then NOT get it done? Best money I've ever spent by far. Tim, please be sure to take LOTS of pictures and post about your bear hunt. That is truly awesome country down there, and if you get even a few calm days with sun it looks like heaven on earth. Best of luck. Bob DRSS "If we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made out of meat?" "PS. To add a bit of Pappasonian philosophy: this single barrel stuff is just a passing fad. Bolt actions and single shots will fade away as did disco, the hula hoop, and bell-bottomed pants. Doubles will rule the world!" | |||
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Thanks Bob and will do. This is the one N Am hunt I haven't done that I really want to (I don't have the sheep bug!), and I am very much looking forward to it. After this one...every spare penny goes to Africa, again and again. Good Hunting, Tim Herald Worldwide Trophy Adventures tim@trophyadventures.com | |||
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Bob & Rich, Yep didn't include taxidermy or trophy fees for any other animals taken. Tim, Sounds like a good deal. Good luck and like Bob said take lots of pictures. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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All 5 species for $10k? And no additional trophy fees?  Sign me up...... | |||
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Give Clark Jeffs at Safari Outfitters a call. | |||
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I will check those numbers in about three weeks in Reno. Things have a way of changing in person. You WILL get a nice Elephant, you MIGHT get a nice Brown Bear. Rich DRSS | |||
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Thanks Rich, appreciate the advice. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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Africa vs AK is apples and oranges. Anybody who can equate riding in a truck and shooting a critter when they see one in decent weather vs actually hunting in sometimes really bad weather on foot (usually) for a bear, is not thinking clearly. There is danger in both but its not the same. It all depends on what your after. A lesson in irony The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever, to 46 million people. Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us... "Please Do Not Feed the Animals." Their stated reason for the policy is because "The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves." Thus ends today's lesson in irony. | |||
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Tim Herald nailed it with the 20ish figure. I was thinking a little cheaper but its pretty damn close to 20k.You cannot compare Africa and Alaska hunting two totally different hunts and different circumstances. I have done multiples of both(Africa and Alaska),done dangerous game and the big bears and its just comparing apples to oranges.Both hunts can be hunts of a lifetime and both can be complete bust.If you want a big brown bear then you have to think Alaska. Russia has good bears and its cheaper and they do produce some big bears but nothing like what Alaska produces,again apples and oranges.Give Alaska a shot first you can hunt Africa afterwards,it will still be there,hopefully. Wesley | |||
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Wesley, you pretty much got it right. You can't compare the two. After two years of working in Zambia with one of the best in the business my son decided that he missed "real hunting" and came back to Alaska. Not that he didn't enjoy his experience but that the way most African outfits do their hunting it is no different than road hunting in America. I know a lot of excellent African PH's and they would all prefer to do "real" hunts on foot but the average American hunter is looking for the most animals for the $bucks$ and road hunting is the best way to do that. Plus it is the best way for them to make their trophy fees!! The average American hunter equates number of animals to success! Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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ok, how much $$$ to hunt Brown Bear with you Phil? Rich | |||
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Rich, Your earlier posts seem a bit down on Alaskan guides and insinuate that we charge too much simply because we can. The facts are that our guides and camp help require at least 30 times the daily rate of African guides and our insurance premiums, fuel and food costs are additionally much higher. In addition our own cost of living is substantially more expensive - plus we have no retirement or health benefits. Like many things you can buy thing cheaper overseas but if you want quality American goods it will cost you more. Even the most expensive Alaskan guide makes a lot less than any of their clients. I charge $22,500 for a bear hunt - I certainly can not afford my own hunt - but with my success rate and size of the bears that we take I am constantly told that it is a bargain for those who can. Look forward to seeing you at the show Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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You might want to take into account the physical nature of the hunt. Alaska is not easy, even for a young guy. I would not go unless in top physical form. Most of the BIG bear hunting is in inhospitable areas, weather and terrain. I might suggest a African trip while this gentleman gets his stamina back to 100%. Training for the hunt would help you get back in true form! I am looking for a Alaskan Grizz hunt this Fall (Sept) and am training now. I want to be in condition (Lungs and weight) by May and then work legs and core hard through the Summer. These hunts are not a walk in the park! EZ | |||
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Just for the record Rich they aren't protecting the guides. They are protecting the people who would come up illprepared and get themselves in trouble with bears or even more likely the environment they live in. It's the same reason why you have to have a guide for sheep and goats. It sure as hell isn't because you're likely to get offed by a sheep or goat. Extreme hunts in Alaska are just that. Weather they are extreme because they are in the mountains or because of the remoteness and weather. Same result. People who don't know what they are getting into and are illprepared getting into trouble! Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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I was hunting up off the Noatak about 25 years ago with a friend. I was in great shape. Biking 100 miles a day on weekends, could bench press 350 lbs, 300 sit ups (a little break between each 100  ), weighed 200lbs . I was walking along the perimeter of a tundra lake and all the sudden a foot went out from beneath me and I stepped forward with my other foot instinitively to catch myself. I found myself crotch deep in a bog with hip boots on. I absolutely could not move. My partner and I worked for 15 minutes to get me out. I can tell you I was exhausted. There are things up there nothing can prepare you for. If I was alone, my bones might still be up there bleaching in the sun!
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Alright I'll play. A brown bear hunt with a good outfit does not need to cost $20,000 or more as the base cost but I don't begrudge anybody getting that much or more for a hunt. I've know John Peterson/Bristol Bay Outfitters for 20 years and given him some bear hunters every year for several years now. Your total cost for the hunt would be: 10 day hunt...................$14,500 Bushflight.....................$1,000 Lic/tag..........................$585 2 nights hotel...................$200 approx. Airfare........................$1,000 approx. Final trophy prep, shipping and rug of 8 feet or larger......................$2,100 Total.........................$19,385 Tips and meals gong and coming are only extras. As for a brown bear hunt being a very physical hunt it can be but does not have to be. I can offer two boat based hunts at about the same price as Phil's hunt that can be described as nothing but "Gentleman's" hunts". These hunts do not on average produce the biggest bears but if you can walk 200-300 yards and shoot well you should kill a mature bear. Also the hunt with John Peterson I quoted the price on does not have to be a butt buster either. You can hunt from a camp on a lake and more often than not you'll take your bear on the lake shore where the bear can be stalked in most part from an inflatable. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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The laws are also meant to protect the game. While guides are not infallible , How many non-resident hunters feel qualified to sex and judge bears? Or can age and judge sheep and goats? Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Mark When Chris Goll had the same area (I presume) that your man has the 1st thing he told me was there was lots of bears they just weren't very big. (by penisula standards) I guided a few hunts for him there (Kagiti,Pagiti)lakes as found his description fit to a tee. We took the biggest bear we saw on 1 hunt with a robust hunter out of about 50 and he was a good 8' but most were in the 7' range. Thats why you can't charge as much for unit 18 bears! I tend to use more than enough gun | |||
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