Not another " slugs for bear thread "
Like Waterrat said. A 12 ga. With slugs is a deterant at best. .
If you want a handy little bear thumper. . Use a stainless Ruger bolt action with a magnum bolt face and put an 18 1/2" magnum contour stainless barrel with a 14" or faster twist barrel chambered in 416 Taylor. It will give you 2450 fps with a 350 gr bullet like the Speer. Doesn't kick as bad as the shotgun and it works great on deer, caribou and moose. It crumples big and small bear wonderfully. Oh and city boys generally have poop fer brains when it comes to bear guns.

My good friend and retired Winchester Ammunition Engineer, James Gates designed and manufactures a hard cast 870 grain Dangerous Game Slug that appears to be a game changer.
Type Dixie Slugs into your search engine.

Here is the description:

The Dixie IXL-DGS is .730" and weighs 870 grs. It is designed for rifled barrels and .729"/.730" bore smoothbore with cylinder chokes. The velocity in the loaded rounds is 1200'/" from 20" 12 gauge 3" Hastings rifled barrels. Dixie designed his slug as requested by experienced shooters in Alaska. It is a true Dangerous Game slug/bullet that will stand up against the most severe tests! It is cast from our standard bullet alloy and heat-treated.

Gumboot or just buy a ruger 416

In NJ we are forced to use slugs to hunt bear and deer. Most bear take a few shots to stop. This is on bear that are not pissed off. Last bear shooting I was in weight 600. The thing was full of 3inch BRI's before it stopped. I am not impressed with a shotgun for bear.

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:
In NJ we are forced to use slugs to hunt bear and deer. Most bear take a few shots to stop. This is on bear that are not pissed off. Last bear shooting I was in weight 600. The thing was full of 3inch BRI's before it stopped. I am not impressed with a shotgun for bear.

Sounds like a case of poor penetration.

Slugs were found laying in the rib cage with no expansion.

The same debate is argued in Africa when following up leopard. Nine times out of ten those who got scratched were using shotgun shot or slugs.

Considering the size of your bear then a medium to heavy bore rifle would be my choice. Maybe something with iron sights for that thick shit you have up there.

While fishing a tributary of the Stikine about 15 years ago, I remember seeing a couple of empty Brenneke hulls amid the salmon carcases and grizz prints. Always wondered how the fellow made out. I'll admit I would hate to lug a .416 Rigby all day while flyfishing.
It was enough of a pain packing a Ruger Redhawk with hot-loaded 340-grain WFNs, but our Tlingkit guide thought it was pretty funny -- and woefully inadequate.

I would not go "hunting" brown bears with a shotgun. I have a couple of large rifles for that. That being said, for defensive use (15 yds) or less, a 12ga 3" with Brenneke 1 3/8oz slugs at 1500 fps is a preferred choice to my 454 Casull or a 45-70 with the standard 300 or 405gr factory loads.
Just because a bullet fails to stop an animal with one shot does not mean that it was a bullet (slug) failure. Shot placement is still the answer.

No personal experience here at all.
And I would probably take 458Win's advice for sure, as he would know.
The deadliest slugs from what I undersatnd are 'Dixie Slugs' however.
Check out their website, and buy a .416 Taylor anyway.

I have used DIXIE SLUGS offerings exclusively for dangerous game. The IXL is a 870 gr hard cast flat nose replica of the old "paradox" slugs, at 1200 fps. I have shot it completely through western buffalo, side to side, and completely through a waterhog (hit in the right ham, exited through the chest after breaking the left shoulder, and then whined off into the distance. This is not your usual soft lead deer slug.for best accuracy, shoot though a rifled barrel or a rifled choke, but can be used with a.730 cylinder choke
Dixie also makes a 3 ball buckshot load. In 3.5 12 ga mag, you have three, -630" dia hard cast buffered lead balls, 319 grains each, for a total of 960 grains at 1250 fps. This was my backup load during a recent on foot lion stalking expedition in Burkina. Never had to use it, fortunately, but did test it on a dead western buffalo. ALL 3 BALLS PASSED COMPLETELY THROUGH THE CHEST CAVITY FROM SIDE TO SIDE at 10 yards.
If you are going to use a 12 ga for DG, get this ammo. It is a little bit of a pain getting it, but well worth the inconvenience. Nothing even comes close.
Recoil shy hunters need not apply. The DGS and tri ball loads feel bout the same as my 8 lb Lott.

quote:

Originally posted by MN Hunter:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jim Brainard:
A shotgun will stop a bear. The Forest Service uses Breneke slugs and I believe the ADF&G also uses them.

I wouldn't always trust the ADF&G's actions as the gospel truth of what you should do and I wouldn't even listen to what the feds had to say about it. I have been involved with and heard too many stories of guides having to straighten out a mess they have made.

Common really F&G asking for help from guides for bear work? I don't think so. Maybe a guide interfering with what they were doing and thinking they are better at it most likly.

quote:

Originally posted by RMc:

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:
In NJ we are forced to use slugs to hunt bear and deer. Most bear take a few shots to stop. This is on bear that are not pissed off. Last bear shooting I was in weight 600. The thing was full of 3inch BRI's before it stopped. I am not impressed with a shotgun for bear.

Sounds like a case of poor penetration.

Sounds like an exaggerated weight!

Call the state about there scale. They weight every bear shot, age and do blood work. Say what you like but I would use a rifle verse a shotgun.

quote:

Originally posted by oddsix:

quote:

Originally posted by MN Hunter:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jim Brainard:
A shotgun will stop a bear. The Forest Service uses Breneke slugs and I believe the ADF&G also uses them.

I wouldn't always trust the ADF&G's actions as the gospel truth of what you should do and I wouldn't even listen to what the feds had to say about it. I have been involved with and heard too many stories of guides having to straighten out a mess they have made.

Common really F&G asking for help from guides for bear work? I don't think so. Maybe a guide interfering with what they were doing and thinking they are better at it most likly.

Dear oddsix,

I think you have misinterpreted my original post so let me clarify,

I never said it was common for F&G to ask guides for help for Bear work? I am not really sure what you mean by "bear work"?

What I said was I wouldn't necessarily trust any of the government agencies employees out in the field just because they work for the government.

In Alaska there are 3 government agencies with people out in the bush all of the time that I have dealt with. (I am sure there are more agencies just not where I am working.)

1-Alaska Fish and Game (State of Alaska)
2-US Fish and Wildlife (National Wildlife Refuges)
3-National Park Service (National Parks)

Now I can only speak from my personal experience but this is what I have seen.

1 - Fish and Game are usually pretty good folks who have a good amount of experience in the Alaskan bush and rarely need any "help" with anything except of course an emergency situation.

2- USFW field employees are usually scientists doing some type study and usually have only a little experience in the Alaskan bush. While I have never had one ask me for help with there "bear work" I have had them ask me to help them a few times get back to camp, show them where to catch fish, and give them a ride in my skiff because a bear destroyed there rubber raft. I have also seen one so afraid of bears that he did his entire water sample study from the floats of an airplane just to be safe.

3- NPS field employees are usually very young fairly recent collage graduates from the lower 48 often the east coast with virtually no experience in the Alaskan bush. The park system mandates that employees get rotated from park to park so usually just about the time they figure out the AK bush they get traded out with someone from the Washington monument. I have had heard them lecture me about "no need for guns as bear protection" and then scream for us to help when they get a bear in there camp. I have had them lecture me in front of clients that an abandoned camp with food in a "park approved" Yeti cooler was a substantially better bear deterrent than a 24/7 armed guide in camp at all times. etc etc.

My all time favorite story was when the park service sent out 2 rangers to monitor my friends bear hunting camp. They sent 2 young women out with very little bear experience and a box of 12 Gauge "cracker shells". After shooting off the entire box in 2 days and screaming for my friend to "come and save them from the bears" they called in on a sat phone and got an special immediate pick up. All at taxpayers expense.

These are some of the reasons I am skeptical of the Government employees I meet in the bush.

quote:

Originally posted by oddsix:

quote:

Originally posted by RMc:

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:
In NJ we are forced to use slugs to hunt bear and deer. Most bear take a few shots to stop. This is on bear that are not pissed off. Last bear shooting I was in weight 600. The thing was full of 3inch BRI's before it stopped. I am not impressed with a shotgun for bear.

Sounds like a case of poor penetration.

Sounds like an exaggerated weight!

Coming from someone who clearly knows nothing about the bears in the NJ/PA/NY area.

http://www.dailyrecord.com/art...akes-record-N-J-hunt

Yep, plenty of whoppers there! They are pretty brazen too.

I have a 50 Alaskan lever action I push a 570 HCGC grain bullet around 1800fps and a 525 close to 2000 fps, this is what I would use, points like a shot gun, I can hit a small target at 200 yards with the ghost ring sites. Also swift A frame makes a new 450 grain bullet for it also I have used a 458 grain punch bullet made of brass that will penetrate an elephant

quote:

Originally posted by kev5000:
I have a 50 Alaskan lever action I push a 570 HCGC grain bullet around 1800fps and a 525 close to 2000 fps, this is what I would use, points like a shot gun, I can hit a small target at 200 yards with the ghost ring sites. Also swift A frame makes a new 450 grain bullet for it also I have used a 458 grain punch bullet made of brass that will penetrate an elephant

"Small target at 200 yards,.."? What about a bouncing bear at 20', one of your hands is on a fishing rod, the other is digging bugs out of your nose?

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by kev5000:
I have a 50 Alaskan lever action I push a 570 HCGC grain bullet around 1800fps and a 525 close to 2000 fps, this is what I would use, points like a shot gun, I can hit a small target at 200 yards with the ghost ring sites. Also swift A frame makes a new 450 grain bullet for it also I have used a 458 grain punch bullet made of brass that will penetrate an elephant

"Small target at 200 yards,.."? What about a bouncing bear at 20', one of your hands is on a fishing rod, the other is digging bugs out of your nose?

Maybe some pee running down your leg if your only used to seeing them at 200 yards as well.

quote:

Originally posted by swampshooter:
Does anyone know which slug the Alaska Dept. of Fish and Game chooses for protection against bears and moose?

I think they use a Brenneke-type slug and from what I see on Alaska State Troopers they usually pull out a 14-inch pump when they head into the bush.

This article from the Alaska Dispatch has some very good information and links to a study on the effectiveness of different guns on bears.

quote:

Originally posted by oddsix:

quote:

Originally posted by RMc:

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:
In NJ we are forced to use slugs to hunt bear and deer. Most bear take a few shots to stop. This is on bear that are not pissed off. Last bear shooting I was in weight 600. The thing was full of 3inch BRI's before it stopped. I am not impressed with a shotgun for bear.

Sounds like a case of poor penetration.

Sounds like an exaggerated weight!

The largest body weight bears in NA come from Pennsylvania, over 800 lbs, so a NJ bear at 600 lbs would not be that far off. Much better food, and longer feeding seasons than are available in Canada or Alaska. Acorns and corn will put fat one better than fish and berries any time.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by kev5000:
I have a 50 Alaskan lever action I push a 570 HCGC grain bullet around 1800fps and a 525 close to 2000 fps, this is what I would use, points like a shot gun, I can hit a small target at 200 yards with the ghost ring sites. Also swift A frame makes a new 450 grain bullet for it also I have used a 458 grain punch bullet made of brass that will penetrate an elephant

"Small target at 200 yards,.."? What about a bouncing bear at 20', one of your hands is on a fishing rod, the other is digging bugs out of your nose?

Or backed into the alders and squatted with your waders down below your knees and a roll of TP in your hands....