Anyone else seeing this?

Yes... for a missed trip in Cananda

I, for one, have not. If I ever do they will not get my business.

Cal kinda hard when they have been sitting on your deposit for a year and a half

Didn't Jim Shockey bring this up in an article? I'm seeing this discussion in other forums as well. Seems like the master has spoken and it's taken ahold.

Its a hard thing all the way around.

I don't want to pay anymore. The outfitter dosent want to go out of business.

The guy I was going fishing with in australia is working a part time job. His business is 60 -70% U.S. tourist.

I had a hunt booked after the fishing. He going to keep my deposit. Said he didn't have a choice. I agreed with the premise that I would not have to pay a deposit up front, when I rebook.

One needs to know when it is time to cut ones losses.

Could you guys explain what this is about?

I have experienced this on a delayed trip to Mexico. I totally understand the need.

because you may need money is no excuse to keep a deposit - doing so is called theft

quote:

Originally posted by Caracal:
Could you guys explain what this is about?

Some operators are charging an additional 20% for a hunt that was booked and deferred due to travel restrictions.

I’m assuming this is for folks who stayed in compliance with their contracts.

For some, I understand.

For Shockey, not so much so (given how much money he makes- he charges quite a bit more than others).

Fortunately I’m not in this boat. My only long term planned hunt beat the Covid restrictions and I got back just as the US was starting to shut down.

I’m not sure what I think about this. In my mind, if you are forced to book years out, then the outfitter has to have a plan to deal with the vagaries of quota, area availability, etc.

If it was only a year or two, I have a lot more sympathy for the outfitter.

These rebooking fees are frustrating. To me the outfitters are trying to recoup lost revenue at 20%. The costs of doing business in the past 2 years isn’t up that much.

If the outfitter allows you to get your deposit back then I think that is more than fair. If they want to keep your deposit and increase 20% then let everyone know so we don’t book with them as this is just ridiculous.

Some well known outfitters are doing this. Covid sure will weed out the good ones who will work with you vs. giving you no options. What seems to be missing some here from the outfitters is the hunters may have lost jobs etc and now struggling to come up with the rest of the funds. Some will work with you and others will not.

I hunt Quebec for caribou once. The treatment I got from those French Canadians was enough for me. I've never step foot in Canada since.

This is kind of news to me other than some stuff I read by Shockey. None of my rollover clients have been asked to pay an increase over what the hunt was booked at. Some of them are holding prices for 2022 were they were in 2020.

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I have experienced this on a delayed trip to Mexico. I totally understand the need.

Yes.

I see your point.

But, the client has suffered too, and I don’t think he should penalized.

As mention on another thread.

Talk about it.

Reach am amicable agreement.

I understand some contracts have time limits - that is unless cancelled so many days before, the deposit is forfeit.

That condition should apply.

Let me clarify a bit. I have multiple hunts rolled forward due to COVID. I believe there are four hunts . Plus one other with no written contract and no deposit.

Of these hunts, we have been asked to pay an additional 20% on one hunt . At least thus far , I have not been asked on the others .

The reality is that the outfitters incurred costs last year (and this year ) whether we went or not . Many are hanging on by a thread . I totally get the need. I am fine with it .

It boils down to this: If events beyond the control of the hunter prevent performance of his obligations, who bears the risk? A 20% mark-up is a way to share the risk. What I don’t like about it in these cases is that it is being unilaterally imposed, rather than negotiated and agreed upon.

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
This is kind of news to me other than some stuff I read by Shockey. None of my rollover clients have been asked to pay an increase over what the hunt was booked at. Some of them are holding prices for 2022 were they were in 2020.

Mark

Same here. I have rescheduled many many hunts last fall, because boarders were closed and flights not available.
Not once did i or anyone i work with ask a hunter to pay a rebooking fee. I never even thought of this.

So let me get this straight. An Outfitter has a business that is suffering and therefore expects his client to subsidize it. My business is down 80% in the past 2 years. Not once have I asked my customers to pay me more.

Due to Covid, my May bear hunt in Alberta was postponed and the Outfitter asked if he could hang on to the deposit and postpone the hunt until 2022. I was very glad to do this and understand. That is a reasonable request.

What Larry has mentioned, regarding incurring expense, is true.

And that is why I think it should be discussed between the two parties, rather than start something new of charging X amount because of COVID-19.

We had to cancel our hunt last year, but, we worked something acceptable to both of us.

The PH never mentioned any costs that I had to pay.

Never mentioned that an additional expense will be charged for this year.

I am sure my experience is not unique, in that both parties see what happened, and something is worked out for the satisfaction of both.

We are in a situation non of us want to be in, totally beyond our control.

quote:

Originally posted by Colorado Bob:
I hunt Quebec for caribou once. The treatment I got from those French Canadians was enough for me. I've never step foot in Canada since.

Agree. Not nice people. Reminded me of Inuits.
Everything to get as much money as possible and little effort as possible.

None (Covid add on fee) observed. I'm sure they exist from following this thread.

Seems like poor business to charge a fee for an act of nature or God or whatever you want to call it. I sympathize with those who are hanging on by a thread too. But, to take a chance of losing the entire price of an uncancelled hunt(s) by adding in 20% is risky.
Isn't loss of income insurance supposed to pay for the same including acts of God or are those types of losses not included in "loss of income inclusive insurance policies"?

Its so called a Jim Shockey 20% Rebooking Fee.
I am sure it will make him Greater than ever again or he will get another SCI Award for it

quote:

Originally posted by lpankratz:
Didn't Jim Shockey bring this up in an article? I'm seeing this discussion in other forums as well. Seems like the master has spoken and it's taken ahold.

Absolutely

I have not heard anything about this. This kind of business practice is what gives Outfitters a bad reputation. Have they kept your deposit for a year and now asking for an additional 20 percent?

Better also check to see if they have increased their rates. I would ask for a new contract to be signed by both parties.

quote:

Originally posted by Colorado Bob:
I hunt Quebec for caribou once. The treatment I got from those French Canadians was enough for me. I've never step foot in Canada since.

Don’t judge Canada by Quebec even Canadians won’t hunt Quebec