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What is the best way to complete one of these forms if you aren't near an international airport? For instance, my father is 3.5 hours from the Philly airport. Do these forms need to be filled out for each trip? What all goes on them? Guns/ cameras/ laptops? Thanks, Dave | ||
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When I did mine I had to take everything that I needed that had a serial number on it and had it put on 2 4457 forms By Customs they have to stamp it.I put Guns ,Camara , Bino's, Scopes. Customs filled out the 4477 forms and checked all my things that I was going to take out of the country. AS far as I know they are good for ever. | |||
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I would suggest you put one item only on each sheet. What the heck, it's something the government does for free. That way you don't have to explain where the "other" whatevers are when you come back in. Do one for everything that has a serial number. They never expire and are good as long as they are legible. I laminate mine; they'll probably outlast the items on them.  I have the 4457 in a Word document that you can fill in and print, give me your e-address and I'll send it to you. Les ______________________ RMEF Life Member SCI DRSS Chapuis 9,3/9,3 + 20/20 Simson 12/12/9,3 Zoli 7x57R/12 Kreighoff .470/.470 We band of 9,3ers! The Few. The Pissed. The Taxpayers. | |||
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Above answers are right on. As far as logistics go, either give yourself PLENTY of time IF there's a Customs office at your departure airport, and you can go there before your flight (weekday, check their hours), or ... Road trip !! | |||
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The problem that I had (almost had?) on my Canadian trip was we flew out a very early flight and the Custom's office wasn't open yet. We flew out of Pittsburgh and that is a 3+ hour drive from my Father's house. Fortunately, the American Customs folks in Winnipeg didn't give us any problems bringing our stuff back in. I think 1/2-2/3 of the flight was coming back from a spring bear hunt. | |||
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Check the website of the Department of "Homeland Security" for the location of Customs service offices. There are some that are located in other places besides airports. Perhaps there is one closer to your father than your departure airport. It's a good idea to call ahead to find out what time of day they are least busy, and to let them know that you'll be bringing a gun on premisis so they can provide you any special instructions, if necessary. For instance, the first international flight of the day at my closest airport arrives at noon, so they told me to come mid-morning and they wouldn't be busy -- otherwise if I showed up about the time of arrival of an international flight I could be waiting for quite some time before an agent was free to wait on me. Tip: When dealing with customs and airport personnel, always refer to your gun as a "hunting rifle" or "hunting shotgun". This seems to go down easier than simply saying "gun", "firearm", or especially "weapon". | |||
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Thanks. I did this and found that there is a place about an hour from him. | |||
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3.5 hours from Philadelphia might put your Dad near Harrisburg Int. Airport. There is a customs office right there, very hunter friendly. Go in tell them what you want and they tell you to bring the firearms in. Takes about 15 minutes total. Keith What counts is what you learn after you know it all!!! | |||
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Yep. That's the place that's about 1 hour away. I grew up between Lewistown and State College. | |||
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The customs office is on airport property but not in the terminal. There is only one way in and the customs office is to the right of the terminal, about two blocks away. Never been anybody else in the office when I was there. Keith What counts is what you learn after you know it all!!! | |||
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Thanks. I'll pass this info along to him. | |||
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The form is good for life. I disagree that it's best to do 1 form for each item. The form has nothing to do with "a trip". The form states thos items are your possessions while in the United States. I have on form with an attched sheet of paper showing 11 itmes 9 rifles and 2 shotguns. If I were ever asked, Where are the other items? I would simply tell the Custom's Official that the form has nothing to do with what items I took with me on theis trip. It simply states that these items ahve been documented by Custom's as being my property acquired/possessed in the US. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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If I were ever asked, Where are the other items? I would simply tell the Custom's Official that the form has nothing to do with what items I took with me on theis trip. It simply states that these items ahve been documented by Custom's as being my property acquired/possessed in the US. Mike D. -- Yes, I understand the legal meaning of items on the form. That doesn't preclude you from encountering an intellectually-challenged customs agent who doesn't. ______________________ RMEF Life Member SCI DRSS Chapuis 9,3/9,3 + 20/20 Simson 12/12/9,3 Zoli 7x57R/12 Kreighoff .470/.470 We band of 9,3ers! The Few. The Pissed. The Taxpayers. | |||
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I now put everything on separate forms. The customs agent at JFK in NY gave me a hell of time.He tried to say that I left 3 rifles and a Glock pistol overseas and I needed an export permit Dave | |||
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And Did you report the incident...because if you don't...you are letting the issue perpetuate... This is the same thing as all the Non FFL holders...insiting on having a copy of an FFL. I did one big list and did not do it anywhere near my trip. I should have added my list also has camera equipment, binoculars, and watches. When you have a list with a total 11 firearms, 2 cameras, 2 binocualrs, and two watches and you come back with only one 2 firearms and 1 set of binos, 1 watch, and 1 camera... They have a pretty tough time accusing you of exporting 9 firearms, a camera, 1 pair of binoculars, and a watch. The date on my 4457 is 10 yrs old...what I have to take every iotem with me on every trip... As a matter of fact, because you are putting one item on one form, you guys are actually making it look like a single purpose document. IMO you are making it worse. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Mike -- I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. No hard feelings, I'll even wave at you while you're arguing with customs and I'm sailing through  ______________________ RMEF Life Member SCI DRSS Chapuis 9,3/9,3 + 20/20 Simson 12/12/9,3 Zoli 7x57R/12 Kreighoff .470/.470 We band of 9,3ers! The Few. The Pissed. The Taxpayers. | |||
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Oh I don't ever take anyhting on here very seriously...I also don't ver argu with Custom's...I spent 20 yrs in and aorund law enforcement. I jsut gently but clearly tell thenm that the form is "good for life" and jsut becuase I put mutliple items on one form doesn't mean that I will always take the same items out with me at the same time... ...and the light bulb always goes on in their heads and they say...oh yeah Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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The last time I took some guns to the customs office (Baltimore) the customs officer made me list my cloth gun cases, which I did just to get things over with. Another way to handle this is to have the bill of sale from the shop where you purchased the gun. This is what I have done with recent acq.. This shows proof of ownership also. Of course if you use the Tuffpac you will probably pass straight thru with your "golf clubs" unless you say "I have guns" real loud and then see the attention you get.  | |||
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One reason not for having separate 4475 forms for each firearm that I don't believe was mentioned is for getting import permits on international trips. I felt that it would be less confusing for the person approving and issue permits if the 4475s didn't have firearms that I wasn't trying to import. The easiest way to manage that was to have separate forms for each one. For other things that I'm only trying to prove that I bought stateside (cameras, computers, etc...) I have listed together. FWIW... -Steve --------  www.zonedar.com If you can't be a good example, be a horrible warning DRSS C&H 475 NE -------- | |||
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Me, too. I've crossed borders all my life (currently age 65 and made my first foreign trip when I was 18), and I have a 4457 for each item. I just take the ones I need because nobody can be as thick-skulled as some customs officer with a bone to pick. It has worked for me all my life with absolutely no problems. | |||
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Is this a form I can get on line and have it filled out before my trip or do I have to go to a customs office and get it and fill it out there? | |||
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Yes you can get it on line at the customs web site HERE and you can fill it out in advance and then take it to customs for their stamp. Les | |||
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______________________ RMEF Life Member SCI DRSS Chapuis 9,3/9,3 + 20/20 Simson 12/12/9,3 Zoli 7x57R/12 Kreighoff .470/.470 We band of 9,3ers! The Few. The Pissed. The Taxpayers. | |||
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I read recently that RSA requires that proof of ownership (i.e. 4457) be separate for each firearm. I've always gotten a separate 4457 for each rifle, and I have a copy of each taped inside the gun case. | |||
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Didn't work for me. They made me fill out their own government issued form even though I'd already completed the down loaded form. Never worry about theory as long as the machinery does what it's supposed to do. | |||
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