So in getting ready for my May 2016 safari to SA, I am going to use a meet/greet service on arrival , but most of them want notarized copies of 4457 forms and passports. The 4457 is usually no problem, but getting a run of the mill notary (usually at banks) here in western WA state to notarized a copy(s) of ones passport is difficult. Most won't do for fear of some legal complication and in the past its always been a pain to get done.

Anyone got any ideas on what kind of notary is more apt to do this?

Willi

My lawyer's assistant does mine. I also tried to get a bank notary here in LV to notarize my 4457 and passport and they were just freaking over it.

Mark

If your state doesn't use raised seals then photocopy the "notarized" copy and send it. With a modern color copier you can't tell the difference. I've done it my last three trips and the originals are in my gun safe. I had a hell of a time getting both the passport and 4457 stamped by a notary here in NC and I'm not letting go of them.

Don

My secretary Paula does Mark's, like he said. She is used to doing it regularly for me and she knows the ins and outs and how to do it. For hunters it's no charge.

Photo copy the passport, leaving enough room for an affidavit; I ( your name ) affirm that the above is a true and complete copy of the document
it purports to represent.

Then have your signature notarized below that statement.

Worked for me getting my SAPS 520 and 2 rifles into/out of Moz

Just another way for Africans to discourage Americans from spending our money in their countries. COMPLETE BULLSHIT!

Another reason to avoid flying through JNB.

Hmm? During my return flight from SA this past May, the CBP agent checking my firearms and associated 4457's at my port of entry (Atlanta airport) lectured me that the 4457 was an official government document and that "notarizing" the 4457 document was PROHIBITED by federal law. So, in the future, I will have a "notarized" copy for the SA officials and a "non-notarized" original for US officials.

quote:

Originally posted by Cajun1956:
Hmm? During my return flight from SA this past May, the CBP agent checking my firearms and associated 4457's at my port of entry (Atlanta airport) lectured me that the 4457 was an official government document and that "notarizing" the 4457 document was PROHIBITED by federal law. So, in the future, I will have a "notarized" copy for the SA officials and a "non-notarized" copy for US officials.

What a putz. These guys usually don't know their rear end from a hole in the ground!


.

Well, that's probably correct. You don't notarize the 4457 itself, just the copy only and only the copy is given to SAPS. The CBP never sees a notarized copy, just the original 4457. My original 4457s have also all been laminated to keep them usable and to prevent any changes to the form.

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Well, that's probably correct. You don't notarize the 4457 itself, just the copy only and only the copy is given to SAPS. The CBP never sees a notarized copy, just the original 4457. My original 4457s have also all been laminated to keep them usable and to prevent any changes to the form.

+1

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Well, that's probably correct. You don't notarize the 4457 itself, just the copy only and only the copy is given to SAPS. The CBP never sees a notarized copy, just the original 4457. My original 4457s have also all been laminated to keep them usable and to prevent any changes to the form.

Hmm? Interesting indeed. I visited several Notary Publics here in the Republic of Texas before I located one that agreed to notarize "copies" of my US Passport and 4457's. The earlier notaries advised that they were prohibited (by state law) from notarizing "copies" of documents. They advised that they could notarize only the original documents. Obvious, this creates a major issue when dealing with a valid US Passport. Perhaps someone familiar with Texas's laws regarding notarization can provide us with some feedback. Cheers!

That doesn't make any sense, to notarize a federal document that has already been issued, and for which it is prohibited from being notarized and does not need to be notarized in the first place. If that was the case, a notary would have been on hand to notarize the original, with your signature at the time that the original was issued. What they are notarizing (or attesting to) is that the COPIES that have been made from the original passport and 4457s are true and correct COPIES of the originals that they have seen. Maybe someone misunderstood the issue. In Nevada: "In certifying a copy of a document, photocopy the entire document and certify that the photocopy is a true and correct copy of the document that was presented to the notarial officer." Nevada Revised Statutes 240.16552(c).

I have my CPA's Secretary do it. Never raises an eyebrow

quote:

Originally posted by doubleboy:
Photo copy the passport, leaving enough room for an affidavit; I ( your name ) affirm that the above is a true and complete copy of the document
it purports to represent.

Then have your signature notarized below that statement.

Worked for me getting my SAPS 520 and 2 rifles into/out of Moz

Doubleboy

As per the American Association of Notaries website:

One of the most often requested acts related to copy certifying documents is the act of copy certifying a U.S. Passport. All notaries receive requests for a “notarized copy of my passport” at some point. Many of them receive requests of this nature quite often.

Notaries in states where certified copying of passports is allowed can simply follow the rules of their states. However, as shown above, many states’ notaries are not allowed to do this. There are two solutions that notaries who may not certify copies can offer to their clients.

1- Official Certified Copy of Passport Records. Let the requestor know his or her options. Advise him or her that he or she can obtain an official, certified, and authenticated record of his or her passport application and verification of citizenship from the U.S. Department of State Foreign Affairs (USDOSFA). According to the site, “These records normally consist of applications for United States passports and supporting evidence of United States citizenship, and are protected by the Privacy Act of 1974, (5 USC 552(a)). Passport records do not include evidence of travel such as entrance/exit stamps, visas, residence permits, etc., since this information is entered into the passport book after it is issued.”

The AAN requested passport records from the Department of State in order to describe to its readers the documents that were received. It is an impressive package that includes:
- a cover letter that verifies the place and date of the requestor’s birth on USDOSFA letterhead that is signed by the authenticating officer
- the passport application that the holder of the passport completed when he or she applied for a passport that bears every name that the passport holder has ever used or been known by. A color picture of the requestor identical to the one on his or her passport is also on the application
- an official numbered certificate on heavy bond paper that bears the official gold foil-embossed seal of the U.S. Department of State and has been signed by the U.S. Secretary of State and the authenticating officer
- a letter of certification of citizenship from the authenticating officer. The letter certifies that the U.S. Passport Application copy is a true and correct copy of the original record in the custody of the Passport Services Directorate of the United States. This letter provides the holder’s passport book number and the date that the passport was issued.

All of these things are held together by a brass grommet in the upper left hand corner of the documents. This package clearly proves citizenship, but does not provide a record of travel.

Officials in the USDOSFA prefer this method for passport certification and some notary public administrators send requestors to them for fulfillment of this request. However, the major drawbacks to this method are that it costs $50 to get the record and it may take three months or longer. However, notaries should probably inform clients about this option and then explain the alternative detailed in number two below.

2 – When a notary is asked to produce a notary-certified copy of a passport when his or her state does not allow notaries to certify or attest copies, he or she can show the requestor an affidavit that is similar to the one below and advise the requestor that, by law, a notary cannot simply notarize a copy of a passport and attest or certify that it is a true and correct copy. The notary should then explain that he or she can notarize the requestor’s signature and have him or her swear or affirm to the truth of that statement.

If the requestor completes an affidavit, the notary can have the requestor swear or affirm that the document is a true and correct copy and then perform the notarization. As promised, an adequate affidavit for this purpose is provided.

As I stated, it's not a problem for us in Nevada, but for the poor souls in Texas and in a few other states it appears that following the 'affidavit' route is the most appropriate way to resolve the issue.

In the last 21 years of traveling to the RSA/Namibia to hunt, I have never been asked to provide a notarized copy of anything. Color copies of passport pages and of 4457 have sufficed.

But, I get my permits myself and am carrying original documents if the SAPS wants to see them. Your rifle permit seeking company likely wants notarized copies to avoid any problems. Doubleboy's suggestion will likely work, but ask your rifle permit company.

Regards

To process the SAPS permit prior to entry , they do require notarised copies at Jburg airport.
Its just an easy process to fill out the form yourself, walk into the police counter at Jburg airport and clear your weapons.

No need for any cost or notarising of docs.
Colour copies of passport, firearms licence, or 4457 for you guys is all that's needed.

Cheers

Nick

On my last hunt (back in 2003), I just went to the Customs office near my home and got the form stamped and signed.

That was all I needed.

I am heading to Zim in Sep 2016 and I wonder what new hassles to expect?

BH63

Bisonhunter1,

If you are ever on Seattle's Eastside I will get it done for you.

Your insurance agent can usually do it, too.

All good replies. Got everything all taken care of. Thanks.

Just an educated guess, but, I'll bet you get it notarized at any UPS Store. They have notaries there as a service.

I've never notarized a 4457. Always worked fine.

lavaca,

You've probably never traveled through RSA on your way to hunt. It is a requirement when acquiring a pre approved RSA gun permit. No other country that I am aware of requires it.

Mark

Mark:

Thanks for the information. You are correct. The only two times I have traveled through RSA I was bowhunting.

Copy the documents.
Turn them over and write on the back some sort of statment that it is a true copy of the original document.
Put your signature on the statment you just wrote. Have the notary stamp that you just signed this document.
That's how I did it.

Another example of TIA. On my first safari, I obtained my rifle permits through PHASA, who was recommended by my outfitter. It all worked out fine, but I did have to obtain notarized copies of my 4457 forms and passport as discussed here. On my second safari, my outfitter obtained the permits for me. When they asked for copies of my 4457s and passport to be sent, I asked whether they needed notarized copies. "No, why?" was their reply. No problems obtaining my permits!