I'm within driving distance from JFK for a direct SAA flight to Jo'berg and get in early enough to catch my connecting flight the same morning... but the flight, the seats in particular SUCK. (friggin airbus... might as well be flying with crates of chickens and live stock)

If I want to go Delta, I have to fly to Atlanta and then would have to overnight at Afton House or African Sky adding a day to my travel.. But its in a BOEING

So Opinions please! Is it worth it to go with Delta?

My wife and I flew Delta out of Atlanta to Johannesburg last month. We paid a little extra and got "Coach Comfort" and were on the bulkhead. This was great. If you go Delta, try to get this combination. The only downside was on our return home, our flight was delayed 6 hours. Something to do with weather in Atlanta before they left. We left Johannesburg at 2:00 AM.
Also, we did a overnight on our way down at Africa Sky. This is a GREAT place. They picked us up at the airport and took care of everything. The food and accommodations were top notch.

Mauser

Just got back from Zimbabwe.Flew SAA from JFK to JHB to Harare and back. Flew coach. It was long, and uncomfortable but was exactly on time in both directions and all the luggage made it unscathed. Service and food were adequate (but not good.) Would not bother going to Atlanta and overnighting in JHB.

I've done both routes several times and my vote goes to Delta hands down. Reason(s)! After 16 hours on a plane(Delta), I want OFF, Africa Sky GH meets me at the airport, has my permits done, I get a good meal, a hot shower and rest. Next day I connect to Bulawayo and am somewhat refreshed.
On the return, it is a direct flight back to Atlanta with no stops in Dakar.
Over the years, I have seen SAA go from a first class 747 with great service to a piece of crap, last time with steward(s) that could give a rats a**. Live and learn, never again on SAA! My .02 worth!

We have done it both ways, SAA and Delta, and Delta is by far the best for us, seats are bigger and a lot more comfortable...we stay at the City Lodge at the airport in Joburg which is a very short walk and you don't even have to go outside if you don't want to. No worries about traffic or other problems associated with leaving or returning to the airport either.

Karl

Look into Emirates and do not look back.

Having flown each several times, Delta is my choice. Got in two hours ago from SA and Zim without a problem.
Cal

We live rather close together and I was faced with the same decision just over a month ago when I went to Namibia.

The Boeing plane is better, but you have the added cost of flights from Philadelphia to Atlanta, the overnight in Joberg and going through the SAPS crap in RSA. Even the basic flight from Atlanta to Joberg was more expensive than the flight from JFK to Joberg.
Delta also charges you extra for a second piece of checked luggage which SAA gives you for free.
Added together, it becomes a decent hunk of change.

That and the additional time that would be required for the Delta flights (mainly due to the overnight in Joberg) made by decision to take the SAA flight from JFK an easy one. Leaving from JFK allowed me to make my connecting flight in Joberg with time to spare.

I used a shuttle service that picked me up at a hotel close to my house and took me to JFK and return for $160.

BTW - I encountered no problems with firearms at JFK.

I'm still deciding for next year, myself. Ive flown SAA several times, and went Delta this year. I chose Delta because of their economy comfort class. At 6'3", those extra four inches matter, big time.
Everything else was a negative. Their baggage policy caused me to overnight in JoBerg, as 2 1/2 hours didn't seem safe with the dreaded SAPS procedure required only to recheck on the SAA flight to Harare. Add the expense of chartering to camp to avoid losing a day.
The up-charge for a second bag was a surprise. Not a deal-breaker, but it annoyed me. You kind of need a suitcase when traveling with a gun case.
Delta managed to leave our rifles on the ground in JoBerg, and as they hadn't yet cleared customs, I had to get to an international airport to clear them myself. Fortunately, I was flying through Minneapolis the next week. I cleared them, and Delta sent them on home to South Dakota. Otherwise, a 600 mile round trip to clear the rifles.
It saved me 18 hours of aching legs. I am definitely going to look into Emirates.

If you are going any place that Emirates goes in Africa. Take Emirates, you will never go back to Delta or SAA. Took Emirates from SF 16 hr flight over nighted in Dubai went on to Harare 9 hours Boeing 777 300 comfortable seats data and smart phone hookups hot looking attentive flight attendants no problems with guns.

If the choice is between Delta and SAA-Delta wins.

I haven't flown Delta international, but experienced Lufthansa (which was great) and SAA. I actually didn't mind SAA (was way better than the United flight I had to connect with on my way home), but did notice they have some maintenance issues. The one saving grace for SAA, which added immensely to my overall experience is there is a seat about 3 rows from the back of the plane which does not have a seat in front of it (which my booking agent put me in). I'm 6'2" and could stretch my legs all the way out - was very comfy.

Having said all that and having seen how quickly expenses for a safari add up, if you can use Emirates, pay the extra $500 and do so (even if you shoot one less animal). You are stuck in a flying can for half a day basically. You want comfy seats, good food, and beautiful flight attendants to make the flight as enjoyable as possible.

I have only flown SAA and have done so 5 times from Washington Dulles to Harare. Departing Dulles in the early evening, you have 8 hours from Dulles to Dakar (stop to refuel - you don't get off the plane and are back in the air in about an hour.) Another 8 hours to Jo'Burg, then a 2 1/2 hour layover until your flight departs for Harare. I end up getting in to Harare around 2130 local time. These flights work for me, and I am on SAA planes throughout the trip, so potential for losing luggage is minimized. SAA service and planes are ok - not the best, not the worst. One good thing with SAA is that even in coach, you get 3 pieces of luggage free. You have to read the baggage policy closely and take a copy with you when you check in as the SAA agents never seem to know their own rules. However, their policy states that you get an extra piece of free checked baggage (up to 50 pounds) for sporting equipment,and hunting is one of the sports listed on their allowed sporting equipment.

I have stayed over night at the Africa Sky on one trip. While this was a welcome break in my travel, the cost of the room, meals, wine, gun permits etc added another $1000 to my trip. Plus everybody in Jo'Burg seems to have their hand out asking for a tip for something. The trip without stopping in Jo'Burg sucks, but I choose to gut it out and use the $1000 I save on more trophy fees.

I just got back two weeks ago from Zim and SA.

I have made this trip 10 times, 9 on SAA and 1 - this last one on Delta.

I was expecting great things from Delta based on all who have posted here, but I was underwhelmed.

Compared to my last few SAA flights [August, 2012, October 2011] I prefer their service and convenience.

This is all based on little things really but it is what it is.
They are:
Deltas No cancellation policy, requiring insurance. +$240
Deltas One Bag restriction +$150 for the 2nd bag [RT]
Deltas 777 seemed rather worn, rubbed and slightly dingy [SAA's Airbus' were new last year]
Deltas food service was only OK, same food both ways, and so very - American. [SAA's seems more like a "Foreign" airline - different - african.]
Deltas beverage service was stingy [" No you may not have two glasses of wine. We'll be around again later"]
Deltas on board staff were "american airline" competent - indifferent and disinterested.[made me feel right at home!]
Deltas flight times are very late in the day requiring lots of wasted airport time and connection issues.
Delta provides no on board "amenity kit"

Deltas seats WERE softer, same size, but soft vs SAA's "Euro sports car" feel.
Deltas JNB staff were equally rude and barely competent as are the average at JNB.
Deltas firearms "Security" person asked outright for "a little something" to be sure that the firearms were safely on board the aircraft. [The SAA/JNB security staff seem to expect/appreciate something but are not asking for it.]

So, for me, I don't see the Delta charm and if you can get to the SAA JFK departure without undue hassle it seems a "no-brainer" choice to me, esp with connections from JNB!

Les

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
...I have stayed over night at the Africa Sky on one trip. While this was a welcome break in my travel, the cost of the room, meals, wine, gun permits etc added another $1000 to my trip.

My experience was much cheaper, but does not include any of the "tips" around the airport!

Africa Sky Hunters Package

Les

Unfortunately,with Delta's new baggage policy, that 2 1/2 hour connection at JoBerg is really pushing it. I still had to overnight, because of the SAPS hassle, since Delta won't check through.
Better seating in economy comfort is the only positive, and it has to offset a whole lot of negatives.

I haven't tried Delta and have used SAA/Lufthansa on 5 of the 6 trips I have made without a hitch. The one time I did have a problem, it was on Turkish Airlines. They lost my guns and bow case for 6 full weeks after the hunt was over. Fortunately, they arrived with me for the hunt and I eventually got them back. I've got no beef with SAA.

My friend Tim has used delta twice in the last few month and they have lost his bags both time when he cam to SA it took them a week to get his bags to him. yep the day before he had to leave he got his stuff. now he is in moscow and guess what again no bags.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Look into Emirates and do not look back.

How does it works thru Emirates to Harare? I'm in Montana. And What's the expected price?
Heading out to Zim next year

I've done both SAA and Delta. SAA has better firearms checkin and better inflight food and drink service. Delta economy comfort seats are much better for the long flights. delta firearms checkin not so good and inflight service ok. Food was ok, but not great. I think the customs process for firearms checkin and retrieval was much better at Dulles than at Atlanta.

I just returned to the States after hunting in Zimbabwe. Actually, both airlines suck. Flew SAA from Harare to JoBurg and then Delta to Houston via Atlanta. Due to immigration and customs issues, I checked both rifle case and duffel case to Atlanta. Rifle case arrived in Atlanta OK. However, no luggage. I was advised to file a claim thru Delta's Houston office. Now Delta ia advising that they have no record of the transfer from SAA to Delta in JoBurg. Contacted SAA representative this morning and apparently they are unable and/or unwilling to advise if my baggage arrived in JoBurg. In addition to losing my potentially stolen luggage (or as the Delta and SAA rep stated - delayed luggage), I had to endure Delta's 16 hour flight from JoBurg to Atlanta without the benefit of viewing movies, listening to music, playing games, turn on overhead reading light, etc. since the touch screen entertainment center was out of service. I had to borrow a flashlight from another passenger so that I could read a book. To add injury to insult, Delta held us hostage on the Atlanta tarmac for 1-1/2 hours due to "tail winds". Hmm? In closing, not sure what the right answer is, but the same folks who violate you via either x-ray scans and/or cavity searches can not locate my lost/stolen luggage. Conclusion - they both suck!!!!!!!!!!

One other negative for Delta: when they lose your luggage and you call their 800# you get Rajiv in Mumbai who speaks pidgeon English with an unintelligible accent. Good luck with that level of "customer service" !!

quote:

Originally posted by boarkiller:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Look into Emirates and do not look back.

How does it works thru Emirates to Harare? I'm in Montana. And What's the expected price?
Heading out to Zim next year

Wow, sorry I missed this. Regarding price, in my experience Emirates is usually a couple of hundred less than both the others. My flight this coming November was $1750 round trip as I recall. Now part of that may be due to the fact that I am in Houston and Emirates has a direct flight to Dubai out of Houston. Regardless, it is good for me. I have made reservations for November and it will be my third trip over on Emirates. You overnight in Dubai, then catch the flight the next morning to Harare with one stop in Lusaka. I am a big fan of the Emirates option.

I just did JFK to joberg on SAA a few weeks ago. The flying time on the new airbus was a bit under 15 hours. Service was fine with no problems. Landed in plenty of time to catch my flight to Vic falls. I would rather overnight in Zim since that's where I'm hunting. As far as seats, going over I was in a middle seat and I'm 6 3" and survived. Also coming back direct through to JFk , no stop in darker which was another plus.

I've flown SAA and Delta several times. Also did a trip over on AA and Iberia through Madrid, but I don't recommend that one. 14 hr layover in Madrid both ways.

I've finally come to the opinion that Delta and SAA are not significantly different enough to really matter.

SAA tends to be about $400 cheaper but has the 1 hr fuel stop in Dakar, both directions. However, with SAA, unless the evening flight gets canceled, I can continue on to Harare without spending a night in JoBerg, completely avoiding the JNB SAPS gun permit issue.

Also, I've found the customs agents in Atlanta (Delta) are really on a power trip. They have everyone assemble in the waiting area, place everyone's documents into plastic files, then place those files into a holder, and WAIT until everyone who needs processing has arrived in the area. Then they call one at a time, in no certain order, disregarding first in first out. Returning through Dulles (SAA), I've never experienced anything like that from the customs guys.

IMO, the only Pro for Delta is the lack of refueling in Dakar and possibly the better seat. They are both crappy but my nod currently is toward SAA. I just booked my flights to HRE last week and once again chose SAA.

I'm getting close to booking for April. Looks like it will be SAA. As much as I'd like the legroom in economy comfort, the negatives on Delta are just too much.
I've heard there are extra firearms hassles with Emirates as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Marty:
I've heard there are extra firearms hassles with Emirates as well.

Marty, that is just wrong. Your travel agent applies for and get you firearms permit before you leave and you simply carry the permit with you. On my last trip I was never asked to even produce the firearms permit. To the contrary, I think Emirates goes to great links to ensure that the guns are moving with the permit holder every step of the way from departure to arrival.

Mike: is there any way to earn FF miles on Emirates other than flying, e.g. a credit card?

You got me. You need something like 9,750,000 miles (okay, well maybe that is a bit of an exaggeration) to get a ticket or upgrade any way so even if I was earning miles with a credit card I could not spend my way to an upgrade in one life time.

quote:

Originally posted by drj:
Mike: is there any way to earn FF miles on Emirates other than flying, e.g. a credit card?

Etihad Airways which is very similar to Emirates, is an AA partner. you fly through Abu Dhabi instead of Dubai from Chicago or NY. don't know about elsewhere in Africa but they do fly to Joburg.. best airline i have ever flown.

Emirates +1!

Just bought a round trip ticket on Emirates for travel from Houston to Harare the first couple weeks of November. My ticket, including taxes, was $1407.80. That's a bargain.

quote:

Also, I've found the customs agents in Atlanta (Delta) are really on a power trip. They have everyone assemble in the waiting area, place everyone's documents into plastic files, then place those files into a holder, and WAIT until everyone who needs processing has arrived in the area. Then they call one at a time, in no certain order, disregarding first in first out. Returning through Dulles (SAA), I've never experienced anything like that from the customs guys.

I've flown to Africa from Dulles, NYC (SAA) and Atlanta (Delta). The firearms clearance in Atlanta is the exactly as quoted above and by far the most time consuming. Never experienced anything like this in Dulles or NYC. If you have a connecting flight from Atlanta make sure you have a plenty of time between your flights.

Dr Scott and I returned from Zim thru Atlanta yesterday morning and the firearms check took all of about 15 minutes. The officers checking firearms started inspecting firearms as soon as the first cart with rifle cases arrived and even called for extra officers to speed up the process. The only "bad" part was the guy (don't think he was an officer since he wore no badge) who sprayed boots ordering people around.

Karl

I just came in this morning on Delta and customs was much better organized in Concourse F than last year when I flew back two weeks after it had opened. Even got a compliment on my rifle. Of course, I am still waiting for Delta to deliver my rifle which somehow didn't make my flight even with the "priority" tags all over it. Thumbs up to CBP and thumbs down to Delta. JNB was painless too for the third year in a row. Guess I have better luck with that airport than many.

Regards,

Don

My vote goes for Delta every time. I flew SAA again this July against my better judgment (with a few friends) and I still regret it.

I live in the Southern US so Delta is best in my opinion. I think that there is a flight from Atlanta to Johannesburg every day. That way you may be able to get your luggage if it was lost on a connection flight in the US. Flight over to SA will not be crowded but flight back always is c with people on stand by. Worth the extra money for Economy versus coach on flight back. I have had good results finding Delta tickets from my local AAA office.

In talking with Shawn at Gracy she parroted MJines on simplicity of using Emirates. Also their FF miles required at 95,000 for a ticket to Africa is not outrageous and comparable to BA.

Mark

Is there any way to earn ff miles on emirates other than actual flying? Any credit card?

drj,

I've been using an Alaska Air VISA card issued through Bank of America for over 20 years. One of Alaska's partners is Emirates so you can redeem your Alaska Air miles using Enirates. Certainly worth considering for the next safari.

Mark