Anyone have experience with the "new" Rigby, back in London and owned by Blaser vs. Heym bolt rifles?

I struggle to see value in the new Rigby as it is just another rifle maker with a well known name - has the "soul" of Rigby resurrected or is it just the next in a line of new owners?

On Heym, what about the Ralf Martini design? Looks great to me.

I don’t own either, but handled them both last year at DSC.

Rigby felt kind of club like - not very svelt. Did not have a chance to hold the highland stalker though, just the big bores.

Heym (and a Ralf Martini custom) are svelte and well executed. I have enjoyed handling one each year for the past few years at DSC. Always as great as I remember.

If I won the powerball, a Heym Martini Express would be my choice.

Handled both. Own the Hyem Martini, better balanced and very slick.

I have a Heym Martini Express in 416 Rigby and it is by far the best dangerous game bolt gun I have ever had.. It fits me well and is a pleasure to shoot. The accuracy has been minute of angle with all loads so far. However, the thing I like best is the slickness of the feeding. The receiver and magazine of the Heym are machined specifically for the cartridge for which they are chambered. This may be the reason for the slick feeding and it also protects the bullets from battering in the magazine.

As I understand it the new Rigbys have similar stock dimensions as the old ones. But even Selby had to rasp his stock down to fit.

Handled both the Rigby and the Heym/Martini at DSC a couple of years...my opinion...the Rigby fit and finish, balance, etc. was not even close to the Heym/Martini...

I am fortunate to own a Ralf Martini custom...a whole different level of fit, finish, balance, etc...

My "experience" mirrors the others. I carefully examined both at SCI and much preferred they Heym.
The Rigby in 375 was heavy and ill balanced and when I asked the Mauser "expert" at the booth about why it weighed so much he condescending told me "because it is a heavy rifle sir "
He certainly was correct, although the other vintage 375 Rigby at the show, rebarreled by Rigby from a 350, and a vintage H&H 375 each weighed a well balanced 8 1/2 pounds !

New Rigby is a joke for people who have to have the name rifle as others have stated.

Heym Mausers, Heym 21's, 20's and 30's are great guns.

BBW: Interesting comment. How many Heym’s and Rigby’s have you owned and used?

I guess I love a good joke as I have 2 Rigby’s. Andrew just presented my “special” Highlander here at DSC yesterday.

However, I am going to buy a 450 NE double and I may get a Heym. Of course those Verney Carron’s are nice...!

I think all the high end guns are similar and it all comes down to what you like and want. What is “best” is similar to a Ford/Chevy/Dodge/Lexus/Mercedes argument. But name actually does mean a lot when it comes to actual value and (most of the time) quality.

Safe shooting......LL

A good post.

I applaud Rigby for heading in the right direction and are attempting to make bolt rifles that look similar to the older ones. But they need to pay a bit closer attention to balance and details as the differences between good and great are subtle but significant.

A group of us are going to the Heym factory in the Spring.

It is 5 hours up the road.

There is a Heym 20 in 375 I have been playing with, but my buddy wants too much money for it.

Heym 98's are on Egun regularly and I have handled them. Even the pre-Ralph guns are still nice.

I handled the new Rigby 98 at Jagd and Hund last year. It lacked soul like something built on a CNC machine does.

One of my short list of gun purchases dreams for this place is to leave here with a 98 built by Mauser, Johannsen or Heym.

It will probably be a used one, and it will probably be cheaper than $5000, as that is about where I'd start to lose interest. Because I honestly can't afford to spend money that I'd rather spend hunting on something like that.

If you really want to see gun porn go to some of the bigger shops in Bavaria in the alps. www.egun.de and vdb waffen are good sites to look for high end German/Austrian guns.

A friend of mine has a shop near Stuttgart, I spent the weekend with him about 3 weeks ago, and has several hundred double rifles, combination guns and drillings.

It is my humble opinion (which I agree are like assholes), but it is hard to get excited about a CNC'd 98 for $14,0000. When you can buy a much nicer rifle with a different name on it for $7500, or wait until they are on the sale rack 2nd hand for $2500-5500.

If I had $14,000 to blow on a big bore 98, I'd see if Satterlee had one in stock. If he didn't I'd buy a new 98 Action and send it to someone good in the states. Or if I was here I'd find a 2nd hand Johannsen, New production 98 for $5000 and spend the other $9000 on moose and stags in Belarus.

Todd Ramirez is probably over $14,000, but if I was after a pretty rifle, maybe I'd go that route.



Nope to answer your question never owned any of those guns. My most expensive rifles were a Sako TRG-42 in 338 Lapua, and a Blaser S-2 double rifle. Neither one of those is currently in possession as I sold all my guns when I moved to Germany a year ago.

http://www.egun.de/market/uplo...06126.1404179620.jpg

Euros 5000.

2nd hand.

Magnum system 2nd hand rifles for this price on egun all the time.

http://www.egun.de/market/uplo.../6675228.7325744.jpg

$7500 real 98 10,75x68.

Thanks for the insights.

I am headed to DSC to look and hopefully guy a Heym. Not sure which caliber but something that shoots bullets the make big holes....

I really like the Heym/Martini rifles but think they are a bit heavy for .375 but right on for .404 and the .416.

Heym Martini gets my vote

quote:

Originally posted by 10generation:
I really like the Heym/Martini rifles but think they are a bit heavy for .375 but right on for .404 and the .416.

I agree on this one, which one did you buy Dogcat?

quote:

Originally posted by ozhunter:
Heym Martini gets my vote

Mine too!

I handled both yesterday at DSC. I loved the Heym, and was very disappointed in the Rigby. As others have stated, I found the balance and handling of the Heym to be superior to the Rigby. In addition, I was working the action on a Rigby chambered in 450 Rigby and the bolt bound on the floor plate, there was enough movement in the floor plate that when I was attempting to close the bolt, it forced the front of the plate upward and forward into the chamber. I was not expecting this from a Rigby rifle.

Edit:
I’ll also add that I own the previous model Heym Express in 450 Rigby. It is a great rifle, but the difference between my model and the new one is night and day. The only reason I didn’t leave DSC with a new one is that Chris was fitting a customer for a double rifle which gave me time to come to my senses and realize how much money I had already spent with Banovich and Charlton McCallum!

I can think of a lot of custom builders that are much better than either IMO..So many are afraid to cut off more wood and end up with a clubby gun..The old English guns were oh so much nicer..

I was interested in the highland stalker and handled one at SCi.

I was looking at the .275 and it felt a bit heavy. learned that they make all of the stalkers in the exact same barrel contour - as a result, the .275 is heaviest and apparently the 9/3x62 is lighter - more metal removed from same barrel diameter.

Seemed strange to me that you could order any combination of wood grade, embellishments, etc. but contour was fixed.

I was seriously considering getting the .275 based on handling a pre-production one early last year (which felt great in the hands) but not interested any more.

Both Heym and Rigby were at Jagd and Hund, and I made it up there on Friday.

Heym was a wonderful firearm. Everything about it was perfect. I handled one of the Martini-Heyms, and it was perfection in my hands. Same money, no question Heym every time.

I wouldn't buy a Rigby unless I could get it in a big bore caliber for under $4000. It just wasn't a very nice rifle for what they wanted for it.

would like to see the Heym Martini in 7x57 and 9.3x62 in a standard length M98

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
I can think of a lot of custom builders that are much better than either IMO..So many are afraid to cut off more wood and end up with a clubby gun..The old English guns were oh so much nicer..

We really appreciate all the light and cheeriness you bring to this forum.....

Most of us know a gaggle of custom aggregators/designers that can put a rifle together. They are lined up at DSC and SCI selling their work....

I have a great deal of admiration for Ralf Martini's attention to fine details when he builds a custom & for him to allow his name to associated with this rifle speaks volumes about the quality in my opinion. I've seen both in person and also recent production Mauser 98's. Only the Heym appeared 'refined'. The other 2 were OK but had a 'production' look to them such as round corners, not sharp.

Companies like Rigby will spend a great deal of time speaking about there glorious history and their glamourous clientele but very little on details concerning the actual rifles.For example areas like the type of barrels they use, how are they made, how their rifles point and shoot.It seems like all rifle companies and custom gunmakers today have taken the mass production/factory approach to building rifles.Even so called hand made stocks are all looking identical.It seems like money is the name of the game and not building fine rifles or the fancier it looks the shittier it is.

Shootaway,
I rarely agree with you on a variety of topics but I fully agree on your comments above.

I went to Dallas, looked over the various makers and "custom" guys. The only company I can find that makes all of the parts themselves is HS Precision and Dakota (and I am not sure on Dakota). Everyone else buys barrels from company X, has the actions made by company Y, buys triggers from Timney and stocks are made on a machine that copies another stock. I understand the part about "fit and finish" wood to metal etc. But CNC machining makes parts for the rockets and computers and Iphones - the fit and finish there is pretty good.

I get the part about "tweeking" the action or the double square bridge or barrel band sling, but that is not making it from scratch.

In my mind, "custom" is not aggregating parts, then assembling the gun.

I know I have pissed off every "custom" gun maker out there, but I fail to see the exorbitant value charged for aggregating and tweeking.

BTW - I agree on the Heym, dances around the new Rigby in terms of "feel".

You can just look at a rifle and see how much hand building was involved.For example if the stock and metal work has a non perfect, soft shape you can be sure there were hours of somewhat skilled manual labor involved.I was looking at the original Corbett Rigby and this was evident....weird soft trigger and trigger guard, soft stock.

I bought one of the first new Heyms for my son a couple of years. A very nice rifle for the money (and I own examples from most of the custom makers (though not new Rigby)

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Companies like Rigby will spend a great deal of time speaking about there glorious history and their glamourous clientele but very little on details concerning the actual rifles.For example areas like the type of barrels they use, how are they made, how their rifles point and shoot.It seems like all rifle companies and custom gunmakers today have taken the mass production/factory approach to building rifles.Even so called hand made stocks are all looking identical.It seems like money is the name of the game and not building fine rifles or the fancier it looks the shittier it is.

Yes Shootaway..you are spot on here..they live too much on old glory. Its like trying to tell Purdey that the Beesley lock is useless in a double rifle for DG. I was invited into their Long Room last november and handeled a .600...I had to use all my strenght to close it. I had the audacity to point out that its far too slow to use..and mind you, this come from the owner of a Purdey shotgun. The answer: "Our rifles are quite up to the job Sir" Yeah right..

I did not see a single person at the Purdey booth, aside from the guys working there, the whole 3 days I attended.

The reality is that BOTH Rigby and Westley Richards were second rank rifle makers compared to Holland & Holland "Back in the day".

Now I'd say that Westley Richards are the acme and that's from a person, myself, who thought Simon Clode as even more arrogant than his father. But all respect to him for what he did to leapfrog Westley to where it is today in 2017.

Rifle building isn't difficult. It's no more than assembling a shopping list of bits. These aren't rifle makers they are component "assemblers".

But what IS difficult is getting it right, such that like a Colt 1911, form follows function and there isn't a ounce of metal or wood that isn't absolutely necessary.

And that's the skill. Holland's still have it in rifle making. Westley have, under the late Simon Clode, re-gained it and are now IMHO first rank rifle makers.

Rigby? I've seen the Robert's Rigby rifles and the very fine Ron Wharton Rigby style rifles. But not the new Rigby...yet I wish them well.

But they need to get it right to avoid being more than just "assemblers" trading on a past name.

Since assembly of components vs manufacture was brought up-

just for informations sake-

HEYM makes the bulk of their parts:
barrel
receiver
bolt
magazine
stock
trigger

HEYM typically sources small parts:
sights
rings, claws, bases, swivels
pad
etc

As to the Express-
Ralf Martini's redesign of the rifle is IMO suberb

Rigby is owned by the same group as blaser, sig, Mauser, sauer.

Their actions are made on probably the most modern gunnmaking equipment. Their steel is probably the best in the world. Same most likely can be said for Hyem.

The wood work and rifle completion is done in uk.

I have an ahr custom/semi custom 375 built on a cz that is an excellent rifle.

Neither Mauser not Hyem make left handed guns. There is an excellent martini left handed for sale and it is exceptional.

Hyem or rigby or martini - these are all quasi bespoke guns.

Like bespoke suits their value is mainly to the person it is built for. I think both rifles would perform much better than the skill set of average client who buys them.

I like synthetic blasers, they are exceptional tools but not bespoke guns.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Clan_Colla:
Since assembly of components vs manufacture was brought up-

just for informations sake-

HEYM makes the bulk of their parts:
barrel
receiver
bolt
magazine
stock
trigger

HEYM typically sources small parts:
sights
rings, claws, bases, swivels
pad
etc

As to the Express-
Ralf Martini's redesign of the rifle is IMO suberb

I believe Ruger,Winchester and others make their parts too.