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The thing not to do is try to use custom rifles as investments. Most won't make any money; but lose much of it; but that is not the point

That's for sure one just has to look at them for sale here.

Almost always well under build value.

The best value for a custom rifle is to by a used one.

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The best value for a custom rifle is to by a used one.

In so doing the buyer has purchased a rifle custom made for someone else. So we are back to the difference between a rifle that is custom made to your specifications and one that is hand-assembled/finished.

I bought a WR .375 H&H from WR a some years back for $600. you can imagine what condition it was in..Bob called me and said I betcha you can do something with this rifle..At the price why not.

I cleaned the bore and it was packed with hardened grease, it looked pretty good to my surprise but the outside was custom pit finished some freckling inside! I had the barrel copied with a new Lothar Walther barrel blank,and I did some draw filing to closer specs.
After a 101 class with a friend welder and 6 months of welding pits with clothes hangers, and bailing wire on the action and bottom metal, hours of filing and honing, to get the metal right. (thanks Jack Belk) who coached me along..the the wood was split and cracked and rotting checkering was barely visable, if you squeezed it to hard it left a hand pring! I glassed it together found a piece of Eruopean walnut that matched the original stright grain (why? just because I wanted to look like it did at birth) copied the stock,checkering had Doug Turnbull cut the lettering on the barrel,using the old barrel as a pattern, had the front barrel band sight copied as the old one was thin thin..Did some research and found out it had laid in the bottom of a canoe as it belonged to a Croc hunter in Zim,...All told it took about 18 months to two years for completion..I kept it for awhile, swore never to sell it, and I didn't, but I did trade it to a gentleman on AR, but hasn't been on AR for awhile. Rob Gunbuilder, very knowledgeable gun gooney..He had a friend that wanted the rifle and traded me SweetThang, my double rifle for years after that, straight across...Some 7 or 8 years later I saw the gun for sale on WR sight, price in a case for more money than Ive seen in one spot, and Ive seen a lot of money in one spot..Offered as a mint WR..I didn't bother to call and open a can of worms and be chastised...It was a special rifle that I should never have traded off..but its a cherished memory and a good story..

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Originally posted by Saeed:


My own 375/404.

I designed it, I built it, I have been hunting with it for so many years, I will never sell it for any price

+1

I've built a .44 mag carbine for my son (10+ years ago), a .35 Whelen for my wife, and a 7x57 for myself (both in the past 18 months).. and am now in the middle of building a custom .270 for the wife, and a customer .458 win mag for myself..

They arent the most expensive rifles in my safe.. and arent even the most accurate or the most beautiful, etc..etc..

But they are far and away the most "valuable" to me..

I have gotten a lot of satisfaction building them myself.. knowing I cut the chambers, I fitted the stocks, I machined parts, lapped lugs, mounted barrels, etc..etc..etc.. and then developed and assembled the loads/cartridges, etc.. and then took them to the field and used them successfully...

Im neither a gunsmith (more of a gun mechanic) or a wood worker/craftsman.. so, the learning process involved in building the rifles has also brought a lot of satisfaction and value (as well as huge moments of frustration and anger at times )...

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Originally posted by mdwest:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:


My own 375/404.

I designed it, I built it, I have been hunting with it for so many years, I will never sell it for any price

+1

I've built a .44 mag carbine for my son (10+ years ago), a .35 Whelen for my wife, and a 7x57 for myself (both in the past 18 months).. and am now in the middle of building a custom .270 for the wife, and a customer .458 win mag for myself..

They arent the most expensive rifles in my safe.. and arent even the most accurate or the most beautiful, etc..etc..

But they are far and away the most "valuable" to me..

I have gotten a lot of satisfaction building them myself.. knowing I cut the chambers, I fitted the stocks, I machined parts, lapped lugs, mounted barrels, etc..etc..etc.. and then developed and assembled the loads/cartridges, etc.. and then took them to the field and used them successfully...

Im neither a gunsmith (more of a gun mechanic) or a wood worker/craftsman.. so, the learning process involved in building the rifles has also brought a lot of satisfaction and value (as well as huge moments of frustration and anger at times )...

I completely understand!

The Wiebe rifle is now mine, thanks for the heads up

Well, let's see a few good photos of it.

Some folks have the money and others have the required skill, do they actually hate each other?

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Originally posted by robert lerner:
The Wiebe rifle is now mine, thanks for the heads up

I’m glad that it went to someone here. It was a great buy.

Value ( assuming of course material value and not sentimental value) in custom guns , knives, you name it comes form mainly two sources.

The first and foremost is Signature style and then linked to that in close second craftsmanship which goes hand in hand with the piece doing what it is supposed to.

If one were to stand in front of a rack of fine guns as I have done on many a occasion it is possible to just at a glance to pick out guns and name them by maker based on the concept of signature style. This is particularly true of big name makers or gunmakers houses of the past where signature style was very strong and distinct.

The value basically then directly proportional to the product of style and craftsmanship and indirectly proportional to the concept of finite number. The smaller the number and especially when there is a number one and number "last" will add to the value. A single piece owned and used by a single notable user adds to this portion of the equation !

Its a simple formula.

Value ( $) = Style x craftsmanship / finite number.

Where it comes asunder is when clients ask craftsmen to mix gun style and thereby contravening the "rules of style etiquette"

The best way to describe this by analogy of cars. its perfectly ok to have a standing signature hood ornament on a vintage Rolls Royce Jaguar or Mercedes Benz but the height of kitsch if the same were to be done with a ford

When I asked about "value" I didn't mean monetary value - or put another way - objective value.

Rather, I meant subjective value. Value that is personal to the person that owns the piece. It can't be defined objectively, buy only by the multitude of stories of treasured custom rifles by their owners. What makes those custom rifles so special to you?

Things like what you had to do to purchase the custom rifle, or special memories of special hunts that were taken with the custom rifle, or special meetings with the custom builder while you were planning the rifle, of if you didn't commission the rifle then special events that happened during your campaign to purchase the rifle.

I like that last story by Ray Atkinson about the WR rifle, which I take to be a Westley Richards Rifle. Only problem with you Ray is that you have all of these great personal stories about nice rifles but you don't have any photos of them. Otherwise a great story about how you valued and worked that rifle.

Try Double tap 175 gr Nosler Partition ammo and profit. Used to be my rifle! Great condition, almost bought it back. They sold it at a loss. Used to be a 338 Win, but was rebarreled by Mark Penrod by a previous owner. A bit heavy for a 7mm Mag IMO at ~9.5 lbs, plus I never used it is why is got sold. Much as I like wood, I invariably grab a synthetic stocked rifle when going out of state. Enjoy it, it’s a good rifle!

The American buyer for the most part looks at a custom rifle and all he sees is all that marble cake (that may in time open up or split or crack) but maybe not, the stand up pretty well in the glass closet..

I like a straight grained piece of wood that has a little contrast, but mostly a grain pattern that runs from the tow into the forend and the same from the grip up with the grain pushing up a little bit, and with a dark matrix and some black contrasting strips to give it some color, but no marble cake. I want a wood stock that is as stable as fiberglass, contrary to some new generations shooters thinking! but Im a hunter not an exhibitionist,

Marble cake in the butt only is acceptable but not my cup of tea..Too much color takes away from the guns workmanship with a lot of folks..It has amazed how many stock makers don't know much about wood itself..The guns that sell the fastest have the gaudiest wood however..

The above is only my opinion, based on my personal choice, not a condemnation on anyones taste or preference, Just based on what I consider the greatest value in a custom Rifle.

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Originally posted by lindy2:
I asked a question about the best time to buy a custom rifle. I am curious about what some feel has been the best value in a custom rifle.
(I do not mean the cheapest. I mean the best value - the one custom rifle that you feel you got or get the most value from for your money. Just one Custom.

What is "value"? Or, how do you define it? What do you mean by "custom"? Anything that isn't exactly as it left the factory to the original owner?

I spent most on a Duane Wiebe 404 Jeffery, next to most on a modified K98 Mauser now in 9.3 X 62, a little less on my Brno ZKK 602 with some add-ons and mods, and least on my Winchester Model 70 (if I limit myself to those that were worked on by better smiths than I, meaning all of them). Duane's rifle certainly has the best fit and finish, the best esthetics and the best workmanship of them all, not counting that it fits me well and I shoot it well. But all of them are fit for purpose, all of them are reliable, all of them shoot very well. And, depending on the hunt, I would take any of them to Africa with me, none are safe queens. Duane's 404 Jeffery has been to Tanzania and Burkina Faso for buffalo; if the animal is big that is the rifle I take.

I still don't know exactly what the question is. I understand that some people buy very expensive rifles but never hunt with them. I suppose the value to them has little to do with using them for their intended purpose. If it has no value for its intended purpose, then I'm not sure what it's good for. But then, what is a Picasso good for? I hear they sell for high prices at auction. So I'll ask the question to you: what's the best value in works of art?

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So I'll ask the question to you: what's the best value in works of art?

How can we ever know the feeling of someone else. We hear a word and we think of its meaning in terms of our own experience, which may or may not be the same as the person who spoke it.

As I said, Value is subjective. Its personal to each person who perceives it. And its interesting to hear people speak about those perceptions so that we can compare them to our own experiences.

Art is like another language. It speak to each of us in a way that each of us can personally understand for ourselves, but never exactly convey to others because we cannot be another, we can only be ourselves.

It doesn't really matter what the rifle is, or how much one paid for it, or whether is has facny walnut or a rust blued barrel. Those are objective things. There is more to it than that. A 100 million dollar Van Gogh is just a piece of canvas and some pigments. But its more than that. And that is the value that I am talking about.