I have bought two 404 Jeff bottom metals from Duane Wiebe. One was bought for a standard 98 action 416 Rigby project and the other for a 404 project. Both are of the highest quality, and I am more than pleased with them. However, both units will have the guard bows replaced with Oberndorf style bows. This is partly because I want both rifles to look like pre-war Oberndorf and/or Rigby rifles, and partly because I just prefer the Oberndorf style bow.(The 416 will look early post war, but the guard bow is still Oberndorf). Duane tells me that he does not plan to make any units with the Oberndorf style bow. This sux for guys like me that prefer the Oberdorf style bow (I am planing a 9.3x62 in a copy of the Mauser Type A as well). I know that Blackburn-Swift and Sunny hill make a few units with the Oberndorf bow, but so far I prefer Weibe's box and floor plate etc. I'm making this post hopefully to convince Duane to start making at least some of his guarbows in Oberndorf. Perhaps there is not a market for them, I don't really know. If I were making a scoped only mauser rifle in the american style I would prefer Duane's design.

Question:
Which guard bow do you prefer when building classic styled mauser rifles:

Choices:
Oberndorf
Wiebe/Others

 

HAR! I'm trying to stuff the ballot, so voted for "Wiebe"


Seriously, though, My TG is neither fish nor fowl. We recognized the demand for a more conventional look, so leaned toward Obendorf while attempting to keep a "modern" look.

Now the large Oberndorf must have been somebody's mistake. The guard is set further to the rear, in fact so far that winding the guard screw can easily cause the shaft of the driver to scratch the guard. Then too, with the more rearward posistion, your social finger is more likely to take a bruising.

I'll be real interested in the results. Without the contouring, (rounding off, tapering) an Obendorf would not be difficult to program.

Winding the guard screw is not a dayly affair, but you ´ll often have your finger in the trigger guard bow.
In the Oberndorf style there is more room (especially when you wear gloves).

If the trigger guard was left un-shaped - basically raw without the rounding and shaping of the Wiebe' trigger guard style - would their be enough meat to the metal for your gunsmith to shape the trigger guard into an Oberndorf' style trigger guard?

quote:

I'll be real interested in the results. Without the contouring, (rounding off, tapering) an Obendorf would not be difficult to program.

So, wheres the problem...

Come on- 146 views and only 9 have voted? It's an anonymous poll!

quote:

Originally posted by srtrax:

quote:

I'll be real interested in the results. Without the contouring, (rounding off, tapering) an Obendorf would not be difficult to program.

So, wheres the problem...

Demand!

Prob a dumb idea but...

What about a small run of Oberndorf bows that would
be sized to fit with less work to an existing Weibe
bottom metal?

It would cost more than having it made with an Oberndorf
bow, but would be less work (maybe) than fitting a 1909 bow.
Since it could b made to line up to match the Wiebe bottom metal.

I would buy 2 bows if they were made.

Allen

quote:

Originally posted by AllenBosely:
Prob a dumb idea but...

What about a small run of Oberndorf bows that would
be sized to fit with less work to an existing Weibe
bottom metal?

It would cost more than having it made with an Oberndorf
bow, but would be less work (maybe) than fitting a 1909 bow.
Since it could b made to line up to match the Wiebe bottom metal.

I would buy 2 bows if they were made.

Allen

PS, you know witch I voted for huh?

That's a really great idea allen. If something like this is ever produced, I'll take four large Oberndorf guaurd bows + 2 model 1M's. BTW, it occurs to me, after the fact, that a post like this could really P.O. Duane or anyone in his position. This was certainly not my intent, and perhaps I should have spoken with Duane before performing what I see as unsolicited market research. I understand that he makes what he thinks he can sell and/or what he damn well wants to, and he does it very well. I apologize if I have done any harm or offended... So, when are we gonna see some Oberndorf guard bows!!

These would Prob be a low volume item

So if Duane was to make a small & large Oberndorf
bows there just may be enough of us nuts to buy a small
run up!

I mean they prob wouldn't be to terribly expensive
to buy so I could buy a few extra just to have for later.
Where as buying a bottom metal assembly is a fair bit of
$ plus cartridge spicfic so I couldn't have 4 or 5 on hand.

If Duane made us some Oberndorf bows they would 'fit' his
bottom metal closely, so would b less of a pain lining everything
up.

I would want it with no hand finishing on it, just off the machine.
That way the gunsmith could contour it to go with the style of each
particular gun.

Hey Duane, would you consiter making us some bows?

I would be in for 4 small (1909 aprox sized) bows.

If you were to do this, would it be simpler to include
the floor plate release lever then it could be final fitted
by the smith.

Allen

quote:

Originally posted by srtrax:

quote:

I'll be real interested in the results. Without the contouring, (rounding off, tapering) an Obendorf would not be difficult to program.

So, wheres the problem...

There is no problem. Recknagel makes them all day long. Asked them nicely and they may even sell one perhaps or maybe two

What Recknagel sells is far away from being Oberndorf style.

quote:

Originally posted by heavenknows:
What Recknagel sells is far away from being Oberndorf style.

prove that!.

The poll results are not actually overwhelming, even if I take oout my vote....but...I THINK the requests are mostly for the guard bow as a stand alone item?

Off the top of my head, I believe I'd be hasppiler with my end p[roduct if we just made the bottom metal with proper guard????

Gents, I really want to be accomodating, but the scenario of Mexican bottom metal with wider tangs to fit military stocks comes back to haunt me.

There was wide spread enthusiam, I made a run and when push came to shove, didn't sell one damn unit!

Having bitcheds about that...I'm a sucker for punishment...so...does anyone have a genuine Oberndorf guard as sample? Will the 1909 be "close enough"?

Should be able to patch on a new guard program, but a little thought will have to be given to floorplate fit.

Let me know seeya

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by srtrax:

quote:
I'll be real interested in the results. Without the contouring, (rounding off, tapering) an Obendorf would not be difficult to program.


So, wheres the problem...



Demand!

If anyone should know it would be you, you are the one doing it... you are DE-MAN

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe:
Gents, I really want to be accomodating, but the scenario of Mexican bottom metal with wider tangs to fit military stocks comes back to haunt me.

There was wide spread enthusiam, I made a run and when push came to shove, didn't sell one damn unit!

So...what happened to the unwanted ones? I might be interested if the price is RIGHT!?!

But you probably just cut the tangs narrower and then sold 'em, right?
Regards, Joe

To clarify my understanding of the topic I added a picture.

From top to bottom:
1. What i name the americanized version of an Argentine Triggerguard bow.
2. Röll Mauser
3. Original classic Oberndorf
4. Argentine



The Argentine is nice for slim , standard length magazinboxes.
The classic Oberndorf is much better balanced to the bigger caliber boxes (Independent from straddle type floorplate).
The boxes for the longer cartridges with the small/short bow looks to me like a dog who lost his balls (sorry Mr. Wiebe)

JD Steele...yes...that's exactly what I did...seeya Duane

.

Hey Duane, I want to say thanks for even consitering
this for us.
I appreciate it even if in the end it isn't practical
for you to make these.

Yes heavenknows I agree, that's why I think we need a
standard (small) size for 06'magazines and a large for
the long mags boxes.

Since I'm not a gunsmith, when replacing ya guard bow.

Do you cut only the guard bow off the tang & just replace
the bow?

Or do you cut the tang & guard bow off between the box & bow
& weld a new tang & guard bow on?

If I had my druthers I'd rather the bow shape as close to the
traditional Oberndorf bow as reasonably doable.

Cheers, Allen

Hey Duane,

Don't be so quick, I got one of your wide tang Mexican TG. Its beautiful and I appreciate it. I signed up for one, you forgot me but finally came around. Thanks, I always be your customer.
Bob Hoffmann

Yea manhasset, that's the down side to getting Duane's
stuff.
Once ya do you become spoiled! Always done right & works well!

Allen

I’ll throw my 2¢ into the mix…

The discussion is kind of humorous in the sense that the bulk number of M98 Mauser actions, both commercial and military, are of a single length – that being the standard length action when measured from the action screw holes – with the primary difference being the length of the machined-in magazine box and relating floorplate.

Regarding the size of the Oberndorf trigger bow – it is my presumption that both the Oberndorf and the Röll Mauser trigger bows were sized to afford sufficient ‘finger room’ when using the classic Mauser double trigger (just as shown in the photograph). That said, the size of the Oberndord is perfect for use with a gloved finger and a modern single trigger tracking closely to the back of the bow.

My two choices are the classic Oberndorf trigger bow shape followed by the original 1909 Argentine trigger bow shape.

And, for the ‘best all around’ trigger bow shape for both the standard 3.3-3.4” magazine box and the long 3.6” magazine box I’d have to give the to the original classic Oberndorf.

So when purchasing a Wiebe’ custom bottom metal, if given the option of the current trigger bow shape or the classic Oberndorf trigger bow shape, my selection would be the Oberndorf.

Looking at these triggerbows and then at the compare with the Recknagel I have the recknagel is a 99% clone of the Oberndorf style. The more I stare the more I get blinded and see no difference.
I would take a magazinebox from Duane if it was done in Oberndorf style with COL 3,6". either standard or dropbox.

OK...I want to get it right the first time., I now see two new shapes (for me) emerging. We now offer 10 models in the Mauser, so if there was to be three different TG designs....well... do the math...can't see less than two more different florplates, (standard and pocket)...let' s see...that makes a total of 90 possible configurations....and...four more new latch designs...a bit overwhelming !

Every change comes out to about $400.00-600.00 in programming.

Yes, I'd like to be accomodating, but we have to narrow the field to something manageable

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe:
....
Seriously, though, My TG is neither fish nor fowl. We recognized the demand for a more conventional look, so leaned toward Obendorf while attempting to keep a "modern" look.
....

Duane,

We Mauser users appreciate the variety of but especially the quality of the products you offer for the M98 Mauser. Unfortunately many of us - and I may be wrong in this reguard - fall towards the traditional tilt vs the modern tilt, when look is concerned.

I have two rifles being built, both using your 4MJ bottom metals and personally would prefer an Oberndorf or an '09 Argentine trigger boe style - I will always take quality over a slightly less visual preference.

And I will honestly say that it will be at least few years before I'm ready to commission a 3rd rifle build so I definately am not the person ready to place my money where my mouth - or in this case my fingers - is (are).

Now I have a monkey wrench to throw into the mix.
I have handled one of the Wiebe-Mauser bottom metals with an unfinished trigger bow and there is plenty of meat in the bow for it to be shaped into a cross between a smaller Oberndorf and an '09 Argentine bow style. I also believe that all current Mauser floor plates would be unaffected by a modified Oberndorf/Argentine bow style cut from the current unfinished trigger bow. Duane is this a correct assumption? If correct - and this is for those participating in the thread - how many would prefer the modified Oberndorf/Argentine trigger bow vis-a-vis the current Wiebe bow style?

And Duane, I want to say thank you for allowing my participation in a discussion that directly affects your pocketbook.

Good thoughts...A you can probably see, I'm open to any change..just want to make sure it's the right one.

How about this? The "standard" Obendorf for standard configuration and large for pot belly?

quote:

How about this? The "standard" Obendorf for standard configuration and large for pot belly?

I would give this suggestion

How about this? The "standard" Obendorf for standard configuration and large for pot belly?

That would be fantastic!

I vote YES on that!

Would it be possible to get an Oberndorf bow to retro
fit to an existing 1M?

I have a 1M already, would like to modify it with an Oberndorf
bow when the become available.

So would an Oberndorf bow be available also?
Pretty please?

Cheers, Allen

I always thought the large was best suited for dst and the standard for a standard trigger. I'd figure it to be more for the trigger configuation than if a drop box or not.
Don

What about these assemblies?

I vote large Oberndorf for all. Other than the 500 Jeff, do you make any Drop bellies anymore, Duane?

quote:

Originally posted by Chuck Nelson:
What about these assemblies?

I believe that is Echols' work. I like it. Very oberndorfISH

Pot belly's...yes a bunch

Mr. Wiebe, I want to order one of your Mauser bottom metal for a 375 H&H I'm putting together. I want my gun stock to have the look of the rifle pictured above - I guess it would be called a drop box look?

Would your "3M" box give this look or is it likely the "3MX"?

Also, do your boxes come with the spring and follower or is that ordered separately?

Thanks!

And FWIW, I prefer your trigger bow!

That would be the 3MX. We are out of them...Finishing up Mini M<auser bottom metal, M-70 stuff is right behind that, then Mausers.

Im guessing Feburary. Spring and follower extra

Thanks, Duane

Very good sir.

Thanks.

Duane, what is the inside length (front to back)
of the 1M 06' box?

What is the max COL that will work in it?

I don't have mine here.

Cheers, Allen