Duane, I see that you edited your last post to remove the comment about 'the public trough'. I guess maybe it needed removing...

Where do I fit? Well, most of those expenses you list are things I already own or contract for anyway, so the only extra expenses I can count are the licenses and various small hassles. Secured shop is in the fenced back yard, separate building with fire protection and tied to the house electrical with alarms & safe but the 'fierce watchdog' (9 lbs) just died last week, gotta get another one.

Your response seems somewhat defensive and maybe even a touch antagonistic, I wasn't attacking or even questioning you.
Regards, hope you have a good day, Joe

FYI, the other 20 minutes per hour are not spent in the bathroom. They're spent answering the phone. You either have to do it or hire somebody else to do it.

JD-

your check was a hell of a lot less than 53% of what it cost to employ you. Again, people who make a W-2 income almost never know their true cost to the entity that signs their check. And your large employer had a lot of people over which to spread out their overhead. Plus they have an ungodly amount more ways to spread or defer costs that any small business, much less a one man shop, has available to them.

Duane has to figure in a ton of things not listed in his list that was not intended to be all-inclusive. He really does have to figure in his retiremnt, vacations, every sort of insurance, amortization for everything related to his shop, every sort of imaginable consumable, unbillable hours for things you cannot imagine, etc, etc.

Give it up. you have transgressed your relm of expertise (whatever that may be) and are making an ass out of yourself.

Oh, and by the way-many of the EXACT SAME "nuke certified" welders who welded at your nuclear facility also worked for me at times and I have looked at a ton of film shot of their welds. I signed their timesheets and am good friends with soem of them.

And you know what? I weld my own bolt handles and they like my work.

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
Oh, and by the way-many of the EXACT SAME "nuke certified" welders who welded at your nuclear facility also worked for me at times and I have looked at a ton of film shot of their welds. I signed their timesheets and am good friends with soem of them.

And you know what? I weld my own bolt handles and they like my work.

Marc, if they liked your work then I'd probably like it too, I assume it doesn't have a void in the interior (grin). Sorry you don't like me but where did your welding rant come from?

FYI IIRC I am the guy who first proposed the $80/hr rate in this thread as being reasonable. I've been a small businessman on several occasions in several different milieus beginning in the late '60s up until today and am fully aware of all the hidden costs. Have also been a professional 'cost engineer' for many years, fancy name for bean counter/part-time construction manager.

I already said I never doubted Duane's word about what he spent; I DID say I was amazed. But then I'm also amazed at houses in other parts of the country that cost over $300/sf when the same exact house in my area can be built for $100/sf. Maybe that's one reason why so many folks are moving down here recently.

My total utility cost (water, gas, electricity, sewage, garbage pickup, etc) for my 3-BR 2000 sf house and additional 650 sf shop & music room (in a 4-university major-metro area) is 11 cents per square foot per month, IOW an average of $290/mo. Total annual property tax bill on my house and shop is $1600 but Homestead Exemption knocks it down to half that. Compare your own area and you too may be amazed....
Sorry your panties got into such a wad, regards, Joe

Hey man, came across wrong. I think it is one of those things where reading on a computer screen and knowing tone of writer does not match up. Did not intend to make it sound like I don't like you personally. We actually have a lot of things in common and I imagine we would hit it right off if we ever get to meet in person.

quote:

Originally posted by J.D.Steele:
My total utility cost (water, gas, electricity, sewage, garbage pickup, etc) for my 3-BR 2000 sf house and additional 650 sf shop & music room (in a 4-university major-metro area) is 11 cents per square foot per month, IOW an average of $290/mo. Total annual property tax bill on my house and shop is $1600 but Homestead Exemption knocks it down to half that. Compare your own area and you too may be amazed....
Sorry your panties got into such a wad, regards, Joe

Can I move in with you? Wherever you live is certianly DIRT cheap. I figured $1.03 /sq.ft/mo. Rent, utilities, insurance, etc, not including wages. I am positive my costs are much less than Mr. Wiebe and others.

By the way, I am one of those that got out of college (first degree) with no debt, and only $3500 in debt from my second degree. I took the maximum course load allowed, worked 3 part time jobs, ate Ramen, and my parents STILL had to help pay for school. I went to the second cheapest state school in the state.

To buy a shop here the cheapest and smallest I found was 5000 sq ft. Old worn out building with leaks, needed a new roof, out of code w/ Fire Marshall, in a bad neighborhood, etc. $200,000.

Build my own? Ha... banks would not loan money to someone(me) with a credit score of 762. Nevermind the fact that the ATF would not give me a license out in the country(per my ATF agent).

So my point... $40k a year... I am amazed it is that LITTLE for someone with a full time shop and position of someone like Mr.Wiebe.

Nathaniel, IIWY I'd move!
Regards, Joe

Where the hec can you purchase any specialized service for $40/hour? Granted, I live in the northeast where everything is expensive. Try hiring a plumber or electrician. That's why I learned to do things myself.

Last month I tuned up my Yukon and the last time I did a tuneup on any vehicle was over 20 years ago. But when you get quoted $700 for a tune-up, you reaquaint yourself and do it yourself especially when you relize that with less than $200 you can buy everything you need to do a tune-up.

If a gun-smith charges $60-$80/hour, it's a fair price, IMO. The cost of doing business has shot through the roof. It's expensive to run a business nowadays.

So what is the answer to the question? How many hours does it take a full time pro to make a stock from scratch. No duplicating machines or CNC machine. Duane can you make one of your masterpiece's in 50 hours? $5000 is cheap for a hand made work of art! Dont let that go to your head until after I have saved up for two of your masterpiece's!

Im content knowing two things for certain about top grade stocks;
- that they involve alot more than 40-50 hrs-
- that they charge alot less than 40-$100/hr.

quote:

Granted, I live in the northeast where everything is expensive.

The north east and the west cost of the US are known as high cost regions. Many businesses locate aways from these areas to lower their operating costs. When having work bid on by shops around the country the high cost regions have a hard time competing.