I was looking for another rifle in one of our original double rifle ledgers and I kept seeing the same name over and over. I admit that I didn't do an exhaustive search, but wow!





Finished on April 4, 1902 in .450 Nitro Express for the Maharana of Udaipur.

H.H. Maharana of Udaipur took delivery of a single barrel, falling block action .350 Rigby on November 4, 1903 and Best Grade Rising Bite rifles in the following calibers: a .500 Nitro Express on April 19, 1904, a.350 Rigby Nitro Express on February 6, 1906, a .256 on July 24, 1907, a .350 Rigby Nitro Express on February 3, 1909 and .470 Nitro Express on September 28, 1909!

Clearly he was a man of great wealth and taste! Here's a picture of Fateh Singh, the 31st Maharana of Udaipur.



And here is Bhupal Singh, who was the 32nd Maharana of Udaipur, who was also a Rigby client.



Clearly later in life. I'm guessing that's a Rigby.



I posted this on our Facebook page first and IMMEDIATELY came to AR to create this post...

Very nice indeed.

I also think he also had a few Hollands,
one of which is over here.


Edit
What is the LOP on his guns as he looks to be quite a short fellow ?

.

I have no doubt that he had many more rifles...

Out of general interest, will you be producing in-house authentic copies of the Rigby-Bissell rising bite action?

Searcy&Co. make a close copy, but it does fall short in some areas.

Nice!

His tactical mustache is over the top!

It would have been a sight to see the little guy firing the .450,
He probably weighs just a little north of what that rifle would with a spare set of barrels....

The fences are absolutely spectacular on the 450

Trax, we are capable of producing newly manufactured authentic Rigby Rising Bite firearms. We have a complete set of technical drawings from the Maharana's 450.

The Rising Bite design debuted as a black powder shotgun action and while it is certainly one of the most beautiful designs ever created, it really isn't the strongest action.

The screw grip and doll's head treble bite are much, much more suited for rifle calibers.

That being said, if someone were to order a Rigby Rising Bite shotgun, well then, we would be honored to build it to the same exacting quality and design of the above firearm.

Zephyr, how about this example of a mid 20's Doll's Head?

Mr Porter,

Please keep the stories and photos coming!

Great stuff!!! Thanks for sharing.

quote:

Originally posted by John Rigby & Co.:
...

The Rising Bite design debuted as a black powder shotgun action and while it is certainly one of the most beautiful designs ever created, it really isn't the strongest action.

The screw grip and doll's head treble bite are much, much more suited for rifle calibers.
...

I ahve a question - we lots of dolls heads, greener cross bolts, "sccrew grip" etc in box locks.

How come these features are non-existent in the higher grade sidelocks? (the occasional rising bite execpted)

Is there something bout sidelocks that makes them stronger?

At most I have heard of a H&H or purdey "hidden" third bite but I have yet to see photos or drawing of how such a thing works.

The best photo I've seen just shows a metal 'bump' between the ejctors fo a H&H double.

TwoZero, my best guess is that as Africa became more accessible via trade routes, it opened up safari hunting to people which before then would not have been able to go and therefore the market called for less than best grade rifles...

Coinciding with that trend was the advancement of stronger action designs, meaning ones that had some sort of third fastener or bite.

A boxlock is roughly half the cost of a sidelock and therefore there were more of them made.

The Doll's Head above is also a treble bite. For strength, it's hard to beat.

Here's a picture of a Doll's Head Screw Grip Action.

Kent

The two action / dolls head pictures you have posted.

I refer to the first one posted as the Screw Grip
and the second one posted as the PHV 1
which I think is how they are described in the Webley catalogue.


Is that how you differentiate them
or do you just call both "Screw Grip Actions" ?


Would be interested in your thoughts/

.

A lot of people refer to the Doll's Head Treble Bite as a screw grip. Personally, I don't think it's accurate, so I use what I consider "accurate" descriptions of each when referring to them. If it doesn't have a screw, how can you call it a Screw Grip?

Thank you.

.

Did I just resolve a bet or something? Just curious.

The Doll's Head Treble Bite pictured above is definitely not a screw grip.

Here is a picture that I found on the web of a screw grip.




If anybody has a picture of Rigby Best Grade Doll's Head Screw Grip, I'd like to see it...

quote:

Originally posted by John Rigby & Co.:
Did I just resolve a bet or something? Just curious.

No.


I thought the FIRST photo you posted was of a Webley Screw Grip,
hence my question. Did I not look close enough at the shape of the dolls head ?

I need to go and check my Webley catalogue but I always thought that The Spade shape
was the called the Screw Grip and the other "Club" shape the PHV 1. (Spade and Club as in pack of cards).


Ref the FIRST photo, How do you tell looking from above if it is a Webley Screw Grip ?


Re "If anybody has a picture of Rigby Best Grade Doll's Head Screw Grip, I'd like to see it..."
Don't know whether he is on here but their was a Rigby 470 Nitro Sidelock in Australia that was sold to a US guy that lives near Seattle (I think). I'll do some research.

Unfortunately the ledger of our action suppliers went missing sometime in the early 1990s.

I can't tell you anymore about that action other than that is not a screw grip.

I'm sure that either our historians or someone here could tell you more. I'll ask.

John Rigby & Co.
I've always enjoyed the Fluted Fences on the Grants even more so when they are complemented with a side lever.
Thanks for the pics

Kent

Firstly, I am only asking questions and trying to learn more here as you have IMHO identified a discrepancy over how various people (including myself) describe certain DR actions.


Re your third photo of "your" Screw Grip (your being used to differentiate which you describe as a screw grip and the action I do).

What does the Dolls Head look like on that action ?


Re the FIRST photo - with the SPADE shaped dolls head - I thought the inside of the action looks just like your THIRD photo, with the screw under the lever.


I can't find my Webley catalogue.

I clipped the screw grip photo from the internet for illustrative purposes. It was a solo photo.

The rifle that I posted the photo of the spade doll's head has no screw.

I'm no expert, I've got a lot to learn!

505G Won't be home till late Sun but I can take a few pics of my Gibbs 450NE which is a Webley Screw Grip if It would help the cause..

The doll's head of the rifle in question is solid and angles forward a bit. It's really nice rifle. 11 lbs 10 oz and feel like it weighs 9 lbs.

I sent the photos to our historian to see if he can shed some more light on the action itself and maker.

Here's another picture I found that shows three different screw grip doll's head styles.

Kent

MY understanding is that the SPADE Shape dolls head that Intersects with the Toplever Spindle had a Screw as per your THIRD Photo and is described by Webley as a Screw Grip (with your SECOND photo being described as the PHV 1 action - WHICH MAY also be a Screw grip of a different type but need to check on that).


Anyway, we are all here to learn so we are all on the same page.

I don't have hidden agenda's so not ask for any
other motive than to learn


FYI, I have a Rigby Sidelock (RTB - rebored to 375 Fl Mag) and a Rigby Boxlock 450 NE DR (Webley). I love Rigby guns !!!

505G, no hidden agendas here either. It was just a joking comment...

Zephyr, I also like sidelevers...here's one on a Rigby.



Here's another nice one...from our book. Rigby, A Grand Tradition.

505G, unfortunately the line for action supplier for that action is blank, but all of the other actions around it are all Vickers...

We're doing some more research. Now I really want to know!

Can anybody post a photo / copy of the Webley catalogue page where they show and describe the two actions side by side ?

I'll try to get a copy by taking a photo once
I find them.

The gun in question was completed on October 26, 1927.

We made the same rifle in .275 No. 2 in 1937 for H.M King George VI.

Not to hijack the thread

My 16b Purdy

505G What is the Webley number on the bottom rib of your box lock? and do you know its completion date....Interested in finding a more accurate date for my Gibbs

Wow, I love that 450 rising bite, any pictures of the rest of his rifles? I don't care if his LOP is short, I could have my arm shortened I'm sure.

That 16b Purdy is gorgeous, so sleek.

I don't know if I understood, are sideplate actions stronger than box locks or is there another reason they're not made with the 3rd fastener? (I know VERY little about doubles other than if I won the lotto I'd have some)

Red

quote:

Originally posted by 505G:
Can anybody post a photo / copy of the Webley catalogue page where they show and describe the two actions side by side ?

I'll try to get a copy by taking a photo once
I find them.

http://rbsiii.com/nitro_expres...201914%20Catalog.pdf

The Webley PHV1 action has a third bite but it is simply a interrupted disc on the lever axis which intercepts a notch in the dolls head rib extension.
The Webley A&WC screwgrip has a third bite which actually tightens down upon the top of the rib extension thus a screw-grip.

quote:

The Rising Bite design debuted as a black powder shotgun action and while it is certainly one of the most beautiful designs ever created, it really isn't the strongest action.

I don't know if I would say that...
The rising bite rises at a slight rearward angle so even if it didn't have the double lump bites ala Purdey, it still could not be opened.
Rigby Bissels have been chambered in just about every big game cartridge even the higher pressure variants of the common rimmed cartridges like the 450NE, 303, or the Rigby 350No.2.
I would say its plenty strong!!

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:
The Webley PHV1 action has a third bite but it is simply a interrupted disc on the lever axis which intercepts a notch in the dolls head rib extension.
The Webley A&WC screwgrip has a third bite which actually tightens down upon the top of the rib extension thus a screw-grip.

Thank you.

I'll add more when I have had a look at the catalogue.

quote:

Originally posted by John Rigby & Co.:
A boxlock is roughly half the cost of a sidelock and therefore there were more of them made.

Mr.Porter,

Despite being noticably less costly, do you consider there to be such a thing as a true "best grade" boxlock?

Trax, it depends on which side of the fence you are on. If you're just talking about the best, highest attention to details among boxlocks, then sure. If you are trying to compare a "best grade boxlock" to a best grade sidelock, then no.

It's hard to say a High Grade Parker shotgun isn't a best grade. On the other hand, would you say it's a best grade firearm when compared to the Purdey above? Most people, I think, wouldn't include the Parker in the conversation at that point.

I am under the impression the the English term "Best Gun" applies that it has been made to the highest standards regardless of cost.
There has been made "B" Quality Guns which have been made to the same high standards but with less engraving and finish...
Can you have a "Best Gun" Box Lock there have been some spectacular box locks made
As 505G says we never stop learning