Does anyone here fire reloads in their HK91 (or clone), how about in a cetme?

Mssgn
Several years ago I did a test with reloads in my H&K 91. I took eleven different kinds of 308 cases, some military some civilian. I loaded them with the Sierra 165 HPBT [the Gameking] over 39.5 grains of IMR 3031. Every time I went to the range I would fire these 11 cases first, pick them up to keep them seperate from what ever else I was shooting that day.
I fired these cases a total of ten times without any problems. I have shot an H&K 91 quite a bit with reloads and have never had a problem.
They feed standard pointed lead tipped bullets just fine.
I used mostly the 165HPBT Sierra but also used the 165 Nosler Partition, or the 165 Nosler Ballistic Tip, all over 39.5 grains of IMR 3031, and the 150 Nosler Solid Base over 42 grains of IMR 3031. The 150 load hits the same place as most types of military ball in my 91.
I have taken several turkey, deer, and antelope with my 91. It is one of my favorite rifles.

Great! That is just the sort of info I was looking for.

My past practice has been to shoot milsurp ammo in my Cetme and Hk91 clone. The chamber is fluted and so once fired the brass fills those grooves in and the case necks are thus of uneven brass. I have reloaded these and fired them with no problems in my bolt action 308s.

In fact resizing the brass removes most of those marks so I don't consider one reload at all unsafe for using in the bolt actions.

But what I want to do is practice more with my semi autos. The trouble is that 308 mil surp ammo seems to be getting more and more expensive. So I was wondering if I might use some of my reloaded ammo.

I have about 500 rds of reloads that have not been fired through HK style chambers (thus they do not have any of the fluting). I'll give those a try.

Based on what you said I may be ok to load them up again for the HK rifles too

Thanks again!

Mssgn
You should not have any problems. As I stated I shot the same 11 cases in my 91 ten times each. I have never had ANY problems with reloads in a 91. Those 3031 loads are very accurate in all the different 308's I have shot them in.

Since were talking about the brass from a 91, I've heard that a port buffer helps to not dent the brass so badly. On my 91 I always have a big dent about half way down the case. Does this happen to your brass? Does any one know if a port buffer really stops this denting?

Joe45
I recommend a port buffer. Not only does it keep the brass from getting dented, with a buffer your brass is not thrown as far away.
It never affected reliability.

You should thow away that peice of junk, and buy a FAL

My frien has an FAL and I never seen a rifle jam so many times. In fact, his gun jammed more than all my guns put together and he bought it brand new. Had to send it back twice. The store he bought it from said it needed to be broken in. After about a thousand rounds the gun seems to be fine. His gun is fun to shoot and maybe he got a dud but that was enough to influence me to buy my 91.

I had an FAL and sold it years ago. Rather than buy another, I chose the HK style rifles. They point better for me and by all accounts serve equally as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Joe 45:
My frien has an FAL and I never seen a rifle jam so many times. In fact, his gun jammed more than all my guns put together and he bought it brand new. Had to send it back twice. The store he bought it from said it needed to be broken in. After about a thousand rounds the gun seems to be fine. His gun is fun to shoot and maybe he got a dud but that was enough to influence me to buy my 91.

Let me guess, it was a Century? They aren't new, they are pounded together from wornout parts buy some drunk Mexicans in a sweatshop run by Century

You nailed it! It is a Century. LOL. Anyway, I really enjoyed shooting the 308. His gun influenced me to buy a 308, just un-influenced me to buy an fal.Goes to show you cant jugde all FALs cause one bad apple

years ago, when i was smart enough to have an original hk-91, but too cheap to feed it jacketed bullets. i did a lot of experiments with cast bullets and learned some interesting things:

1) a lyman gas-checked, 200gr #311334 with 29.0gr of Rx7 functioned beautifully with the brass being thrown about 4' away @ two o'clock with a port buffer installed.

2) port buffers leave the brass without a big dent in the side.

3) the mild loads minimized the scoring by the fluted chamber.

4) the velocities were low enough (approx 1800fps) that i had no leading and iron-sighted accuracy was better than i could hold at 100 yds.

5) after tumbling the brass clean, i only need neck-size the brass instead of full-length sizing...the mild loads and the flutes (which minimize brass contact with the chamber) allowed me more than a dozen reloadings on each case with no need to full length size.

6) i was an idiot to sell the rifle

thnx for the info guys

The advice proved good. I have been shooting my reloads through my HK clones and Cetmes for quite awhile now and took a nice little white tail buck with my Cetme using 150 grain Sierras over IMR4350.

Thanks guys

quote:

Originally posted by MajorCaliber:
You should thow away that peice of junk, and buy a FAL

I owned 2 FN-FAL's, one was a Belgian Para-Fal.
The other was a Springfield Armoury SAR 48.
Both were excellent rifles, and shot good.
My favorite was the Para as I liked the folding stock and the shorter overall length.
Nothing wrong with a good FN-FAL. However I will do a couple of posts on why I like the H&K 91 better.

One of my good shooting buddies also has a Belgian Fal, the regular full sized rifle.

It shot good too.

However, one day we were shooting and here is wnat happened.
Both our guns were properly zeroed at 100 yards.
We both put on our bipods.
The zero on the H&K did not change.
The zero on the FN changed by several inches.
Then we left the bipods on the rifles but folded them up.
The zero on the H&K did not change. The zero on the FN changed again by several inches.
So the FN's zero would change to 3 different places depending on the bipod on/off, and up or down...
Also when we both fired a couple of 20 round magazines, his FN would have a shoft in zero as the rifle heated up.
The FN has a gas system attached to the barrel and the bipod is attched to the barrel.

The H&K has a totally free floating barrel. The fore end is not attached to the barrel, there is no gas system.

Scope mounts:
It is hard to get a good scope mount for the FN. The top cover mounts are too flimsy, the ones that squeeze the frame keep you form opening up the gun until they are temoved.

The H&K has it own claw mount, that snaps on and off and does not loose its zero. I have been using one since 1977.

On the H&K you can change the fore end just by pushing out one pin. So you can go from the wide forend to the skinney one in about 3 seconds.
Changind the fore end does not effect the zero.
You can also have a forend with lights attached, fore grip etc.
Now you can even get a fore end with all those Picatinny rails.

You can slos change the butt stock, just by pushing out 2 pins.
There are 3 different factory stocks that have some kind of adjustable cheek piece for scope use and 2 of them have length adjustments as well.

Also ther is the retractable butt stock, which I really like as it makes the rifle a lot shorter and handier for transport.
There are aftermarket stocks as well. Changing the butstock tales about 3 seconds, it does not change the zero of the rifle.

The barrels are hammer forged, of German steel, and have a long life.

I like the iron sights of the H&K better than the sights on the FN too.
Also you can remove one screw and mount a 1200 Meter sight from the H&K machine gun if you want.

Also the H&K 91/G3's are very reliable in the sand, in the jungle, and in very cold weather.

You can get factory magazines in 5 round, 10 round, 20 round, and there were some 30 roounders made [for the Nigerians, if IRC].

The H&K magazines are the best ever made. Their magazine lips are "doubled", the rest of the mag is typical German engineering.
They are avialable in aluminium or steel.

They are also very inexpensive.

Also the 4X Hendsolt scopes currently avialable for around $500 dollars, with the H&K claw mount are a must have, IMHO. They just clamp right on the rifle, go on and off and do not loose their zero.

I have just found, for me, I much, much prefer the H&K 91.

Mssgn
Well done.

I took a 91 to the deer lease this season and shot 2 wild pigs, a deer and a turkey.
All with 150 Nosler Solid Base bullets over 42gr of IMR 3031.

Nicely done!

dec of 2005, i posted on this subjec...

my no. 6 point: i was an idiot to sell the rifle. i recently found a nice cetme...another wrong righted!

i use the same loading technique, but 21 gr. of 2400 with a 170-200 gr. gc bullet is my load.

budman

ignorance is fixable...

You said its getting more expensive to shoot but should ALWAYS remember that it is your currency that is becoming worth less by governments inflation of it in many devious ways.(just to put you in a higher tax bracket)
Also you, us, and we are all competing amongst ourselves and the big gorilla ie..... governments who order up millions/ billions of rounds of ammo for military and LE use. If memorey serves me correct a gruop of pedifil gropers ordered about 45 million of the 40 short and weak last week
As to the Budman above there needs being a whole lot of fixin to overcome this ingnorance but some seem to be learning
,

I have a Century FAL that used to jam.

Then one day to took every magazine for the rifle I had, loaded 5 rounds in each, and fired them. If it jammed with a given mag, even once, I scrapped it.

It's never jammed since.

Its been many years sence I owned a HK91 I shot 150 gr hand loads in it no problem.

Even played with some cast bullets and some black powder loads.

Sold and HK and moved on.