Reading the post about a WW II Luger made me wonder.

Were the P08 Lugers used during that period or had they been replaced by the P38s?

Country Of Origin: Germany
Designation: Pistol
Cartridge: 9 mm Parabellum
Production Date: 1908-1945

In the pre-WWI period Lugers were produced by the German government arms factory in Erfurt as well as by Loewe's company, which was at that time named Deutsche Waffen- und Munitionsfabriken (DWM). The DWM monogram or Erfurt Crown logo can be found on the toggle of the pistols they manufactured (Usually. In the world of Luger markings there are always exceptions). The Luger was the standard German side arm throughout World War I. Luger production continued sporadically during the post-war period, in part due to restrictions on German arms manufacture imposed by the Treaty of Versailles. The allies permitted official production to begin in 1925 at Simson and company. Simson, however, was owned by Jews, and the company was liquidated when the Nazis came into power. The Luger manufacturing machinery was purchased by Krieghoff. Mauser purchased DWM's Luger manufacturing machinery in 1929, and produced Lugers until the later part of World War II. The Luger was officially replaced for German military use in 1940 by the Walther P38 double-action 9mm Parabellum pistol, but certainly Lugers saw service throughout the war.

Switzerland replaced the Luger with more modern designs in the late 1940's, which ended the era of use of the Luger as a service pistol. Lugers continued to be used as police side arms in the German Democratic Republic, which refurbished a number of existing guns.

quote:

Were the P08 Lugers used during that period or had they been replaced by the P38s?

I have one of each, both dated 1943.

In WWII, the Luger was very much still in use. I believe the P-08's were still being made by contract suppliers to the fgerman armed forces until some time in 1942 (or later??), and a great number of German officers had their personally purchased P-08's that they had acquired prior to the adoption of the P-38.

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Originally posted by Bill Mc:
Reading the post about a WW II Luger made me wonder.

Were the P08 Lugers used during that period or had they been replaced by the P38s?

The Germans in WWII used everything they could lay hands on -period! The FN Browning Hi-Power was issued as the P35 - many are found with Waffenamt stamps on them - beginning with the Nazi occupation of Belgium; they produced the weapon throughout the war. The Polish Radom, etc. virtually anything from captured or aligned countries was used. A lot of the guns in place on the Atlantic wall were guns the Germans had captured as they overran much of Europe. ("Guns on the Atlantic Wall 1942-1945" (SC) Schmeelke/ Heinz)
I recently saw some footage on the History Channel with a German trooper firing an M1 Garand, an MP40 Schmeisser slung across his back. Course, if I had been issued a 98K and could hvae gotten my hands on an M1 I would have had one too!
I believe the Germans even manufactured some PpSH submachine guns as well as used ones captured from the Russians. From Wilipedia: "The captured PPSh was in particular a favorite weapon of the Germans. Due to the similar dimensions of the Soviet 7.62 x 25 mm and German 9 mm Para cartridges, the PPSh-41 was easily modified, with a 9 mm barrel and a magazine-well adapter to fire from a standard 32-round MP38/40 magazine. The Wehrmacht officially adopted the converted PPSh-41 as the MP41(r), unconverted PPSh-41s were designated MP717(r)."
I have never seen this documented but have been told some Nazi officers, including Goering, favored S&W revolvers and purchased them with their own funds. Wish I had one with documentation to prove it was once owned by goering or the likes of Goering. What a prize this would be!


Can anyone say any port in a storm?

quote:

Originally posted by tin can:

quote:

Were the P08 Lugers used during that period or had they been replaced by the P38s?

I have one of each, both dated 1943.

Care to tell us more about your 1943 dated P08, I have a bridge for sale in San Francisco. Wanna trade?
Unless it a genuine Krieghoff, please post a picture..

TrapperP,
no manufacturing of PPSh was done, only converting some to use 9mm.A lot of non converted PPSh were used on the russian front as well as SVTs.
Mauser was the last mass manufacturer, Krieghoff pistols found now in US have been most of the time assembled post war and were sold to US military. a genuine war period Krieghoff is seldom seen. Less than 3% of the P08 were made by this manufacturer including the WW1 rearsenaled pistols and the civilian production.
The P08 was used until 1945 and some were assembled from leftovers or parts used for maintenance until 1945 but Mauser made P38 starting December 1942 with BYF 42 serial letter a, 700 pieces finished, 19 000 pièces up to serial letter c have been assembled in January 1943.
No more mass manufacturing of P08 after 1942, only very small batches by Krieghoff for the Luftwaffe.

quote:

Originally posted by Edmond:
TrapperP,
no manufacturing of PPSh was done, only converting some to use 9mm.A lot of non converted PPSh were used on the russian front as well as SVTs.
Mauser was the last mass manufacturer, Krieghoff pistols found now in US have been most of the time assembled post war and were sold to US military. a genuine war period Krieghoff is seldom seen. Less than 3% of the P08 were made by this manufacturer including the WW1 rearsenaled pistols and the civilian production.
The P08 was used until 1945 and some were assembled from leftovers or parts used for maintenance until 1945 but Mauser made P38 starting December 1942 with BYF 42 serial letter a, 700 pieces finished, 19 000 pièces up to serial letter c have been assembled in January 1943.
No more mass manufacturing of P08 after 1942, only very small batches by Krieghoff for the Luftwaffe.

Interesting subject, one I have heard argued both ways. Some 'experts' state that the PPSh was indeed mfd by the Germans, others maintain no, only rebarreled to, as you state, take the 9X19 Luger round. I've seen a couple with waffenamps but they also had Russian markings as well so that certainly doesn't prove anything. I have often wondered if the conversion pieces had the same feed problems as the original 7.62X25 with the full drum magazines jamming. My only experiences with this piece was with ones firing the 7.62X25, I never fired one that had been converted. And BTW, some PPSh's were supposed to have been made in Iran after WWII.
There is a website dedicated to the PPSh, [URL=http://www.ppsh41.com/URL] with some very good articles and info on the conversions, etc. - especially good read on "The Wehrmacht PPSh 41" article by frank Iannamico. No, they do not answer the question of did they or did they not 'manufacture ' the PPSh but good article none the less.
Best regards,

Here's what perked up my interest.

In the fall of 1963, I bought a P38 for $48.00 mailed to the door from ?Interarmco? Alexandria VA. The Lugar went for $44.00. Maybe it was the reverse. A full page ad was on the back cover of Am. Rifleman or G&A from Klein's or Interarmco..

That same fall, I bought a sporterized SMLE .303 at Target for less than $30.00. Mausers were stacked up like cord wood at Target. All less than $30.

I remember the advertisement in the gun mags from Klein in Chicago for a Tasco scoped Carcano for $27.00. This was the absolute cheapest rifle/scope combo available---I will attest to that as I was shopping for my first deer hunt with my high school pals that year.

JFK was shot by Oswald a week after the Minnesota deer opener. The gun world changed.

Re: conspiracy theories: I found it hard to believe that Oswald, was in cahoots with anyone who would have given him the cheapest weapon/scope combo available.

Brooks

My father in law captured and brought back 2 pistols in WWII. One was a luger the other was a peculiar revolver looks to be 30 cal bore could be Duth manuf. He was in Holland at the time fighting with the Canadian Scottish Regiment (Princess Marys). He carried a Sten mostly.