I have a pre-ban Mini-14 which I enjoy shooting, have had very little problem with it but I bought it second hand and it had a flash suppresser on it that hid some siginificant damage to the end of the barrel and the crown is a mess. I have several original Ruger 30 rd magazines for it, a trijicon ReflexII site (excellent) a Choate side folder etc.

I really like this gun with the exception that it obviously won't group well. This is primarily due to the FUBAR'd barrel along with the fact that the standard barrel is too thin (ie not an HBAR)and is very sensitive to overheating. Other than the stock and optics the gun is stock, no bedding, none of the variety of barrel stabilizers etc).

My love of my M1A makes me also enjoy it's 'little brother' but I am at a crossroad. I am considering having some custom work to the MINI to help stabilize / accurize it during rapid fire (I compete in Action Rifle events at my local range).

With that as a back drop my question is really one of opinions and ideally empirical experience.

Should I spend some money on my MINI (sentimental value is a factor) or should I just have the existing barrel re-crowned and go with a AR-180 or M-96?

I am acutely aware of the 'reputation' the Mini-14 has but I personally like this rifle and would like to keep this discussion strictly between the potential for tweaking the MINI or going with an AR-180 / M-96. (I really don't want an AR-15).

If anyone can share their knowledge and/or experience of these systems it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in Advance,
XWind

[ 05-09-2003, 23:16: Message edited by: XWind ]

XWind, I doubt if the AR180 will give you enough, if any, increase in accuracy to make the change over worthwhile. I know a properly set up AR-15 will be more accurate than most shooters, However you do not want one of those...So I would check around and find a first rate company that can "accurize" you Mini-14. Check with Clark Custom Guns in LA. They are good people and have experience with the Mini-14.

N E 450 No2, thanks for the feedback and I will look into Clark's Custom shop. what makes you say that there would be little, if any, accuracy improvement with the 180? I am not at all questioning your opinion, just simply looking for some details.

If you, or anyone, could elaborate on their experience with the AR-180 or M-96 I would be grateful.

There's another version of the M-96, I think, that is in 7.62x39. If they had a .308W version I would be even more interested. Given the two other choices I would stick with the .223.

This may be a dead end as there may not be many folks experienced with these rifles but I wanted to give it a shot to see what I could learn.

Thanks in advance...

Cheers,
XWind

I have an old Sterling Eng. AR180 and it shoots very well. Ask around on www.AR15.com and see what they can tell you.

Xwind,I really think you're denying yourself by overlooking the h-bar,if you don't like black,you could paint it a different color.I had a couple of mini's before I graduated to the ar's,the difference in accuracy and ease of care is night and day.The only way I'd get another mini is if you paid me to,then it would just sit in the vault,never to see the light of day again.[very cruel,,but the truth]Kind of sounds like you really want a bolt gun,,sell the mini,and pick out a cz,or a 700 that suits your fancy.Good luck,Clay.

Doh!,,I was thinking of a mauser 96,,,sorry,Clay

XWIND
Have you thought about a M1-A "Bush Gun" the one with an 18"bbl, or their "scout" rifle version. It is amazing how much handier a M1-A is with the plastic stock and an 18" bbl. I shot the "scout" [I think they call it the "Squad rifle" or something like that now, it is the one with the red dot sight mounted on the bbl] at 600 yards one day [High Power Rifle range]. It would stay in the center zone of the man sillhoute target I think they call the TQ16. This was with ball ammo.
For those who want more power than a 223 or a 7.62x39, but in a compact package check this one out.

i've said many, many times before..

Ruger would have an EXCELLENT product if they made the MINI 14 more accurate.

There are a number of Mini 14 accurizing companies, but I am not convinced they are worth the trouble.

However, there is a couple of new comapanies offering accurizing services,

As far as I can tell, one co. rebarrels witha HBAR, one offers a 'stabilizer' and the newest offers something else...DO a internet searxh and yo might find it.

I have to wonder, though...my M1 Garand will do 1.5" all day, and it is 50 years old and has seen combat. Why the hell can't a new gun do that?

Many thanks for the replies. The M1A bush gun is a great rifle but since I already have a M1A another one just won't satisfy my 'need' for a different style firearm.

I also agree that it's disappointing that somehow Ruger took a Garand type action in a small lightweight package but can't the accuracy even close to acceptable limits.

I'm still doing some homework on the 180/M96. I'am interested in this rifle for a variety of reasons and will continue to research it.

I've all but decided to keep my mini-14 with plans in the future to try and find someone that can tweak it for me.

Again, thanks for the ideas and taking the time to respond. I would still appreciate hearing from someone that has some trigger time on the 180/M96.

Cheers,
XWind

I know Alex Robinson persoally, his M 96 is very close to what a combat rifle should be. We usually have a couple of his guns at the store. They shoot very,very well. As stuff like this goes I look at the M96, AR 180 B, and the Vepr/Galil as huge improvemnets over the AR 15 system. I would buy an M96 cabine in .223 with the long scope rail, you will be very happy.

Aleko

mini's have a bad rap. there are cheap fixes that you can do to make them shooters. if its a wooden stock try the houge overmolded stock. a muzzle brake or a flash hider will help that skinny barrel to dampen vibrations and will improve groups, since you allready have one, i'd suggest getting your barrel re-crowned to fix the damage. my mini-14 is a standard model, out of the box it would shoot a 50 yard 6 inch group, absolutely terrible, i lapped the gas block assembly and torqued it down evenly, added a houge synthetic stock and a flash hider, and i filed the bumps off the bottom side of the hand guard to remove any stress from it against the barrel, the ruger handguard has these bumps on the bottom edge of it and it was such a tight fit that these bumps had left deep impressions into the top edge of the stock where they touched it, i figured relieving this stress couldnt hurt. after doing all these things my rifle will now shoot a 3" 100 yard group with the factory peeps. i find that perfectly acceptable. my brother has a stainless/synthetic ranch rifle that out of the box gives him 1.5" groups at 100. these things WILL shoot, if they wont shoot out of the box they can be tweaked, i'd try some of these fixes before i'd invest hundreds of bucks at clarks or other places that does accuracy work on minis. another idea is check out www.perfectunion.com the guys on that site have alot of information on the mini-14 and have some good ideas and info.

You will spend more money trying to achieve acceptable accuracy with your mini 14 than what it would cost to buy a new rifle! I personally know of more than one person who has sent a mini to be "accurized" and, after spending more money than a nice AR would cost, they ended up with a mini 14 that still wouldn't shoot 1.5" groups! Most ARs will shoot substantially better than that right out of the box!

You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear!!!

Save the money, time and frustration......buy an accurate rifle and be done with it!

keep in mind a mini-14 isnt a bench rest rifle. that isnt what its intended to do. if you want MOA then use a bolt rifle or a high dollar AR. the tips i suggested in my post work. i have done it and know of others who have done it using these easy low cost methods. dont knock it till youve tried it.

Thanks again for the feedback, I am listening (keep it coming..please). I'm not looking for bench rest accuracy, or anything nearly that accurate ($$). Like I mentioned I enjoy competing in the action rifle events at my local range. I'd be happy with a consistent 2-2.5 moa performance level.

3 moa makes me wince a bit but I think that still may be adequate for the type of shooting I do with my mini and intend to do with it's replacement, or the mini if I decide to get it tweaked. Obviously I'll take all the accuracy I can get without throwing buckets of money at the rifle / gunsmith.

I've got a sub-moa M1A so that fulfills my need for long (and short) range accuracy and that's the rifle I compete in Service Rifle High Power with. Also, I really don't want to start hand loading .223. The .308 stuff keeps me busy enough.

I've started looking into some of the sites recommended and I just missed getting my hands on an AR-180 by two days at a nearby gun shop. The dealer said it had been in his shop for over a year and a half with only minimal interest expressed by his customers. Then two guys want one in the same week! Go figure...

Thanks,
XWind

a decent AR can be had for +/-$650.....sending a mini to someone who specializes in "accurizing" them will set you back an amount that will come very close to buying a new AR.......

maybe you are satisified with a 3 moa + rifle that costs well over $400.....if so, the mini is your kind of rifle........I can't see spending that much on an inaccurate "plinker".... will they shoot good enough to kill a coyote at 100 yards????? maybe, maybe not......depends on the luck of the draw.......buying a mini is a crapshoot......there are more 6 moa mini 14s than there are 1.5 moa mini 14s!!! Why handicap yourself with a rifle that won't shoot?

Here's a kicker for you.......I have owned a mini 14 for over 20 years! Mine shoots better than most but I wouldn't buy another one....

You asked for advice.....here is mine....don't spend any more money on the mini 14.......keep it as is, use the money to buy an accurate rifle and enjoy it.....

A wise man once said, "only accurate rifles are interesting"......

I had a mini 14 that shot 3-4 inch groups at best with a Leupold 3-9 scope using match ammo. All that, and it jammed a lot too.

I don't know how bad the crown is, but you can try to clean it up yourself by using valve grinding compound and an old mouse ball that you have peeled the rubber coating off of. The steel inner ball will give you close to an 11 degree crown, but if yours has been dropped and dented or deformed then it obviously won't work, just though I'd give you the option though.