Hello all!! I am looking for a good bear gun. I live and hunt in British Columbia, Canada. I run into alot of black bears and the odd grizz. I'm starting to see more and more grizz. I cant seem to settle on an all purpose gun. I've had a .444 Marlin, 45/70 Marlin Guide Gun, a .450 Marlin guide gun, a .375 H&H, a 30 06' and a 7mm mag. Curently I own a .270 WSM. With the exception of the .270WSM none of the above realy turned me on. I can only carry one gun at a time, what should it be??? I wish I could own many guns at once but funds are low so I am usually forced to sell or trade in order to get the next one. Most of my hunting is for Mule Deer and Black bear, in open and dence forest. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.

I would probably go with one of the 300mags.If you like the 270wsm you might consider the same rifle in 300wsm.

Your 270 wsm will be just fine.

Black bears are no tougher than the deer you will be hunting. If you find yourself in grizz country just make sure that you load up with tough bullets like Nosler's partition.


For what it is worth you could spend a hundred years in grizz country and never end up in a "shoot or be eaten" situation. It is only one bear in a hundred that could be a problem.


Oh ya ........speaking about that hundredth bear.......

A good friend of mine was charged by a 400+ pound mountain grizz while hunting sheep in northern BC last fall. Unlike most bear encounters this was not a bluff charge as she went down on all fours and came full out as soon as she saw my friend 200 yards away.
At 10 yards my bud decided she wasn't going to stop so he shouldered his rifle and shot.

The bear died while in full stride and in fact her sliding body came to rest right where my friend had been standing when he shot. The bullet had entered right at the neck/shoulder junction on the bear and killed her instantly by breaking the neck.


So what great nasty rifle/cartridge combination was he using? It was a custom Mauser in 7 x 57 loaded with 162 grain Hornady SSTs!

The point is what you are shooting is less important than if you can hit your target while under stress.

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Originally posted by Mountain_man:
Hello all!! I am looking for a good bear gun. I live and hunt in British Columbia, Canada. I run into alot of black bears and the odd grizz. I'm starting to see more and more grizz. I cant seem to settle on an all purpose gun. I've had a .444 Marlin, 45/70 Marlin Guide Gun, a .450 Marlin guide gun, a .375 H&H, a 30 06' and a 7mm mag. Curently I own a .270 WSM. With the exception of the .270WSM none of the above realy turned me on. I can only carry one gun at a time, what should it be??? I wish I could own many guns at once but funds are low so I am usually forced to sell or trade in order to get the next one. Most of my hunting is for Mule Deer and Black bear, in open and dence forest. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.

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If you could ever find 9.3x62, then you all set for both bears. But more realistacly I would go with .338Win Mag in old mauser action like pre-64 Winchester.
Make sure your rifle have magazine at least for 3 rounds, you may need extra pills.

Greetings

Is it for bear hunting or protection?

There are a lot of great choices for bear hunting. For bear protection my personal fave is my Marlin 45/70. Its a handy size and packs plenty of short range oomph.

At work we tend to prefer a defender with slugs. Even handier size.

Cheers,
Canuck

I live in bear country as well and I have used a 30/06 most of the time with no problems or fears. It works great on black bears,moose,elk,and deer. I myself got bored with the old 30/06 so I am having it rebarreled into a 338/06 which I think will be an even better all round gun for me. I have buddies that carry huge/heavy cannons while deer hunting becasue of the fear of grizzlies but in all honesty I think common sense and paying attention to your environment is your best defence. If you feel a bigger caliber is neccesary check out the 300WSM but unless you are actually going to hunt for grizzly I think your 270WSM is a great choice.

Jason

Ah, my home town, once a hotbed of gunnuts, hunters and shooters, but, now there are lots of "environmentalists" and anti-hunters plus every type of hippy known to mankind!

Seriously, this is good advice, I have a considerable amount of BIG BAD BEAR experience throughout B.C. and Alberta; I think that practical hunting /defense guns for HUGE FREAKIN' GRIZZ' country when HE CAME RIGHT AT ME-16 FEET TALL, start with the '06 and include the .338-06, the .35 Whelen, the 9.3x62, the .358 Norma and the .338 Win. I never feel undergunned with an .06-180 premium bullet in my hands and, as I get older and the hills get steeper and rifles heavier, I often wonder why I bother with all those other rifles.

The single largest Grizzly that I know of that was shot in the Kootenays was bumped off by the late Billy Clark in the Lardeau, many years ago. He told me about this, himself, a few years before he died and said that his rifle of choice at that time was a 6.5 Mannlicher. Of course, he knew what he was doing and put the bullet where it matters and that is what counts.

I often carried a BLR in .308 when working in Grizzly country as did a number of my colleagues in the Alberta Forest Service as well as the National Parks folks in Jasper and Banff. Maybe this is not ideal, but, packing my .375 when I was burdened down with a lot of other work-related equipment was just not fun, so, I quit using it.

If the 375 H&H doesn't turn you on than you may be asking a lot. That said I've grown to love about any caliber that starts with .338 for hunting bears. I carry a 338WinMag with 225gr X bullets and have used A-frames with great success. This spring I should have my new rifle in time for the early bear season and think it'll be the cat's meow in our New Brunswick forrest. It's a wildcat similer to the 338-06 only a tad slower. A lot of what makes the round work is what leaves the muzzle, not just the velocity or the name on the headstamp. Use good bullets!

I would be more concerned with being a capable rifleman then having the BIGGEST rifle on the block. However, if you feel that the .270WSM is inadequate (too small) for your needs then you will have to move up to a 300RUM or larger to make any noticiable gains over the 270WSM.

Thank you all for the good advice. I may have solved my problem. I just got an awsome deal from my local gunsmith. A custom .35 Whelen unfired built on a Mauser action. It has open sights and is parkerized. The barrel is a little shorter than I would like(20") but I did say I hunt in heavy bush most of the time. It should be handy. It does need a new stock but thats not a problem. Some guy had it built but never picked it up, his loss my gain. $400.00 Can. Thats about $100.00US or so it seems Best of all, I get to keep the 270wsm!!! Again, thanks for all the good help.

What caribou said.

It is interesting that kutenay brings up the Browning BLR 308.
A good friend of mine who has been guiding for years used a .338 Win. Mag.(He still uses it for his personal hunting.) For guiding, his backup for clients is a .308 BLR. He loves it. He had to shoot a big grizzly at close range. He said it nocked the bear right over backwards.

That being said, I use my .338 WM or my 45-70 GG.


Daryl

Daryl,

Can you please check your pm, email, and post on the B78 in classifieds. Thanks

Jim

Seems you are attracted to the WSM series.
The 325WSM ballistics wise seems to be a real power house and cover you from deer to bear to moose.
I be hesistant though to rely on the WSM series for a bear rifle. Not because of lack of power, But more because of lack of reliability.
The WSM series still has occasional to frequent feeding problems. Two gunsmiths in town get them regularly with the order to fix the feeding problem. Not much they can do. It seems the cartridge design, too fat, too short, too sharp shouldered that causes the problem.
The Mfg's need to do some more tuning of actions to the catridge design. In a hunting rifle reliable feeding is an absolute priority.
Most of the time is not good enough to me. Specially a bear rifle.
Why not consider the .300 Win. or the .338 Win.both well proven cartridges more then adequate for your needs. Too bad the 30-06 does not appeal to you. It is a dandy for what you want it for. Good luck.

I dont know what to say boys.Owning a 45/70,458 lott,and 300 weatherby,I decided to put up a piece of 3/4 "boiler plate at 70 yds and let sliver. 45/70 350 gr just polished it.458 made a big dimple and bent it 1/8" or so.300 weath 180 grain speer sp.Through like a hot knife in butter.Now keep in mind these are all my own loads,and I cant even say reloads,cause in the case of the weath,the orig weath ballistics said 180 does 3450.Guess what?The hell with the pressure,mine does 3450.The same with the others.I'm a firm beliver that when I shoot at an animal everybody falls down.The one who can stand again is the winner.PS Canuck,check your hotmail.Thanks

PS,if you do go 45 stay away from 300 grs. The manufacturers wont tell ya but their all meant to expand at trap door velocities.Their jackets are about 1/2 thickness of pistol bullets.And of them sierras the worst.They should call them copper plated

"I think that practical hunting /defense guns for HUGE FREAKIN' GRIZZ' country when HE CAME RIGHT AT ME-16 FEET TALL, start with the '06 and include the .338-06, the .35 Whelen, the 9.3x62, the .358 Norma and the .338 Win."

Kutenay and co. - sound advice, and I think that you could add the .358 Win to that combination, particularly because it would fit in the BLR.

"soumd"??????

Where's the edit function when you really need it?

John,

Your typo's sorted but so you know, you edit using that "little pencil eraser" icon in the bottom right of your screen...If you don't see it, let us know and Don should be able to fix it for you..

Regards,

Pete

Pete,
Now I see it - thanks. And as long as we're on the subject of icons, what the heck does the little yellow quarter moon or teardrop icon mean that's on the left column of all of the subject listings next to the light bulb?

I know nothing of the big brown bears, having only hunted black bears in the east. It didn't take me too long to realize I should take my 12ga. and rifled slugs, and leave the rifle home. However, I honestly do not know if this would be good medicine on a grizzly since they're quite a bit larger. What do you think? Would the 12ga slug do the job? Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

I do not like slugs for defense against aggressive bears, especially Grizzlies as the common Foster style lacks the crucial penetration on large, solidly built animals. The Brennekes will penetrate, but, the recoil in a light slug gun is much like that of a .375H&H and the pump guns are not as reliable as a crf bolt or lever action. So, the difficulty in handling and inferior performance make slugs a poor choice, in my experience.

If, you live/work/recreate in an area where Grizzly problems are a definite possiblity, as I have done all of my life, then using a rifle that is actually suited for STOPPING these bears for ALL of your hunting is a very wise idea, IMHO. In the 49 yrs. since my first encounter with a Grizzly, age 10, at Hall Creek near Nelson, B.C. I have NEVER been afraid to go solo in their habitat because I make sure that my rifle is adequate for the task and my previous suggestions will do the job, period.

For me it would depend on the time of year as well as what type of terrain that I'm in. I gave up on my Rem 870 with a 18.5" barrel, 7 round extended mag tube 12 gauge due to the lack of availability of slugs that I feel are sufficient for big bears. I would have either my Marlin 1895GS 45-70, s/s Rem 700 300 RUM or my s/s Rem 700 375RUM with me all loaded with top loads with appropriate bullets.

Yup!

My personal favorite is a Remington Pump in 30-06 with 200 gr TSX's.
It's light, it's fast and it's reliable.
The penetration is nothing short of awesome.
It really slam's 'em!

Also 10 round mags are legal in Canada for the Rem 7600 rifle.

Moki
...where did you hear that? Why would that be?

The only capacity regulations in Canada are on semi-auto center fire rifles & shotguns which is a maximum capacity of 5 in the magazine. Handguns are a maximum of 10 in the magazine.
There are no maximum capacity regulations for bolt, lever or pump actions. You are only limited by the capacity of the gun or after market mags. that are available.

Sooo I can build myself a 20 round mag for my mod 700 varmint gun and its legal?

You can have a thousand round mag for any manual repeater if youchoose!

Hey open to any guests to come up for hunting ??

I would try an improved .375 HH, such as ackley improved, JRS, .375 Weatherby .Any one of those is a simple chamber reaming. You can still shoot HH whenever you want.You should be able to shoot a 270 gr Barnes triple shock(high BC) at 2900 fps+. Same trajectory as 338 shooting 225 gr. or 3006 shooting 165gr.You can't go wrong from muzzle to 450 yd. on any beast you might encounter.

On the same vein, what would you suggest for two out of the following three;
375 H&H with 260 NP
8mm Mag with 220 Hornady
444 Marlin with 300gr cast
All loaded to near max. We will be in aggressive Grizzly country. Thanks-Karl

All 3 will do the job for you very well. Myself I would have the 375 H&H for longer shots and the 444 for around camp.

My guns that I would take are 375 RUM 260gr Accubond 3020fps or 300gr NP 2750fps and my Marlin 1895GS 45-70 with 400gr Speer @ 1950fps or 550gr Crater hard cast @ 1600fps.

Thanks for the info, just thought I'd let you know it would be for defense only not hunting. Thnaks again -Karl

What would you guys suggest for defense only in aggressive bear country during spawning season. I have a .444 loaded to the max with both Speer jacketed bullets and also with Beartooth Cast bullets. Both are 300 grain. T%hanks-Karl

The 444 is a pretty good choice for bear defense. I think I'd probably go with the cast bullets, but either would be fine.

Cheers,
Canuck

Fellow Canuck-Out of curiosity why suggest the cast, I am just curious as I have never used cast before. Thanks Karl