Does anyone have any recommendation for a gunsmith to produce a custom rifle in 375H&H here in Alberta/Canada?

Thanks.

Wood,
I know it is in BC but you might want to look into Rocky Mountian Rifles, in Corlane's, Dawson Creek. I have heard that they do good work, and from the web site it seems as though the price is reasonable.
All the best with finding a smith.
Graham

The finest gunmaking I have seen in Canada come from Ralf Martini in Cranbrook, BC. He can build about anything you want in a .375H&H and his work is very fine.

What exactly do you have in mind, I know of quite a few .375s out there and some might be for sale.

The main stumbling block is I would prefer a Left Hand action/rifle.

If I was getting real picky, I'd want an African style. Wood/Blue barrel, barrel band, etc...Mainly the classic African rifle, just in left hand.

You will not get that from Corelane or any of the other "gunsmiths" in Canada who build synthetic stocked rifles from parts.

Ralf can do that to a VERY high standard as his site shows and there are a couple of others in Canada who are, supposedly, very good as well. However, nothing I have seen in my 45 years of buying guns in Canada equals his work.

Google "martiniandhagn" and see for yourself.

I suggest a "Safari" model lefthanded Dakota action to build on as they are about the best deal out there in a half-decent action.

Thanks for the information. It is truly appreciated!

Woodford,

Rod or Greg at Rocky Mountain Rifle can build you the rifle you want. We have stock-makers here in the Peace that are among the finest you will encounter in North America. The 375 H & H is a classic calibre that is easy to ream. Give Rod a call at 250-782-2111 or visit their web site at http://rockymountainrifles.com/.

Really, that's odd as when I last spoke with them concerning quite an easy job on one of my rifles, they could not do what I wanted, whereas Martini regularly does such work.

Who exactly ARE these stock-makers you refer to, may I ask? I have been to Corelane's a number of times, was invited into their gumsmithing shop and have friends with rifles/work by them. My comments here are not a slur on them, but, I have never seen one rifle of the type Woodford wants built by them.

How would you compare the stockmakers you have to D'Arcy Echols, Maurice Ottmar, Duane Weibe, Jerry Fisher and even Chris Weber and Steve Markin's better work? I would LOVE to have access to a BC gunmaker of this caliber, but, so far, Martini is the ONLY one I have seen.

Martini and Hagn's work is top shelf if you are looking for a custom rifle with quality wood, blueing etc etc. Particularly the "africa safari rifle" look.



http://www.martiniandhagngunmakers.com/projects.htm

Unless I am mistaken, the last time RMR put out that kind of work was when Martini still worked there! They are great for synth/stainless mountain rifles though.

Cheers
Canuck

quote:

Originally posted by Woodford:
The main stumbling block is I would prefer a Left Hand action/rifle.

If I was getting real picky, I'd want an African style. Wood/Blue barrel, barrel band, etc...Mainly the classic African rifle, just in left hand.

I agree with Canuck and Dewey, Martini & Hagn are about as top notch as you can get.
You'll be getting members of the ACGG, to make a rifle of your dreams!

Ask around, as they're known in the States as well.

The stock work by Hagn is above or beyond ACGG.It is someting else.

I love Martini and Hagn's metal work, love their actions, and think they build really wonderful rifles.

I don't like their stock designs, as for my fat face they have too much drop in the comb, and are too round.

They are nice guys, and sell some really superior products, but I dissagree with Shootaway, there are other members of the Guild that are just as good at putting wood on a rifle. And their are plenty of non members like Dale Storey of Casper, Wyoming that are just as good.

When I posted my first reply, I didn't know what price bracket you were looking for. Sorry about that! I would give another recommendation for Martini as a gunsmith. Top shelf work. Hope that helps.
Graham

Martini and Hagn are among the best in the world, period. I am not sure if Weber and Markin are still around in Kelowna. Klaus Hiptaymeyer in Quebec is very good as well.

All are way out of my price range

Chris Weber went back to Germany to work several years ago and Steve Markin is still, I think, in Kelowna. He is from my hometown and went to school with my little brother; he can do some very nice work.

Klaus Hiptmayr lost his wife, Heidi quite some years ago and quit gunmaking; I understand that he has since died. A couple of guys I used to shoot with and hunt with a bit had rifles done by him, his work was not my "cup of tea".

I tend to agree with D99 concerning the stockwork and have five different projects for Ralf in the coming year. His work is fine, but, his styling is a little bit different from my preferences, the Dakota 76 Classic comes close to my ideal, each to his own in terms of styling.

I am going to have Ralf do a Brno 21 action, Krieger fwt. tube, Micky Edge Hunter Compact with Talley lever rings in .280R. I have all the parts now except the 3-pos. safety and will get this underway after the Christmas rush in Canpost settles down. He does a LOT of nice work and will customize my Browning FN-LE .458WM, install sights on my Dakota .338WM and upgrade a couple of my other rifles, including a 3-pos. safety on my ZG-47 in 9.3x62.

If, you have good/rare guns such as these, it is better to get Ralf to do the upgrades you want, instead of some of the "hammer mechanics" that call themselves "gunsmiths" here in BC.

As an example, I once had Joe Dlask surface grind three P-64 Mod. 70 actions for me and then took them to a very well-known "gunsmith" who was quite well thought of hereabouts. Her managed to CRACK one of the receivers just at the mortise for the extractor and then LIED about it.....I never got the $1000.00 I had invested in the action from him, either and despise the little prick to this day!

There was another, very well known here who put claw mounts on an pricey Euro combo gun for a friend of mine...couldn't even time the screw heads....and on and on and on......

Canada NEEDS an influx of good, young sporting gunmakers and fewer of these little nitwits who slaver over "black guns" and talk like junior wannabe "spec ops" types.........

quote:

Originally posted by D99:
I love Martini and Hagn's metal work, love their actions, and think they build really wonderful rifles.

I don't like their stock designs, as for my fat face they have too much drop in the comb, and are too round.

They are nice guys, and sell some really superior products, but I dissagree with Shootaway, there are other members of the Guild that are just as good at putting wood on a rifle. And their are plenty of non members like Dale Storey of Casper, Wyoming that are just as good.

The Hagn stock is like the Mona Lisa or the Picasso. The Wayne greatzky of rifle stocks.

I agree, not everyone has the same facial features and build.

quote:

Originally posted by Dewey:
Chris Weber went back to Germany to work several years ago and Steve Markin is still, I think, in Kelowna. He is from my hometown and went to school with my little brother; he can do some very nice work.

Klaus Hiptmayr lost his wife, Heidi quite some years ago and quit gunmaking; I understand that he has since died. A couple of guys I used to shoot with and hunt with a bit had rifles done by him, his work was not my "cup of tea".

I tend to agree with D99 concerning the stockwork and have five different projects for Ralf in the coming year. His work is fine, but, his styling is a little bit different from my preferences, the Dakota 76 Classic comes close to my ideal, each to his own in terms of styling.

I am going to have Ralf do a Brno 21 action, Krieger fwt. tube, Micky Edge Hunter Compact with Talley lever rings in .280R. I have all the parts now except the 3-pos. safety and will get this underway after the Christmas rush in Canpost settles down. He does a LOT of nice work and will customize my Browning FN-LE .458WM, install sights on my Dakota .338WM and upgrade a couple of my other rifles, including a 3-pos. safety on my ZG-47 in 9.3x62.

If, you have good/rare guns such as these, it is better to get Ralf to do the upgrades you want, instead of some of the "hammer mechanics" that call themselves "gunsmiths" here in BC.

As an example, I once had Joe Dlask surface grind three P-64 Mod. 70 actions for me and then took them to a very well-known "gunsmith" who was quite well thought of hereabouts. Her managed to CRACK one of the receivers just at the mortise for the extractor and then LIED about it.....I never got the $1000.00 I had invested in the action from him, either and despise the little prick to this day!

There was another, very well known here who put claw mounts on an pricey Euro combo gun for a friend of mine...couldn't even time the screw heads....and on and on and on......

Canada NEEDS an influx of good, young sporting gunmakers and fewer of these little nitwits who slaver over "black guns" and talk like junior wannabe "spec ops" types.........

I retire from the US Navy in 5 years, my plan is to go to the gunshool in Ferlach. I had planned on Alaska, but if I can end up in the Yukon or northern BC that would be outstanding.

Another mention for Ralf Martini
he has done at least 10 rifles for me, all have have been great shooters, his work is top notch.

quote:

Originally posted by D99:

quote:

Originally posted by Dewey:
Chris Weber went back to Germany to work several years ago and Steve Markin is still, I think, in Kelowna. He is from my hometown and went to school with my little brother; he can do some very nice work.

Klaus Hiptmayr lost his wife, Heidi quite some years ago and quit gunmaking; I understand that he has since died. A couple of guys I used to shoot with and hunt with a bit had rifles done by him, his work was not my "cup of tea".

I tend to agree with D99 concerning the stockwork and have five different projects for Ralf in the coming year. His work is fine, but, his styling is a little bit different from my preferences, the Dakota 76 Classic comes close to my ideal, each to his own in terms of styling.

I am going to have Ralf do a Brno 21 action, Krieger fwt. tube, Micky Edge Hunter Compact with Talley lever rings in .280R. I have all the parts now except the 3-pos. safety and will get this underway after the Christmas rush in Canpost settles down. He does a LOT of nice work and will customize my Browning FN-LE .458WM, install sights on my Dakota .338WM and upgrade a couple of my other rifles, including a 3-pos. safety on my ZG-47 in 9.3x62.

If, you have good/rare guns such as these, it is better to get Ralf to do the upgrades you want, instead of some of the "hammer mechanics" that call themselves "gunsmiths" here in BC.

As an example, I once had Joe Dlask surface grind three P-64 Mod. 70 actions for me and then took them to a very well-known "gunsmith" who was quite well thought of hereabouts. Her managed to CRACK one of the receivers just at the mortise for the extractor and then LIED about it.....I never got the $1000.00 I had invested in the action from him, either and despise the little prick to this day!

There was another, very well known here who put claw mounts on an pricey Euro combo gun for a friend of mine...couldn't even time the screw heads....and on and on and on......

Canada NEEDS an influx of good, young sporting gunmakers and fewer of these little nitwits who slaver over "black guns" and talk like junior wannabe "spec ops" types.........

I retire from the US Navy in 5 years, my plan is to go to the gunshool in Ferlach. I had planned on Alaska, but if I can end up in the Yukon or northern BC that would be outstanding.

Where's Ferlach? Why do you want to go their?

If, you were to be accepted to the school at Ferlach, graduate and apprentice to a " Miesterbuschenmacher" and thus gain that exalted status for yourself, the Yukon or northern BC would be about the LAST places to go to successfully practice your craft. This is due to the nature of society in these regions and since both my wife and I have worked and lived up there and are descended from genuine pioneers of the North, I have actual experience to base my opinion on...as can be seen here, this is not the case with certain commentators on this issue.

IF and it is a BIG IF, you were to succeed as a custom gunmaker in Canada, you would need to be located close to the US border and near a major airport to ship your wares all over the globe as the custom gun market here is tiny....I mean guns of the M&H type, not re-barreled and spraycoated Rem. 700s.

So, if it were me, I would do my gunsmithing training at a major US facility, such as Colorado and go from there. Remember that Hagn was ALREADY world-renowned when he emigrated here and Ralf was pretty smalltime until he was asked by Hagn to join him. So, you really need to consider all aspects of the situation if interested in setting up shop here in BC or YT.

Dewey,

A little negative this evening?

Ferlach is free, excepting room and board. I have been told every time I talk to the Director (Max Winkler) that they have room for me when I retire.

I probably won't end up in Canada as I also have a future Mrs that doesn't want to get paid the peasant wages that Canadian Doctors get paid. That and I think your goverment will try and tax my military retirement.

I have been working on guns in a armorer (m700 spray painted black) way for 14 years. I have also been doing quite a bit of restocking and when I get back from my next deployment I have a Sauer 202 I am going to work on using the R93 stock I have for a pattern.

I also have been assembling knives for a few years, (I say assemble because I don't make the blades). Needless to say I know my way around a file, lathe, and belt sander.

Ferlach is a four year school, and you have to be an Euro to stay on in Ferlach, Suhl, or anywhere else over there and work in a factory. The best graduates would be the equivilant of journeymen and able to work for someone like Heym or Chapuis. Some will need more time in an apprenticeship if they can get one, and some will get out and be masters within 2 or 3 years.

The Americans, Canadians, Aussies, Kiwis, South Africans and so on end up back home either working for someone like Dakota or in the custom shops of their Nations production gun companies.

And Hagn and Martini also make spray painted M700s, I need Ferlach to teach me the break-open end of the gunmaking world not the spray paint bullshit that the School of Trades in Denver will.

I have no interest in repairing 1911s, or fixing Stevens crackshots.

A friend of mine is the best gunmaker in Wyoming; Dale Story, and while he may not know how to build a single shot kiplauf he can stock one with the best of anyone in America. He told me I would get 10 years of apprenticeship knowledge at Ferlach, and that if he was 40 instead of 60 he would go back and go regardless of what he knew or thought he knew now.

As for location, it doesn't matter where you live. Building guns is a job based on hunting show contacts. If it wasn't for the SCI, FNAWS, Guild and IWA show David Miller, Peter Hofer and Johan Faunzoy wouldn't be building their $150,000 guns as they wouldn't have anyone to sell them to.

I have spent 9 of the 15 years I have been in the military overseas. I picked up Spanish and Italian like it was water, and have about 500 German words in my head, including about 300 German hunting and gun oriented words even though I have never spent more than 2 or 3 weeks in Germany at a time. Learning the language isn't going to be a problem.

It's a hell of a lot easier to go to School in Europe than your making it out to be. Just takes desire.

QUOTE]Where's Ferlach? Why do you want to go their?[/QUOTE]

Ferlach Austria, Suhl Germany, Liege Belgium, Bresca Italy, and Eibar Spain are their nations respective custom gun making towns, and in some cases they are the center of almost all gunmaking in a nation. As is the case in Belgium.

All of these little towns have four year gunmaking schools and most are open to international students. Most tuition is paid by the school and you pay room and board and travel.

The British/American tradition of apprentiships exhist in these nations, but nothing like at home. These schools have done a good job of taking 15-whatever year olds and giving them the training needed to get a job in one of the gun houses. In the case of some of the engravers they also train they usually end up finding jobs working for bigger companies on basic guns.

Dewey your the one saying Canada needed more good gunmakers in the first place.

quote:

Originally posted by D99:
QUOTE]Where's Ferlach? Why do you want to go their?

Ferlach Austria, Suhl Germany, Liege Belgium, Bresca Italy, and Eibar Spain are their nations respective custom gun making towns, and in some cases they are the center of almost all gunmaking in a nation. As is the case in Belgium.

All of these little towns have four year gunmaking schools and most are open to international students. Most tuition is paid by the school and you pay room and board and travel.

The British/American tradition of apprentiships exhist in these nations, but nothing like at home. These schools have done a good job of taking 15-whatever year olds and giving them the training needed to get a job in one of the gun houses. In the case of some of the engravers they also train they usually end up finding jobs working for bigger companies on basic guns.[/QUOTE] Thanks for the info. Good post!

Shootaway,

Ferlach HTL is the Austrian gunmaking school if I didn't make that clear before.

You totally misunderstood what I was attempting to tell you and it was an attempt to HELP you as immigration into Canada for a gunsmith is NOT easy and this is likely to become even more difficult in the near future. The shipping/importation of guns into Canada is much more difficult that many realize and you would absolutely be required to pay taxes here on any and all sources of income.

Johan Fanjoi is hardly known here, I was called by one of the highend gunshops here in Vancouver to identify and evaluate three pieces by him a few years ago; the owners, European immigrants, were not familiar with him and I seriously doubt that one gunnut in 100,000 here has ever heard of Peter Hofer or the Winklers, Borovnik or other such European masters.

Anyway, not to digress from the original thread and I am sure that you are very talented and capable; my intention was simply to point out that northern BC and the Yukon are not really the best choices as an area to set up a custom gunmaking enterprise.

So, negativity on my part had nothing to do with my post and while we CAN use more good gunsmiths, this is not likely to happen due to our immigration situation and the lack of support for it in the general public. That is what I was trying to impart.

I doubt one in gun nut in 100,000 know who David Miller, D'Arcy Echols, or Maurice Ottmar is(was) either.

The problem with written communication is it is often easy to miscommunicate the "tense" of the conversation.

Nothing against the boys up in Dawson, as I get along well with most of them & find them all to be very pleasant to deal with, but up @ Corlanes or RMR, they're work is/has really digressed in the last couple of years. They have done 4 different jobs for me, everything from a full rifle, to accurizing to simple things like trigger work & refinishing metal work, and in each case they botched it in one way or another.
Sure they have reasonable turn around time, but I think they may be gearing more towards the "urban weekender" instead of the serious gun nut.

As Dewey says "a spraypainted 700" maybe, but I would especially not get them to do work on anything CRF or a DGR.

Gunsmiths who rebarrel actions and adjust triggers and replace stocks are a dime a dozen in Canada and that is 95% of the work here, you don't need any special skills, just the ability to change parts and run a reamer in the back of a barrel and make a chamber and turn some threads on it, dosen't have to be really good or straight just as long as it goes bang the majority of customers wouldn't know the difference, they just want bragging rights so they can say they have a 'custom' rifle. If you want craftsmanship and somebody with actual talent and skill to make something from scratch and get it right then you are pretty much limited to those Dewey suggests or sending it out of the country.

I agree with Oscar 100%

But the shitty thing is, even things like trigger work & refinishing turned out bad!

It was "my bad" I guess, as I sent 3 Rifles all at once...........3 rifles returned with some sort of screw up.
I got all the referrals about them off the internet (excepting the couple fellas I called who had a whole gun screwed together), and it just goes to show that the same people that DONT know who the Echols, Millers etc are, obviously dont know good from bad work either!

I too would like to know of these "stock-makers here in the Peace that are among the finest you will encounter in North America".
Not even sure I have heard of any in the peace country, never mind more than one!

Woodford - It seems you never really got an answer to your question. You need to talk to David Henry at D Henry Gunmakers. He is down at Bentley and his # is 403 748 3030. His work is excellent and you won't be sorry. He is very busy and a one man shop so the only day he takes phone calls in on Wednesday.