A canmore woman running with 2 friends near the Silvertip golf resort yesterday was attacked and killed by a grizzly called bear 99. the bear
was removed from the area only the week before
ww.canoe.ca/NewsStand/CalgarySun/News/2005/06/06/1073371-sun.html

What really amazes me is that the bear was trapped then, apparently, relocated to an area just inside the Banff park east gate. This would be about 30 miles, tops, from where the bear was captured. A nice afternoon's stroll for the bear. I find it hard to believe the wildlife people would think this "relocation" would have any effect at all.
This sort of thing is bound to occur when people who are ignorant about wildlife behavior are in contact with said wildlife. Regards, Bill.

I used to work for Parks Canada and this type of stupidity abounds. Some of the more conservative Wardens, however, would make sure they relocated the real problem ones on one particular side of the park. They knew they would end up (permanently) face down in a dog dish before long.

Chuck

On a barely related subject;
I once had the park wardens bring a rifle into the shop which they had borrowed from Montana F&W. This rifle was a single shot and featured a 1 1/2" bore (or there abouts). It was rifled and used a charge of black powder to launch a plastic bottle of water (about 4 oz. as I recall). The bottle was scored around the shoulder to ensure that it would rupture on impact. The purpose was to shoot grizzlies which had started mooching around the Banff-Jasper highway to get them to become a little less anxious to hang around on the side of the road. According to the guy that brought the rifle in, the bear would fold right up when hit amidships with one of these bottles. He said it took only a couple treatments to get the bear to start running as soon as a car slowed down.
I believe the rifle was built by John Buhmiller. The black powder charge and bottle were loaded into a machined cartridge. I would love to have that rifle to shoot my neighbors cows when they break my fence down. It would be very satisfying to see that bottle splat on a bovine forehead! Regards, Bill.

Hello;
Actually, the relocation was probably more like 7 or 8 miles. We had one show up near here a few years ago. He was a problem bear from Kananaskis that had been relocated to Red Earth, 400 miles north of here. It only took 2 months for him to find his way back. A local rancher lady, fearing for her children, ended his career.
Grizz

I read that story this morning as well. What saddens me is that they always put the down. They call them 'problem' bears, but there's never any 'problem' people around them. In most areas where there are quite a few grizzlys, there is plenty of open land. I'd really like to see more of these bears transported into the very deep woods.

MontMike, I think a reread is in order. You can't relocate a Grizzly if he doesn't want to be. And until you shoot yourself between the eye's your taking up space that could otherwise be occupied by wildlife. So unless you're up to it, I'd suggest hugging a tree elsewhere.

Chuck

Hello;
Part of the problem is that Canmore sits right in the middle of a Wildlife corridor and with development "frozen" in Banf, there is ever increasing pressure on the narrow valley, just outside of Banff National Park, mostly Nature lovers with esoteric interests and deep pockets. This is also the area, where a cougar killed a woman not so long ago. Then of course, which I suspect played a role here, there is the division of responsibility for Wildlife, inside and outside of the national park.
We can also judge the conduct of the victim. Was it, or was it not a good idea to climb a tree? Most mountain trees are very difficult to climb, especially if you are in a hurry. Her friends ran and survived. Another woman faced the same bear down at close range a week before and escaped without injury.
As for relocating bears, they seem to come with a built in GPS. If the bear liked it there or had a reason for being there, he will find his way back.
Grizz

quote:

there is plenty of open land. I'd really like to see more of these bears transported into the very deep woods.

MM, it doesn't work that way. Most, if not all, of the land that will support grizzlies already have a 'full' load. Any bear transplanted in is going to have to fight for a piece of the territory. Because the bear won't be familiar with the area the way the resident bears are, he's going to lose. In that kind of competition, the loser dies. It'd be far more humane to just shoot it.

Sounds reasonable, .......could the same theory be applied to the Liberals trying to get into the West?

~Arctic~

Bill,

That was defintely a treatise worth saving. Thanks for taking the time to type it for us.

My sister and brother in-law where hiking on that very trail the day before this tragedy happened.

If your mother/sister/wife etc. were attacked and killed by a bear, would you want it relocated to another area? Probably to attack and kill someone else later. I think not. I'm not a fan of bears. I respect them, and I love to observe them, with a few hundred yards between us. I've seen a few "a lttle closer" than that, and I assure you, when you see their humps flexing under their skin, you wish not so good things on them. They are an amazingly powerful animal. And everyone agrees not every bear is a bad bear. And EVERY bear has the potential to kill someone. But when a bear has done so, it proves itself capable of repeating it's behavior. It's a good notion to speculate that it has lost it's fear, or more appropiatly, common sense to stay away from people. That is where your problem comes in, and the best force of action is to put it down. Is it really worth risking your family to the chance? I do not go into the bush without a rifle. And I'll proudly proclaim that I'm not afraid of the Liberal tree huggers not to use it.

I'm a tree hugger, have been since age 12 and I'm 59 next Monday. I also have lived solo for months on end in both BC and AB wilderness areas and have had a lot of experience with Grizzlies. I applaud MontMike's concern for wildlife and agree, however, I honestly do not think that re-location works and I have seen this first hand while an employee of both the AB and BC gov't. resource management agencies.

The real problem here is that both Provinces spend money that should be going into environmental management on vote buying from immigrant groups, bullshit like the Olympics and welfare for drug dealing addicts. With the curse of non-traditional immigration inflating the population of western Canada, the available habitat for Grizzlies is shrinking, so, a dangerous bear cannot be moved anyhwere that will actually hold him/her.

Just as I believe in the rope for criminals, I consider it best to shoot any dangerous animal; BUT, I have more sympathy for the bear than I do for some Paki dope pusher. BTW, tree huggers are the good guys although hugging J-Lo might be o.k. too!

quote:

Originally posted by Chuck Nelson:
MontMike, I think a reread is in order. You can't relocate a Grizzly if he doesn't want to be. And until you shoot yourself between the eye's your taking up space that could otherwise be occupied by wildlife. So unless you're up to it, I'd suggest hugging a tree elsewhere.

Chuck

Well said Chuck.


Jordan

I understand that they've also had a hiker killed by a black bear on Grouse Mt. in Vancouver. That's actually the southern part of the Cascade range in that area, and it's loaded with wildlife, especially since the yuppies in North Vancouver have started leaving food out for the bears and cougars. I don't think black bears and mountain lions in you neighborhood is "cool" by any means. One February a few years back I was in Vancouver training some people in a new computer program. Since my classes were in the evening I decided to tour Grouse Mt., taking a cable car to the top, then wandering around the trails near the chalet. That is until I saw the bear tracks in the snow, then I beat a hasty retreat to the chalet and caught the next cable car back down to the lot. There was definitely one person killed on Grouse Mt. this Spring, possibly two. There's still a person missing. People, and the government as well, don't seem to realize what we're dealing with here. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

The one person killed on Grouse a few weeks ago was an eastern American from Wisconsin, described by his family as an "expert" outdoorsman. He, like so many of that sort, ignored what we try to tell visitors here and got lost, fell and died; his corpse was eventually found by a volunteer and bears had nothing to do with this situation.

The Black Bear situation in North Vancouver is not critical, it is largely a creation of the sensationalist media and it is being dealt with through public education. I hike over there, my hunting partner lives there and I just had a lad from over there doing yard work today; there are bears, but, tha actual danger is miniscule.

In any event, aggressive bears in B.C. are quickly shot, as they should be and most attacks here are due to human error. We have one of the two largest bear populations on the planet, but, we are not suffering from ravening Ursines tearing our homes apart to feed on our tender flesh, at least not quite yet.

The North Shore mountains, Grouse Mtn., for example are actually the southern end of the Coast Range, not the Cascades.

Apologies for sounding like a tree hugger, believe me that is far from reality. I'm only about an hour from yellowstone here in southern Montana. Every year there are people killed by some type of critter down there whether it be bison, bear or even moose. The problem is that the vast majority of people that are hurt is because of stupidity then the park rangers must kill the beast because it's a danger to people. I hunt everything including bear, but would rather shoot some Darwin Award candidates instead sometimes. Yes there are some problem bears that there really is no other option, but many times, stupidity kills more than the critters.

That's why canadians don't win marathons...too slow.

Notice you never read about Kenyans being eaten by bears.

Hello;
The thing about bears is that they show up in places where you least expect them.
My wife, who is an independant soul, and sometimes not too smart about these things, decided to go trail riding with a friend, on Bull Hill, about 20 miles west of Sundre, about a week ago thursday..
Shortly after leaving the trailer, they encountered the carcass of a partially buried deer. The bear was obviously not around, so they continued on down the trail, talking and wistling. A couple of miles further, her horse suddenly stopped and stared into a cut block. My wife figured it was an elk, judging by the color, but then the animal raised its head and the ladies found themselves face to face with a large grizzly, at fairly close distance. The bear fortuneatly departed hastily in one direction and the ladies in the other.
Grizz

My Dad was a Park Warden in Riding Mountain National Park for 35 years and also spent some time in Jasper. He retired in 1980. I was with him many times with problem bears. One time while he was hooking up the bear trap to the back of the truck, the bear reached through the bars and swatted him to the ground. Like being hit with a bat as Dad says. In any case,in those years anyway, every problem bear was taken out and shot. They tried relocating to begin with but it never worked. Dad had to tell the public that all the bear were let free. A freind of mine from Canmore was good freinds with that girl that was killed by the grizzly. That bear was under 200 lbs and climbed 50 feet up a tree to to get her. That was not the first time that bear had been moved. Some of the Wardens these days do not use a lot of common sense and this is where human error was at falt. That bear should have neen shot long before it hurt someone.



w

Talking about wardens with out common sense. We had one respond to bear complainant, The wrden got out of his trk and was going to talk with the person complaining when the bear come out of the woods and chased him back into the trk. Instead of shooting the bear he chased aways with his trk.

He went back to the persons house and gave her the old line about not attacting bears by leaving bird feeders and garbage about. Told the her would it not bother her anymore. As he had chase it away. Two days later the sheriff office gets a call from the same women that this time the bear had broken into the house.

The deputys knew what to do with the offending bear. They shot and killed it.

I rack this one up to a warden with a collage degree in wildlife management and evrio-law enforcement. But no common sense when it comes to dealing with real world wildlife.

Except what he was taught from tv and collage.

Any bear that chases a person should be shot sight.

One reads repeatedly of these tragic events were nature loving folks get injured .maimed and killed by animals.Bears in particular.
Because of our lopsided societal laws - drafted by folks that ment well but had little insight or experience,maurauding bears are protected and "relocated" -basically to wait for another crime.But it looks good on paper, in the eye of the "caring " game warden a "valuable " animal that was led astray by non caring people has been saved again.
No mention about the past and future human tragedy.
The law goes further in making the human who defends himself guilty - unless he can somehow wiggle out.
Pretty much akin to the fact that if you kill a burglar caught in the act within your own house,you are guilty of murder - unless you can prove that you were threatened for life.
People are in charge that (allegedly) mean well but really should not lead or judge.
So here my ownly solution to this existing fact:
As much as I hate "legal" recourse,use it against the folks that tie us up with the law:
Sus any and all warden and supervisor that "relocates" a "problem bear", sue him for murder,because he should have known that same or worse will happen again.
Make the folks that run our life accountable.
Only snafu: you cannot sue the government,they can sue us only but themselves ,they are sacro sanct.But in cases of proven murder by problem relocated bears, I think one has a chance to prove gross negligence.
Once these trials are publizized the wardens might think twicw before continuing their thoughtless acts.
Just a thought.