I have always carries my 1911 with the chamber loaded and the hammer down. How about you all. I have never had one AD on me, but I have wondered. I see some guys that carry with the hammer back and the thumb safty on. Does it matter? The reason I ask is that I just traded for a Para-Ordance .45 with a 4 inch barrel, the cropped hammer and a no pinch grip safty that makes it hard to thumb the hammer. I am thinking of replacing the grip safty or getting it cut down, and replacing the hammer tigh a linger spur. Comments?
Judge Sharpe

I started carrying a 1911 in 1968.

Condition 1, cocked and locked.

The grip safety is one of the safety features of the 1911 that makes it relatively safe to carry "cocked and locked". I would be wary of bypassing this safety. Having said that, I remember reading about, and seeing a video of Israelis who carried the 1911 with the hammer down on an empty chamber. It was quite fast for them to unholster the gun and rack the slide, chambering the round and cocking the hammer.
This might be a consideration.
Peter.

After my experiences at Gunsite back in 1980, I have carried my 1911 cocked and locked without worry or fear. My wife carries hers the same way in her purse. Neither of us have ever experienced a malfunction or AD with our guns carried in condition one.
I favor the idea all I have to do is pull my pistol, push the safety off and press the trigger. None of the worry about is it cocked, is it loaded, etc, etc. Having been shot once (actually 7 times in the same shooting) and taking a bullet thru my strong hand, I practice with both hands to eliminate a "weak side".
At times its hard to remember not everyone is comfortable seeing a 1911 cocked and locked and especially at most civilian ranges.
My time in the USMC from 53/63 and the mindset of that time has changed dramatically with respect to the pistols and current day training. 1911 is my favorite.

If you fumble your draw while trying to cock your hammer in a defense situation, the hammer may slip off your thumb and thereby hitting the primer on your live round that's chambered. Cocked & Locked with the one in the chamber is the safest way.

BTW, the Israeli's train with hammer down on empty chamber and chamber on the drawing motion because it's the easiest way to train their personnel. They're still stuck on point shooting within the normal hand gun shooting ranges.

JS, I think you need to take a course in defensive shooting with a 1911. You'll probably find out that you're basically unsafe with the hammer down on a chambered round and that the Condition 1(Cocked & Locked) is the fastest way to engage targets.

Cocked & locked is THE carry for the 1911. It was designed for this & should be carried that way. I wouldn't carry Cond. one w/ the grip safety pinned, then I might opt for empty chamber, but never hammer down on a loaded chamber. Too many things can go wrong, thumb slip, dropped pistol, etc.

An Experiment in TERROR.

Back in 1977, many of my friends expressed concerns about carrying the 1911 cocked and locked.

So I did a little experiment. I took a Browning High Power 9mm [no grip safety], and carried it as a "second gun".

I carried it with a loaded magazine, chamber empty, hammer cocked, SAFETY OFF.

I carried the gun stuck in my belt, no holster.

I would take it out of my belt and put it under the fold down center arm rest. When I got out of the car I would put my finger in the trigger guard and drag it across the seat to me.

I stuck it under the seat, carried it in a big coat pocket, etc.
I did this for several months, the hammer never fell.
The 1911 with the hammer back, safety on, especially with a working grip safety, seems perfectly safe for carry to me.

Thanks,
I have never had a problem with carring 1911 witht the hammer down, never had a AD or a slip on cocking the hammer. That was with my full sized pre-1955 1911s, and I have carried that way since the early 1960's when I started to carry a pistol on the farm. I have had some training in defensive firearm use. I was seeking other ideas, and I thank you for them. .
I was not considering pinning the grip safty, just replacing the extended beavertail with one a little shorter that would not interfere with thumbing the hammer, and replacing the hammer with a spur instead of the comander type it has now.

Judge Sharpe

I would stongly urge against carrying a 1911 with a round in the chamber and the hammer down. A fall on the hammer can cause a discharge (series 80 components help but don't eliminate this) The only two ways to safely care the pistol is cocked qwnd locked or empty chamber/hammer down.

John

over the belt style bianchi pancake holster, loaded round in chamber, cocked and locked....with the 3 safety features on the 1911's, grip safety, hammer safety and toggle safety, i've never had any problems....

Big Bore Hunter

Your point is well taken. I had a buddy one time that had his LW Commander in a pistol rug, round chambered hammer down. He waqs in his house the poistol rug tucked under his arm. It slipped out hitting the hard wood floor...

KABOOM

The gun fired. Luckly no one was hit, but could have been as the rounds path was up, struck the wall about chest high.

Any time I I have round in the chamber of a 1911 it is cocked and locked.

Cocked & Locked for me these past 35 years. Never a problem. Seems to me that John M. Browning knew what he was doing.

L.W.

Cocked and locked in Sparks or Kramer IWB. This applies to My Star BK, FireStar 40, Star PD, LLama MiniMax, Colt Commander and three different Colt 1911s along with a Browning HP. Muscle memory is the same for all of them. Draw, Point and Swipe the safety off if needed.

That thing has too many "levers" on it. I much prefer my PSP, because there is less chance of shootin yourself in the foot, or worse.

quote:

Originally posted by JudgeSharpe:
I have always carries (sic)my 1911 with the chamber loaded and the hammer down. How about you all.

In 1970, while serving the last 3 months of my Navy enlistment, the powers that be decided on making me a Naval Air Station gate guard instead of sending me back over to WestPac again. Everything from the chrome helmet to the white spats to the government model 1911 and holster were strictly GI. We carried empty chamber, hammer down and trained to rack the slide as the weapon was being drawn. I have no idea why condition 1 was not allowed. But then, I was so short time I didn't ask questions, about anything.

Cocked & locked for as long as I can remember, Series 70 and 80 Commanders, (one of which is on my hip as I write this), and my Browning Hi Power the same way. Who am I to question John Moses Browning's genius? I just shoot his pistols, and bet my life on them every day.

Hammer down on a loaded 1911 is STUPID!

A one-handed man who recently was viciously beaten and robbed by a local high school football star and a friend showed us his newly purchased Colt .380, no grip safety.

He was carrying it loaded, hammer down.
3 of us 1911ers took turns explaining to him why this was not wise.
40 minutes later he left, hammer down.

Anyone that compromises the designed safeties on a weapon deserves whatever happens to them.
I just hope he doesn't 'get what he deserves.'

Cocked & Locked the way it was DEGIGNED to be carried.

Either that or hammer down on an empty chamber.

But for the record neither of my holsters (One Bianchi one Cobra) allow the pistol to be carried with the hammer down, it must be cocked to apply the thumb strap.

as for "too many levers" the 1911 is likely the safest pistol
ever designed by anyone anywhere, but nothing protects the stupid from stupidity.

AD

As was mentioned above the Israeli's TRAIN to carry hammer down, empty chamber.
I've seen a few training videos and they don't seem to be giving up much time in putting the bullet on the target.
I've never seen a definitive reason for this practice.
One negative aspect is preventing the use of the weak arm to block an assailant while drawing your weapon.

Worldwide, the military train all their guys to go hammer down on an empty chamber to make it easier and safer to check the weapon during inspections. As to the Israeli method, their rationale is that with an empty chamber, their people wouldn't be shot if the weapon was taken from them. Overall, their handgun training methods are bordering ancient as they still point-shoot and are trained to empty their handguns during any incident. Oh well.

I am a Condition I person... Always have been. There have been enough documeneted Condition II discharges that anyone carrying a 1911 that way could be very well looked upon as "negligent" if their gun was dropped and the round hit someone... Even in Colt's old instruction manual it states no round should be under the hammer...

As to Condition III anyone carrying a 1911 or any semi-auto with an empty chamber should really start looking at changing to revolvers... Try shooting an IDPA match or a realistic scenario shoot starting off with an empty chamber.... Ever try and run and chamber a round at the same time... How about running while holding your kids hand and chambering a round... What about a carjacking scenario...try evasive driving, draw and chamber a round as someone is trying to run you off the road... Short rack the slide and you end up with a jammed gun..or no round at all when you think one got chambered. Those Isreali trainers make it sound and look oh so easy when they are standing on a range not getting shot at but it is a whole nother ball game when the SHTF.

I have run scenario shoots for the last 15 years...of the 6 or so students I have had come to classes using Condition III not a one ever carried that way again...

Bob Makowski

I CARRIED MY 1911 IN CONDITION ONE ,THE ONLY CORRECT FOR COMBAT READINESS.Juan

Cocked and Locked. No other way.

Cocked and locked

I went modern last year, Para-Ordnance P16 LDA.
The best meld of 1911 and DA out there, IMHO. I'm 6'2" and 245, and the weight and bulk do not bother me. The sixteen round capacity does not hurt my feelings either...just in case...

Rich
DRSS

I'm also a Gunsite graduate. No need to say anything more. I even carry my CZ75B in 40 S&W cocked and locked although I could carry it hammer down with a DA first shot.

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
I started carrying a 1911 in 1968.

Condition 1, cocked and locked.

I agree. There is no other way. You have three safeties. The thumb, the grip, and your mind.
That should be sufficient.

Condition I Cocked & locked in a blackhawk Sepra holster.

the one i carry on my person is cocked and locked the one i use for a truck gun and the one in my night stand are hammer down on an empy chamber. Im just to conserned that a grandkid or someone else snooping in my truck or my night stand drawer will fool with it. I would NEVER carry or store one hammer down on a loaded chamber.