I would greatly appreciate any recomendations for type & brand of pistol fore myself, wife and two college age daughtes if SHTF.

My thoughts where a 9 mm, I would like all the same pistol so magazines are interchangeable but soemthing easy for a smaller woman to shoot.

I am leaning toward semi-autos because of magazine capacity.

Any thoughts on which pistol would be greatly appreciated

Jim

9mm is a good choice. I would check out the CZ line or the EAA Witness line. Of course the Glock 17 is the standard by which most other pistols are judged, and I would think that used 9mm Glocks would be relatively inexpensive.
Peter.

As Peter said, You cant go wrong with the Glock 17. I have thousands of rounds through mine with no malfunctions.

Around 65% of all US Law Enforcement use Glocks.

There is no doubt in my mind that the best Combat handgun is a working 1911, in 45 ACP.

I have been shooting one since 1966.

Also, I have no doubt, that the easiest semiauto for a novice to learn to shoot, is Glock 17, in 9mm.

My last several years on thee Job I carried a couple of them every day, and I have shot, and seen shot several hundred thousand rounds through Glock 17's.

They were extremely reliable and plenty accurate enough.

However THE DAY I retired, I went back to the 1911, in 45 ACP.

Glock 19 or 17 or any of the other well made pistols out there.

Go to a couple of good gun stores handle a bunch of them. Decide what ones you like the best.

The 1911 is over a hundreds years old and there are just better designs out there lighter weight, more mag cap, better materials.

1911 well work is it the best ??. Millions of words have been written about this debate.

Right now I have a Ruger P90 in my holster why because I can. Other days a Glock 23 other days others.

Thats the nice thing about this country we have choices and lots of them.

Pick them enjoy them, sell them buy something it all works for me.

I greatly appreciate all the help

The basic M19 Glock is a 9mm. They have models in four barrel lengths, and standard, compact, and sub-compact magazine/gripframe sizes. Like standard, short, and shorter. Mags interchange.

65% of the PD's in the US carry Glocks. Next question...?

I'm not sure that what the police depts carry is much of a recommendation. I seem to remember all the PDs went Gaga over the 10mm before they discovered the average cop can't shoot worth a hoot, didn't like recoil and the dept did not want to spend the money for ammo and training.
Most PDs carried some sort of 38 spec long past the time when it was accepted that the 38 spec was fairly ineffectual.
Personally I would go with revolvers, less training.

Jim

The newer striker fired semiutos function in pretty much the same way that revolvers do. If concealment is not a factor then I think the OP's view is correct. Higher capacity. ease of use etc. Main thing I think would be whether all users can easily rack back the slide.
Peter.

Arky Pete & Peter you hit on a point that complicates the issue.

Once again the scenario is SHTF.

I personally love the 45 ACP; but for same of logistics, everyone has the same ammo, same gun, interchangeable magazines, magazine capacity I am looking at the 9 MM semi-auto.

As previously mentioned though a revolver is easier to shoot, and you do not have jams, stovepipes.... which takes training to clear. For a wife and two college age daughtes who the revolver seems like it would be a better solution. My wife already has a 357, so I thought about just by two more revolvers and keeping my 45 ACP myself.

SHort of buying everyone a revolver and a 9 mm auto is their an answer to the question Revolver or semi-auto?

Is this question like which cames first the chicken or the egg?

Any suggestions or other thoughts on the question

Eight posts and no one has asked if she (or they)can rack a slide. That is the first thing to find out. Any gun picked has to be able to be safely operated. If the operator can not drop the mag and lock the slid e back to empty the gun after a little practice it's not the right gun.

I agree that the same model is a godo idea. Any one of them can pick up any of the others gun and have the same controls.

High capacity can work against a small hand the same way that a 1911 does.

My thoughts on the matter are first, find out who can handle what. If you have two that like hi cap 9's or 1911's great but if shooter 3 is a wheel gunner then you have decissions to make.

9mm is a good caliber to look at, moderate power easy to find, light weight, low volume to carry. Several revolvers are made that can load 9mm, some with and some without moon clips. As far as semi's go, many Glocks use the same mag with different length barrels and weights.

Excuse me, Peter did mention slides in his second post.

I left out my thoughts on 4 inch .357's. Poor concealability, high reliability.

"SHort of buying everyone a revolver and a 9 mm auto is their an answer to the question Revolver or semi-auto?"

Depends on the situation. I think three women with 18 rounds plus speed loaders could be considered formidable. They're not going out on patrol.

You are right about women bing able to rack a side.

I was training a 65yoa woman and her new very small 380. She was haveing a hard time chambering a around. She had to use a push pull to get a round chambered and them it was hard for her.

I handed her my Glock 23 and she had no trouble because she could get a hand full of the slide instead of a couple of figers.

Small amd smaller guns are nice to carry but the are tougher to use and shoot.

Nothing wrong with a good revolver I carry one regularly.

quote:

Main thing I think would be whether all users can easily rack back the slide.

!!!!
I have never had a jam or failure to feed or stovepipe on any of my Glocks! While you can always have bad ammo, my thought is that the manufacturers have solved the reliability problems. certainly a useful exercise, but, as was mentioned above, the full size guns are easier to rack the slide.
Peter.

If you are asking a question rather than telling others your opinion, the answer is "revolvers." And that's for you. For the rest, it's "revolvers!!!" I'll leave it to others to explain this or deny it or make fun of it, but anyone who has any real experience with guns knows that it is is bad enough giving a gun of ANY kind to someone not accustomed to using them on a regular basis, but an autoloader?

Revolvers. Absolutely no question about it.

S&W and Ruger seem to be most of what is out there now. Probably a good used S&W is best, although there also still some Colts around. What's best is usually what fits the user's hand best, and that often requires aftermarket grips or adapters. If you want cartridge commonality, go for .38 Spl or maybe .357 Magnum.

recono, I have posted elsewhere about my recent purchase of a Ruger LCR in 38 Spl. It allow me to carry in situations where a semi auto would not be practical. However, the OP was about a SHTF scenario which I interpret to be not a normal concealed carry scenario, but rather one where an armed conflict would be likely. In that case I would most certainly have a high capacity semi auto.
Peter.

Peter,

Actually, I do not disagree with what you write. First off, I fully recognize that high capacity and quick mag changes are appropriate to consider for a widespread SHTF situation. However, if I understood correctly, the OP was asking a question about arming others. Based on my observation of the internet and of real-life shooters and observers, I said that if one is asking the question, the answer is "revolvers." You, on the other hand, are NOT asking the question. You presumably have sufficient experience to have formed your own opinion. Along with this experience comes your experience with autoloaders. For YOU an autoloader has a lot of advantages. For the person who is still asking for recommendations, I believe that the net advantage is with revolvers.

Peter, I acknowledged you posted about the ability to rack a slide.

If the SHTF it won't make it any easier to use a gun you can't handle in a low stress situation.

My wife and daughters can rack the slide of my Colt 45 but I am still uncertain whether to go with revolver or semi-auto.

Thank you for your insights.

Jim

Women often times have trouble racking the slide on autoloading pistols.

SHTF scenarios are not all out firefights, if you get into one, you've done something very wrong. Hence the survival handgun should be just as capable of defending your life as it is for taking game.

If you consider rugged reliability and ammo compatability, a ruger blackhawk with both 357 mag and 9mm cylinders would be an outstanding choice. You've got 38 sp loads for small game, can load up the 357 for big game, and have many self defense options in 357 mag and 9mm.

First let me commend you for arming your wife and daughters.

In my OPINION, many men have little experience to draw from when considering training others. Much has been written and debated on this subject, and will continue to be.

Recono makes a very viable recommendation. In my experience a revolver is the simple solution and is reliable in every respect. It won't jam even if limp wristed, it has no extra levers or buttons to confuse, and is accurate. My wife has a Ruger SP101 in .357 with a 2 1/4" BBL. She has great confidece that although it only holds five rounds, she probably won't need to reload. If she does, a speed loader takes only a few seconds.

As for the proverbial SHTF scenario.... I'm not sure exactly what you have in mind. Each persons perception of SHTF can be slightly different. Do you live in a city and SHTF to you is two legged varmin en mass trying to enter your home? Do you live in the country where you may be isolated for some time? Are you thinking of having to move your family through or out of the city toward a common property with other family?

A SHTF plan is important as much as how you arm yourself. Depending on what you think is likely, pistols may be a poor choice. Shotguns may be something to consider. Maybe AR15's, as they are incredibly common, can share mags and ammo, and are easy to operate and shoot well.

Whatever you decide, the training can be fun family time and as much beneficial as it is entertaining if done right.

I will agree with those posters that recommended a revolver, as they are a lot easier for the lessor trained to operate, and in most Civilian self defense situations you will be at conversational/touching distance, and a revolver is many times the best choice for this situation evern for the very well trained.

But the OP stated for a STF, Bad Days WROL SITUATION.

Here is the real deal. IF you want to be adequatelsy prepared for a Bad Days situation you BETTER have some PRETTY GOOD Training.

You need a rifle, a Good AR in 223 is great for the wife and kids, as well as a good semiauto.

Again IMHO a Glock in 9mm is hard to beat for the wife and kids.

But it is important to have some good training.

And some good working guns with lots of magazines and LOTS of ammo...

And of course all this Bad Days Prep is good for everyday survival as well.

To train and outfit yourself and your Family, will not be cheap.

It all comes down to HOW MUCH IS YOUR LIFE WORTH, TO YOU...

Are we talking the proverbial "zombie" thing here? Armed civilians drawn into combat? Or what is usually self defense?

Most self defense shootings involve very few rounds fired in total. I believe the average is currently running three, and thats by both parties. These confrontations are usually at very close range.

I can see the viability of Glocks in 9mm for the whole family as well as AR's with high cap magazines, IF you are trying to plan for combat. Along with training comes familiarity with equipment.

SHTF scenarios vary greatly depending on the area you have to survive in. (OP is in Cincinnati) In my neck of the woods I'd expect most everyone is already armed in some respect. Survival here is more based on food and exposure issues. Armed conflict brings down your chances of survival and if it can be avoided thats a good thing. Sometimes a show of force is enough to avoid escalation.

Whatever handgun she/they feel comfortable with and practice with on a regular basis. This decision should not be made by someone other than the shooter. I for one would rather they were proficient with any gun vs bungling with a gun I felt was the ultimate defense gun

My vote is for a bunch of GEN4 Glock 19's. Then go to Gunsite, or Front Site, or some other school and shoot them under the supervision of some good trainers for a week. They take pistol mounted flashlights easily, which can be useful at night.

I have carried, shot,used a lot of them like many others here. If I were going to fight multiable attackers with only a pistol.

A high cap 9 or 40 would be my choice most likely a glock 17 or 22.
It is nice to beable to put multible rounds on mutilable targets with out having to reload.

But I wouldn't feel too bad with a 1911,browning hi power, or any other good hand gun that went bang every time I pulled the trigger.

My wife and daughter who both are very good shots and have axcess to all kinds sizes of handguns.

Both carry 5 shot 2 inch revolvers loaded with plus P 125 gr 38spl rounds. Why because they are simple,and they work.

I am sure if the SHTF and every thing went to hell. They would be carring some type of med to full size semi auto. There a good change they would have there 2 inch revolvers some place too.

But for every day carry in todays world a nice 5 shot revolver 98 percent of the time well do the job very well.

I thank everyone for their advice. The amount of time my wife and daughters spend shooting is minimal so I have decided to go with revolvers based on the KISS principle.

THank you again,

Jim

Singleshot- good choise- in 30 years of carrying a handgun daily in 'a dangerous environment' convinced me that semi auto's took too much maintainence and enthusiasm to maintain. I used to shoot IPSC with an auto every weekend, but after a week of carry it needed a quick clean before each range session. My revolvers always just worked and that is what I switched to for both operations and home.

When I got married I bought the wife (a non shooter) a S&W M60 with a 3" barrel and CT laser grips. She is a fair shot with it considering she hits the range once every other year but the gun goes bang every time she hauls it out to try it.

I liked it so much I bought another M60 for me to replace my 329 for daily use. Wish I had bought a 360! With the CT grips it is nearly a perfect carry or home gun. Needs looking at once a year, easy enough to shoot with one hand or in the dark or...and is just intuative. My 7 year old (girl) manages my M60 just fine thank you...you wouldn't want to enter my home when I am away on a hunt and she is home alone for some reason...

Also a handgun is there as a firearm of last resort. If you can get to a shotgun why the heck would you use a handgun? If you have two free hands why are you not using a rifle or shotgun? A handgun is there for when you are caught unprepared (or at least at short notice) and cannot use two hands (like you need the other to open a door or hold a torch or drive or...)

Just never once had two hands on my revolver when I have fired a shot in haste. (Used two hands when handgun hunting and for competition but never in the dark!)

Unless they're prepared to practice regularly, I'd go with revolvers in .38spl/357mag as there are no potential problems with limp wristing, racking the slide, disengaging safeties, finding the mag release, etc.
Revolvers are the simplest point & shoot interface that can do the job.

Ganyana, I understand your point about the pistol being a firearm of last resort.

Would an Ar-15 be better than a shotgun as a primary weapon for woman for defense?

Jim

Starting a new post

Ar-15 or shotgun

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
The basic M19 Glock is a 9mm. They have models in four barrel lengths, and standard, compact, and sub-compact magazine/gripframe sizes. Like standard, short, and shorter. Mags interchange.

65% of the PD's in the US carry Glocks. Next question...?

Just curious. How many of those 65% have shot themselves in the foot when trying to draw? I am not a Glock fan and my bias shows, but I will admit they are well made, function well, and can be damn accurate. I just don't like the feel of them. My favorite 9mm is the CZ75.

And I really like my newest, a CZ2075 RAMI....


That said many women have trouble manipulating the slide on a semi....with that in mind I would go for a Ruger or Smith revolver in .357; stainless as it is easy to care for; and shoot .3 in same.

Going back to the Original Post.

He specified a SHTF situation.

No matter what kind of handgun you have unless you have somepretty good training you will not survive, IMHO. A very well trained person with a revolver might be OK.
But a well trained person with a semiauto and a LOT of extra magazines would be a LOT better off.

Bottom line is, IF you plan on surviving, you need to spent the time and money to prepare.

Not only for the End of the World as we Know It, but equally for the encounter with a regular Criminal or two...

IF you wife and or kids will not put forth the effort to train, then they are doomed, they are a liability, and when the SHTF and IF YOU want to survive, then you need to get shed of them, as they are just an albratoss around your neck.

quote:

IF you wife and or kids will not put forth the effort to train, then they are doomed, they are a liability, and when the SHTF and IF YOU want to survive, then you need to get shed of them, as they are just an albratoss around your neck.

HUH?!!!
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by billinthewild:
That said many women have trouble manipulating the slide on a semi....with that in mind I would go for a Ruger or Smith revolver in .357; stainless as it is easy to care for; and shoot .3 in same.

I do not agree. I'm a woman. I do not like revolvers. I like my hand too much. Semi-autos are easier to fire.
I like gun clinics. I go to as many as I can. Yesterday I went to a ladies only handgun clinic. 22 ladies attended. Most were novices. Some weren't. Not one had trouble working the slide after being taught how. And I don't think a single one of us liked revolvers.
I think more women would be interested in shooting if guys would quit telling us that its too hard for us to do, and quit acting like we're weak and stupid.
Yesterday, I saw novice women pick up a 1911 and fire several rounds into a paper target at 10 yards with amazing accuracy, because no guys were around to tell them that gun was too big for them.
Guys think they know what gun is better for a woman. But, the truth is that gender has nothing to do with it. We're all individuals. I started with a .380 because some guy told me I needed a smaller caliber since I was a woman. I was told a .45 was too big, so sure enough, it was. But, later I learned all that was BS. I can shoot a target with better accuracy with a 1911 than with my LC9. The Ruger LC9 fits my hand great, and its easy to conceal, but its trigger pull and reset is too long. I have a friend who has beautiful long piano fingers and that gun is too small for her. It's all individual. Depends on fit, features, and purpose.

Your right girl!!!

My wife has a favorite.....hers is a Glock 30 in 45 ACP and her other is a Walther PPQ in 40 S&W

I wouldn't want her shooting at me

All work, the key factor is can you all operate it safely and hit the target? I would find a local training course, all attend together, you will learn a lot and the ideal gun for you situation will soon emerge.

It might be a 32acp, many will mock it and it wouldn’t be my choice, but a hit with a 32acp tend to disable an assailant more than a miss with a 45acp. But eventually when you find a gun you can all use safely, and then plan your strategy, the gun is only one part of it.

Tell it like it is Sailor!

My wife shoots a Ruger SP101 really well, with full power loads. She doen't care for the 1911 or the Berretta 96. My son just got a S&W M&P in .45 so she'll try that one eventually I suppose.

How a pistol fits is key to shooting well, whether a man or woman. I like the way a Sig feels and don't like Glocks or the XD's much. My fav's are the 1911 and the Sig 220.

quote:

Originally posted by Singleshot03:
I would greatly appreciate any recomendations for type & brand of pistol fore myself, wife and two college age daughtes if SHTF.

My thoughts where a 9 mm, I would like all the same pistol so magazines are interchangeable but soemthing easy for a smaller woman to shoot.

I am leaning toward semi-autos because of magazine capacity.

Any thoughts on which pistol would be greatly appreciated

Jim

Are you looking for a weapon to carry concealed or one for general home protection?

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

quote:

IF you wife and or kids will not put forth the effort to train, then they are doomed, they are a liability, and when the SHTF and IF YOU want to survive, then you need to get shed of them, as they are just an albratoss around your neck.

HUH?!!!
Peter.

HUH?!!!

It is real simple Peter, in any kind of serious life threatining situation, having some, hopefully a bunch, of training and with it the proper mind set, and the proper equipment, is essential to, or at least goes a long way to ensure your survival.

Having well trained and well equipped people around you is a plus.
Having untrained, ill equiped people around you, is a liability, especially if you care for them, or because of "family or other" ties, you have had to "adopt" them durring the crisis.

My thoughts are if people do not want to spend the time, money, energy, to do some training/preperation for what ever disaster or dangerous situation might be fall them, then I will not "take them to raise" when the STF.

The OP did not ask what is the best handgun for his wife and kids to use for a daily CHL, if so I would recommed a S&W Revolver, as with some training they will work for most CHL encounters.
And most CHL people to not do a lot of training.

[Here is another tidbit, most Police are not trained NEAR well enough either.]

He asked about a STF, Survival, Bad Days situation.

Survival in that case, means good training, and High Volume firepower, with Quality Weapons.

IMHO of course...