With the purchase of my Sabatti 450NE I have been doing a lot more shooting with open sights. I have been quite happy with my 50yds and under work but am wondering how realistic the long range leafs will be with my older eyes.
Does anybody know roughly what range they might be regulated for or will it just be a matter of experimentation. Since I bought this to use for close range shooting I am wondering if there is any point in spending much time fooling with them other than just for fun.

I would like to be able to shoot it accurately enough to place a "finisher" out to 100yds or so.
Any thoughts?

As far as I am concerned none at all. My rifle has only one and is patterned at 55yds. I can hit targets out as far as 130yds. Have hit 3inch bull at 100yds. around 5 times and hit all from 5yds to 50yds. Know your rifle and make the shot.

Mike

My Chapuis only has one rear sight but I've shot it enough times to know how much to hold up to make a 286 yard shot on a moose. Searcy is limited to 1 leaf as well.

However, I still think if a person has the range time the 3 leaf sights make sense. There are times longer shots may be offered and if you are confident in your ability and have the time to choose the right sight blade it could be the difference between success and failure. If I ever get another big double it will have 3 leaf sights. Another point to consider is I like my rifles to hit about 1-2 inches high at 50 yards. Maybe using the middle leaf will give me that without messing with a file or changing front beads.
So, until then I can't prove one is better than the other but will be willing to spend the money to find out.

No.

The answer to your question, JCS271, is somplace between the three answers you've gotten so far. Which you take as gospel depends on how you want to use your rifle, and how well you work up a load that shoots to the regulation built into your rifle.

Will's answer of "NO!" is the exact one that suits his use of a double rifle! He hunts elephant, and only shoots them very close in, which is the way to shoot elephant, and the longest follow-up shot he will make is a hip shot on a fleeing ele likely at no more than 50 yds. The standing blade is perfect for him. Mike is also right, because if you know your rifle you can hit the vitals of a cape buffalo at 150 yds, but i don't know why anyone would shoot a unwounded cape at 150 yds.

However, the true answer to your question is "YES!" there is a use for the flip-ups on your rifle! That is, "IF" the rifle is shooting cartridges that are proper for the regulation built into your rifle by the maker. Some very expensive double rifles are fitted with multiple flip-ups, and they were not place there for looks. The flip-ups on high grade rifles will place a properly loaded round right on the sights at the range engraved on that particular flip-up. This is the case with the better made doubles, but not as sure thing on a cheap double rifle. Those could actually be there to impress the buyer. If they have not been cut the new owner can cut them once he finds the load that shoots to the regulation on the standing rear sight.

The multiples can be used for long range shooting on things like Eland and Kudu when time allows you to get a rest, or go to a sitting position with elbows rested on the knees. You see a double rifle is not designed to cross at any range, but shoot parallel individual barrel groups no matter the range. Of courseeach barrel's individual group will get wider the farther they go, so that shots from both sides will spill over into the groups of the opposite barrel. That however doesn't mean the centers of each barrel's individual group corsses at any range. This is why when you look at all the flip-ups the bottom of the "V" on all of them will line up!

Proper regulation loads are not as necessary for close in shooting as it is for down range shooting! I find that most double rifles I see at the shooting ranges are not shooting well regulating loads, and would not be very good at long range. This in no way means a double rifle can't be used for longer range shooting. They are not target rifles, but are as accurate as any hunting rifle from hunting positions, by a guy who knows his rifle! If that seems a little far fetched to you you should see Nitro 450 No2 (tony) shoot his double rifles! I watched him hit a coyote twice once with each barrel at a measured range of 278 yards with a Chapuis 9.3X74R double rifle.

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I have found that the leaves on my British Double rifles are spot on to 300 yards, that is as far as I have shot them.

I have raised up the 200 yard leaf in my 450/400 to shoot a caribou at @175 yards, and on my 450 No2 to shoot a giraffe at 188 yards.

Thanks for your observations. My range behind the house is an honest 200yds with a large dirt berm for a backstop. Looks like I will be doing some experimentation to see what I can do with my loads and the various leafs.
Just another great excuse to turn money into noise!

On my double I have the standing leaf at 50 yards and my only folding at 150 yards. They work fine but I really don't think I'll need the 150 yard sight anytime soon. As Retreever said, if on at 55 yards and prints in 3 inches at 100 then that should be good for buff or ele. On my bolt guns I do like a leaf for 200 (for my 375) but it is 1 1/2 to 2 inches low at that distance. Spot on at 100 with the standing 100 yard leaf.

I never have and most likely never will but let say I just shoot a big black thing with horns at 50yrs and it did not go down. Now it is at 80Yds and all I have is an Obama shot (a-hole). Am I going to have time to flip the other leaf up?

Come on guys, admit it. Most people want the three leaf sights on their rifles because they look cool
Same reason they go for barrel band sling swivels on bolt rifles.

+1

Hey Fat Albert, that is my thought exactly. If I take a close shot but then need a quick finisher at 75-150yds then I will probably just do it the old fashioned way of a little more daylight under the front sight and let it rip. Highly doubtful I would ever flip an extra leaf for elevation.

quote:

Originally posted by Fat_Albert:
I never have and most likely never will but let say I just shoot a big black thing with horns at 50yrs and it did not go down. Now it is at 80Yds and all I have is an Obama shot (a-hole). Am I going to have time to flip the other leaf up
?

quote:

by Snoewolfe
Come on guys, admit it. Most people want the three leaf sights on their rifles because they look cool
Same reason they go for barrel band sling swivels on bolt rifles.

quote:

By fla3006

+1

Looking neat may be your reason for these two things but it isn't for me, or the makers of these rifles!
You've all missed the whole point of the flip-ups on double rifles, and big bore iron sighted bolt rifles. First off they are too expensive, and require too much regulation to be simply adornment! That may well be the case on cheap rifle but not on serious rifles.

Their use has nothing to do with escaping animals on the run. The down range sights on a double rifle and larger bore bolt rifles, that are habitually used with iron sights only, are for use when you get a standing shot at a distance when you simply can't get closer. long range with nothing but hold-over with the short sight lets the muzzles hide your target, hince the higher flip-up. In this case you have time to use them for the purpose they are placed on the rifle.

The barrel band on heavy recoiling bolt rifles have the sling swivel on the barrel for two reasons also! First is to avoid the sling stud hitting your fore hand under recoil, something that happens often with the sling stud on the fore-end. Secondly the sling attached on the barrel lets the muzzle of the rifle ride lower than your head , like a double rifle, avoiding it hitting limbs was you walk under them.

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Hey Mac,

If ya gotta hold that front sight so high that you can't see the animal anymore, the critter must be at a thousand yards!

Like a lot of other topics, they can be sort of a setup. "Are flip up sights necessary, though I shoot stuff, routinely, out to a half mile?"

If someone is shooting at crap so far away that they need flip up sights they are shooting at crap too far away.

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
Hey Fat Albert, that is my thought exactly. If I take a close shot but then need a quick finisher at 75-150yds then I will probably just do it the old fashioned way of a little more daylight under the front sight and let it rip. Highly doubtful I would ever flip an extra leaf for elevation.

At 75 - 150 yds, no.

Your gun should be aim and shoot at this range.

Past 150 yds - like 200 or 300, then yes,
the flip sights are useful if used as described above by MacD37.


MacD37
Well written. Most people don't know why the sling swivel is on a barrel band.

.

.

quote:

Originally posted by Will:
Hey Mac,

If ya gotta hold that front sight so high that you can't see the animal anymore, the critter must be at a thousand yards!

Like a lot of other topics, they can be sort of a setup. "Are flip up sights necessary, though I shoot stuff, routinely, out to a half mile?"

If someone is shooting at crap so far away that they need flip up sights they are shooting at crap too far away.

As usual Will you miss the point! I've shot some animals at long range with iron sighted double rifles and big bore bolt rifles but I don't think I've even taken a picture with a camera of an animal at 1000 yds!

The "target" is the place on the animal where you want the bullet ot hit him, not the whole animal.

With the flip up at 200 yds or more the target is on top of the front bead! At 200 yds or more with hold over with a 50 yd standing leaf the front bead of most double rifles is bigger than the whole chest area of muledeer, or Kudu! Just hitting the animal is not acceptable, in my view! The only way to place a bullet on an animal at 200 yds or more with a rifle is with a scope sight, or a irons sight blade that is cut for that range!